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  1. #261
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TacTican View Post
    Might even be a gameplay buff. I get that sinking feeling whenever my final PoM Pyroblast doesn't crit, tanking the ignite damage and killing the banked Heating Up! proc.
    Eh. I was never really a fan of it. Having BS is always nice to me, or I might try the (really shitty) IF now.

    Also, how does everyone feel about Combustion glyph change? That's definitely going to nerf lower geared players too, just not lower skilled I guess (which GC apparently thinks are the same; what an asshole)

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  2. #262
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Am I the only one that feels that Mirror Images need to be removed or revamped since it feels somewhat noticeable now a days?



    (This is for ALL Mages, not just the passionate fire mages that are burning the thread at the stake /joke)


    Also, how does everyone feel about Combustion glyph change? That's definitely going to nerf lower geared players too, just not lower skilled I guess (which GC apparently thinks are the same; what an asshole)
    Waiting for the shitstorm. I wouldn't call him an asshole on that cause it's...unnecessary but I still find it amusing it's bad because aren't major glyphs supposed to NOT BE MANDATORY or did that change recently?
    Last edited by Aeluron Lightsong; 2013-07-15 at 07:40 PM.
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  3. #263
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Am I the only one that feels that Mirror Images need to be removed or revamped since it feels somewhat noticeable now a days?



    (This is for ALL Mages, not just the passionate fire mages that are burning the thread at the stake /joke)
    I want it to be revamped. It felt amazing in ICC with the 18% damage buff during the duration

    Otherwise, I keep it as a "oh shit, we're wiping/oh shit, I have aggro, need to use MI" cooldown, EXCEPT for the pull in which I never get aggro because of it

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Waiting for the shitstorm. I wouldn't call him an asshole on that cause it's...unnecessary but I still find it amusing it's bad because aren't major glyphs supposed to NOT BE MANDATORY or did that change recently?
    It may be, but it's kinda truthful. He said he didn't want to nerf lower Fire Mages because of higher Fire Mages, but he's nerfing skilled lesser geared Fire Mages for no reason (purely because he assumed they're lower skilled as well. That's like saying a casual player and a bad player are the same thing)

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  4. #264
    The Unstoppable Force Aeluron Lightsong's Avatar
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    Ok so I'm not the only one upset about Mirror Images. Good to know


    Anyways as for Casual=Bad player. The ironic thing is...that's like a Forum Culture thing. Lots of *whiners* LOVE to confuse that but I digress. As for Mirror Images, I use it as a CD but also incase of shit hitting the fan but it doesn't help that much. Like I said, waiting for the shit storm coming about the Combustion Glyph.
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  5. #265
    I don't know about the combustion nerf, it feels somewhat...unneccesary.
    It only means we have fewer ticks of it (since we are going to line everything up anyway).

    Sure it lowers fire mages overall DPS, but does it really mean we have to have something that makes the specc more clunky than it already is?

    I am not a fan, they really have to think of something better to be honest.

    The PoM nerf is somewhat logical, but who really care about the extra instant pyroblast on higher ilvl. This only punishes lower geared fire mages (those with less crit).

  6. #266
    Quote Originally Posted by Aeluron Lightsong View Post
    Am I the only one that feels that Mirror Images need to be removed or revamped since it feels somewhat noticeable now a days?

    (This is for ALL Mages, not just the passionate fire mages that are burning the thread at the stake /joke)
    Mirror Images have always been an interesting but awkward mechanic, combining some damage output with threat deflection. However, we already have a threat deflection (Invisibility, which also doubles as a mechanic cheeser for some encounters) and some damage CDs.

