Page 15 of 18 FirstFirst ...
5
13
14
15
16
17
... LastLast
  1. #281
    Double Blink glyph is finally fixed, nice! 15cd is just what it needed!

    By the sound of it, PoM is still on the table for some nerfs regarding Fire as Lore insists:
    "We also think that Presence of Mind in particular is just too important to Fire right now. There’s really no choice in that tier – PoM is just too good compared to the other options. We want talents to be a choice."
    They can change it to make spells with cast time less or equal than 3 sec instant to exclude Pyro. Definitely achieves their goal with lv15 talent tier, but would feel awful, hope that's not the route they take. Instead Ice Floes could be buffed, it's kind of useless. I'd like it to become some kind of passive. AM on the move with maybe some drawback (e.g. less movement speed, like old KJC) for Arcane and I've no idea what for Fire/Frost.

    Also it could be reworked into

    Mirror Assistants - create 3 copies of the Mage, that attack the Mage's enemies and assist in casting spells, letting you cast while moving, 30 second duration, 3 min cd, replaces Mirror Images.

  2. #282
    Frost change soon I guess.

    Maticzor @Maticzor
    @holinka is reverting frost mage mastery an option if nothing works? or is it out of the table?
    Holinka @holinka
    @Maticzor we have something we'll be releasing soon for feedback

  3. #283
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Quote Originally Posted by Nightfall View Post
    Double Blink glyph is finally fixed, nice! 15cd is just what it needed!

    By the sound of it, PoM is still on the table for some nerfs regarding Fire as Lore insists:

    They can change it to make spells with cast time less or equal than 3 sec instant to exclude Pyro. Definitely achieves their goal with lv15 talent tier, but would feel awful, hope that's not the route they take. Instead Ice Floes could be buffed, it's kind of useless. I'd like it to become some kind of passive. AM on the move with maybe some drawback (e.g. less movement speed, like old KJC) for Arcane and I've no idea what for Fire/Frost.
    Indeed. DBlink is now a choice between extra Blink or CC removal (and yet everyone called me crazy but it seems Blizzard didn't :3)

    TBH I'm not too concerned with PoM. It's way better than choosing to nerf a damage component or CM.

    Also, if they wanted talents to be a choice, you'd think they'd make RoP/IW more appealing to Fire/Frost, eh? lol.

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

  4. #284
    A simple band-aid fix for RoP would be to double the diameter of the Rune, and/or give the Mage a 5-second grace window where the rune's effects are still active after moving out of it.

  5. #285
    Dreadlord Cycobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In a tree
    Posts
    929
    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    Also, if they wanted talents to be a choice, you'd think they'd make RoP/IW more appealing to Fire/Frost, eh? lol.
    IW is "appealing" assuming you can proc it on CD. Lei Shen HC is actually a good example of this. Stuff like Will of the Emperor HC as well. Rune is also > both on in standstill situations. It's not that they're "unappealing", their uses are just limited.

    Quote Originally Posted by TacTican View Post
    A simple band-aid fix for RoP would be to double the diameter of the Rune, and/or give the Mage a 5-second grace window where the rune's effects are still active after moving out of it.
    Doubling diameter isn't really a band-aid fix it just makes it easier to place "optimally", there will still be movement issues. Personally I would say make it instant cast w/o placement being needed (ie you always drop it directly underneath your Character) and it's enough. Can even give it like, 0.3s activating time or something to make it similar to what it is now - but this way the QoL adjustment would still be good.

  6. #286
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Quote Originally Posted by Serene View Post
    IW is "appealing" assuming you can proc it on CD.
    It never appeals to me except when I want to be lazy. It takes 2 globals for 50s of what one Invocate can do for 60s, in addition to needing weak AoE damage just to enable it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Serene View Post
    Doubling diameter isn't really a band-aid fix it just makes it easier to place "optimally", there will still be movement issues. Personally I would say make it instant cast w/o placement being needed (ie you always drop it directly underneath your Character) and it's enough. Can even give it like, 0.3s activating time or something to make it similar to what it is now - but this way the QoL adjustment would still be good.
    If RoP was instant and had a minor glyph allowing me to place it under my feet, I would probably use it on a lot more fights. Hell, I might even use it more than Invocation because it'd seem more fun than tedious. It'd be a challenge to keep it up rather than an irritating challenge. The cast time alone makes all the difference and having to put down a targeting circle is really stupid.