    IMO: remove the spell entirely and turn it into a replacement level 75 or 90 talent. Passive: You have a chance when casting a spell to generate a Mirror Image (which, however, does not deflect threat), up to three simultaneously. The image inherits your stats, procs, and buffs dynamically. The image casts the same spells that you cast at the same targets for 8% of your damage. Lasts 25 seconds. Active: Siphon magic from your active mirror images, immediately destroying all of them but granting you a spec-specific resource per image (one stack of Arcane Missiles per image for Arcane, one stack of Heating Up! per image for Fire, one stack of Fingers per image for Frost). 1.5 minute cooldown.
    Last edited by TacTican; 2013-07-15 at 07:58 PM. Reason: Clarified the talent somewhat

  7. #267
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
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    Interesting way to tackle Fire issues in the latest PTR build. Very interesting and creative.

  8. #268
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    Interesting way to tackle Fire issues in the latest PTR build. Very interesting and creative.
    Interesting, creative, and overall just an awful way to nerf us.

    Now Combustion gets significantly more annoying because we have to cast it more and usually not have RPPMs line up :\


    I will definitely give them the creative route though. Did NOT see this coming.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by TacTican View Post
    IMO: remove the spell entirely and turn it into a replacement level 75 or 90 talent. Passive: You have a chance when casting a spell to generate a Mirror Image (which, however, does not deflect threat), up to three simultaneously. The image inherits your stats, procs, and buffs dynamically. The image casts the same spells that you cast at the same targets for 8% of your damage. Lasts 25 seconds. Active: Siphon magic from your active mirror images, immediately destroying all of them but granting you a spec-specific resource per image (one stack of Arcane Missiles per image for Arcane, one stack of Heating Up! per image for Fire, one stack of Fingers per image for Frost). 1.5 minute cooldown.
    ..........

    This..


    Is...


    AWESOME.

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  9. #269
    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    Interesting, creative, and overall just an awful way to nerf us.

    Now Combustion gets significantly more annoying because we have to cast it more and usually not have RPPMs line up :\


    I will definitely give them the creative route though. Did NOT see this coming.

    - - - Updated - - -



    ..........

    This..


    Is...


    AWESOME.


    Is very awesome indeed. I would love that.

    And I like the fire nerf, it may bring it down to arcanes level HOPEFULLY. Not even sure though. With all the movement arcane may just end up being completley un-viable and ill have to re-gear all fire anyway Q_Q

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    Interesting way to tackle Fire issues in the latest PTR build. Very interesting and creative.
    I assume this is sarcastic? Otherwise I totally disagree:

    Dev A: What seems to be the trouble with fire mages?
    Dev B: Well Combustion seems to be the big portion of their damage.
    Dev A: Well let it do less damage them,

  11. #271
    High Overlord Huevos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    Eh. I was never really a fan of it. Having BS is always nice to me, or I might try the (really shitty) IF now.

    Also, how does everyone feel about Combustion glyph change? That's definitely going to nerf lower geared players too, just not lower skilled I guess (which GC apparently thinks are the same; what an asshole)
    PoM is still worth taking for fire, mostly because the other two aren't worth much. You gain a couple fireballs over scorches with IF, and you gain maybe a fireball over a scorch with BS since you can move out of the fire faster, but PoM still puts another pyro into your combustion sequence, and often it will give you an extra HU proc as well in your combustion sequence, especially with high crit percentages. Certainly less valuable than before, but I just don't see the value of BS or IF for fire since we have scorch.

    Regarding combustion, I expect people to use it exactly the way it's used now, once every 90 seconds, unless you happen to get a really nice ignite before PoM is ready - though in SoO with the Amp trinket I can't imagine I'd ever use it before it was up. Effectively just nerfs combustion output by 50%, which probably was needed. If they'd nerfed CM instead of combustion, the ceiling on combustion would stay where it is, it'd just be harder to hit. This way the ceiling is lowered, but it's easy to hit. That's exactly what we needed imo.

    Quote Originally Posted by Magicks View Post
    I assume this is sarcastic? Otherwise I totally disagree:

    Dev A: What seems to be the trouble with fire mages?
    Dev B: Well Combustion seems to be the big portion of their damage.
    Dev A: Well let it do less damage them,
    That's obviously not how their conversation went, and you can't seriously think combustion didn't need a nerf. It was the highest damage dealer for us on single target fights with the new trinkets. It needed to be nerfed.
    Last edited by Huevos; 2013-07-15 at 08:45 PM.