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

  7. #287
    So I've seen a ton of people claiming fire needs nerfs across the board or in general needs nerf at the high end of raiding next tier. Does anyone have any actual data for this? How far ahead are we compared to other classes (like Boomkins, warlocks, ele shamans)? I don't particularly care for anecdotal numbers. Can someone point me in the direction of videos showing this during PTR testing? Or a few people sitting in a group wailing on dummies and seeing a difference?

    There is a lot of shit going around, some people posting actual numbers. Where are you finding these? And is it from decent players? i.e. not from good mage vs. shitty warlock?

    I really need to get my PTR client fixed T.T

  8. #288
    Bloodsail Admiral Rinoa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    In an igloo.
    Posts
    1,135
    I don't get why Lore says that PoM is a must have for Fire this tier. Granted I haven't raided for almost a month now (I kind of quit. Can't keep up a job, raiding, school and a working social life =P), but I have gotten rank 1 parses on over half the bosses this tier in 10-man Heroic running Blazing Speed on literally everything. I'd even argue that BS > PoM in a great deal of encounters.

  9. #289
    Dreadlord Cycobi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    In a tree
    Posts
    929
    Quote Originally Posted by Rinoa View Post
    I don't get why Lore says that PoM is a must have for Fire this tier. Granted I haven't raided for almost a month now (I kind of quit. Can't keep up a job, raiding, school and a working social life =P), but I have gotten rank 1 parses on over half the bosses this tier running Blazing Speed on literally everything. I'd even argue that BS > PoM in a great deal of encounters.
    WHY HAVE YOU LEFT ME. OMG.

    Something to consider, though, is that because you (did) raid 10M, mechanics were far more important than on 25, 25M PoM > BS (for fire) because Blink > all.

  10. #290
    Bloodsail Admiral Rinoa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    In an igloo.
    Posts
    1,135
    Quote Originally Posted by Serene View Post
    WHY HAVE YOU LEFT ME. OMG.

    Something to consider, though, is that because you (did) raid 10M, mechanics were far more important than on 25, 25M PoM > BS (for fire) because Blink > all.
    Sawwi, real life caught up with me. I've got both a full time job and full time school to attend to so I don't have time for raiding this coming time. It sucks. q.q

    Anyways. It is true that individually it's a lot more important to have movement skills and such in 10 man, which could have skewed the result in BS' favour. I can imagine that PoM would be comparatively more powerful in 25s as the frequency of abilities that force you to respond with an action requiring movement are fewer. My point still stands though - at the very least there is a choice in 10-man. Not only that, but perhaps a stronger alternative.

  11. #291
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Hey, this wasn't said yet, so I decided to go on the PTR and check for the new glyphs and glyph changes, since 5.4 seems to be the Patch of Glyphs.

    The following glyphs/glyph changes ARE implemented in the 5.4 PTR as of right now:

    - Rapid Displacement (2 15s Blinks at the cost of the CC removal). Blink charges cooldown one at a time (as expected), similar to Roll and Death Knight runes.
    -- Blink glyph buffed from 5 to 8 yards
    - Combustion nerf: 50% down from 100% {Lore told us this will be reverted in the next build}
    - Water Elemental glyph (one that allows it to follows you around while casting/increases health) no longer increases the size (and thank Arceus for that one...)
    - Remove Curse buffed from 10% to 15% damage increase for 10s
    - Spellsteal buffed from 3% to 5% health gain

    The following glyphs are NOT implemented, and still waiting to be tested:

    - Feather Fall (feathers dance around you when Slow Fall is on you) [Minor]
    - Water Elemental size changers (One to increase, one to decrease) [Minors] {Note: Decrease one is probably removed since Major WElly glyph no longer increases size}
    - Abolish Curse (remove curses from a target every 5s for 20s) [??]
    - Elemental Familiars (Summons a random Fire, Water, or Nature familiar. Familiars of different types have a tendency to fight each other) [??] {Thought this was a way to get Fire/Nature elementals instead of Water Elemental, but it seems to be another boring minor similar to Conjure Familiar?}

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

  12. #292
    Brewmaster Methusula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    1,303
    Not really sure why the hell they feel the need to add another elemental familiar glyph instead of just altering the one we have now. Who knows, maybe that's the plan.