  12. #272
    Quote Originally Posted by Huevos View Post
    That's obviously not how their conversation went, and you can't seriously think combustion didn't need a nerf. It was the highest damage dealer for us on single target fights with the new trinkets. It needed to be nerfed.
    Oh I fully agree Fire mages needed a nerf, this one is one of the most uninspiring ones they could of think of, and makes the specc a bit more clunky than it already is.
    Remember when you were sitting on ur Combustion, because RNG didn't line up? Now we are going sit even longer on it, that is waiting till everything comes off CD.

  13. #273
    High Overlord Huevos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magicks View Post
    Oh I fully agree Fire mages needed a nerf, this one is one of the most uninspiring ones they could of think of, and makes the specc a bit more clunky than it already is.
    Remember when you were sitting on ur Combustion, because RNG didn't line up? Now we are going sit even longer on it, that is waiting till everything comes off CD.
    Yes, it feels odd waiting on combustion because using a CD as soon as it's up is so ingrained in the playstyle for dps in general, but the nerf did what it needed. They could have just cut the damage in half again, so it only used 1/4 of your current ignite, keeping the glyph the same, but I think I prefer this.

    What change would you have recommended?

  14. #274
    Quote Originally Posted by Huevos View Post
    What change would you have recommended?
    Well if this is what they wanted to achieve, I would say, let combustion tick every 1,5 sec.
    It's not exactly the same thing (and makes it actually worse than the nerf now), but than it will atleast will feel less clunky.

  15. #275
    Doesn't this combustion glyph change means that you need more trinket procs or chain pryos in a period of time to line up with the additional combustions to get the same effect as the old (or current) glyph?

    Is that not a direct nerf to lower geared mages...? Higher geared mages will have higher tier trinkets, which are going to proc more often - giving them more opportunities to get stronger combustions. They'll also have much high crit ratings, making their ability to set up a stellar ignite much higher.

    What exactly was this change ment to do? Lessen our ability to line up super powerful combustions? So in 1.5 mins instead of one mega combustion, we get one great one and one "meh" one? It seems like this hurts lower geared mages a lot more than higher tier ones, which is contradictory to what GC said they wanted.

  16. #276
    I'm more or less just confused about the "how to nerf high end without nerfing low end mages" thing. Then they do this? Guess he was drunk when he tweeted that or they decided they couldn't come up with anything. Would have been an awesome time to bring in a variable CM that scaled down slowly the more crit you obtained not enough to gimp the spec just enough to curb the insane scaling and keep it in line.
    Last edited by Turkey One; 2013-07-15 at 10:31 PM.

  17. #277
    Quote Originally Posted by Frost1129 View Post
    What exactly was this change ment to do? Lessen our ability to line up super powerful combustions? So in 1.5 mins instead of one mega combustion, we get one great one and one "meh" one? It seems like this hurts lower geared mages a lot more than higher tier ones, which is contradictory to what GC said they wanted.
    Even if that's what it's meant to do, that doesn't seem like the probable result. We'll probably just sit on Combustion for the 22.5s and use it every 90 seconds anyway, just as we do now on live. So what we end up with is one Combustion that doesn't last as long.

  18. #278
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/9485908902#6

    We'll be reverting both of these changes in the next PTR build.

  19. #279
    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    Interesting, creative, and overall just an awful way to nerf us.

    Now Combustion gets significantly more annoying because we have to cast it more and usually not have RPPMs line up :\
    Trinkets are ICD (unless something's changed on the PTR). Should be interesting.

  20. #280
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
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    This is why I FUCKING LOVE LORE.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mastamage View Post
    Trinkets are ICD (unless something's changed on the PTR). Should be interesting.
    http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/264399-severe-nerf-to-pve-fire-mages/

    Already being reverted.

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