  13. #293
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Quote Originally Posted by Methusula View Post
    Not really sure why the hell they feel the need to add another elemental familiar glyph instead of just altering the one we have now. Who knows, maybe that's the plan.
    I thought it was to give us a Fiery or Arcane (Nature...?) Elemental in place of the WElly, but it seems more like another stupid minor like the worthless Conjure Familiar glyph :\

    But whatever. Really curious to see how they go about "fixing" Fire in 5.4 without overnerfing it and how they plan to make Frost not a dead spec in every aspect of the game now (except for undergeared raids)

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

  14. #294
    Moderator Shangalar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Rijeka, Croatia
    Posts
    1,977
    Don't get confused by the latest glyph changes please, read and interpret properly - the thing with Mirror Images casting different spells based on spec is already on live and this is a datamining problem of mmo-champion.

    Other than that, the current iteration of Frost Mastery is so weird and I'm quite drunk and also watching NCIS so I'm not focused enough to understand it

  15. #295
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Frostbolt Launches a bolt of frost at the enemy, causing [ 1,728 + 166.1% of Spell Power ] Frost damage and slowing movement speed by 50% for 15 sec. Also causes the target to take an additional 5% damage from your Frostbolt and Ice Lance, and your Water Elemental's Waterbolt, stacking up to 3 times. Mage - Frost Spec. 4% of Base Mana. 40 yd range. 2 sec cast.

    You... You can't be serious, Blizzard. You're still trying to keep this garbage? ;_;

    Curious to see how THIS plays out though:

    Mastery: When you damage enemies with Frostbolt, Frostfire Bolt, and your Water Elemental's Waterbolt, 12% of the damage done is stored as an Icicle with you, for 15 sec. Up to 5 Icicles can be stored at once. Casting Ice Lance causes any Icicles to begin launching at the target. Mage - Frost Spec.

    Are we intended to use IL once we hit 5 icicles, even if we don't have FoF? o_O; I sense a world where we stock up icicles way too quickly because of Wellybolts and Frostbolts, and don't get enough when we get procs on IL. Also, this makes our BFs significantly weaker unless they plan to buff that, too (Ice Lance got buffed to compensate the loss of the previous two masteries)

    Edit: I also just noticed that Frostbolt didn't get compensated in ANY way for the loss of the Frostbolt debuffs benefiting itself, so essentially all of our damage is really going to come from Ice Lances.


    TL;DR:
    - Frostbolt nerfed from not benefiting from its own debuff stacks
    -- Frostbolt stacks ARE STILL STAYING AS OF THIS BUILD (The fuck, Blizzard, the fuck)
    - Brain Freeze nerfed as that Mastery bonus no longer benefits it
    - Fingers of Frost unchanged(?) because Ice Lance WAS compensated from losing the previous two masteries
    - New Frost Mastery that definitely looks interesting and will probably force us to spam a lot of non-FoF'd Ice Lances in PvE now as well
    Last edited by Polarthief; 2013-07-17 at 11:23 PM.

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

  16. #296
    Field Marshal
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Penacova, Portugal
    Posts
    87
    We need data on this.
    Give us data nao!

  17. #297
    Overall looks like Frost nerfs rather than buffs, unless those Icicles end up doing a lot of damage. Losing the damage from Frostbolt and FFB is pretty big, and I don't think the Ice Lance buff(s) make up for that. Don't know what they're planning, maybe this is a multi-build issue.

  18. #298
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylol View Post
    Overall looks like Frost nerfs rather than buffs, unless those Icicles end up doing a lot of damage. Losing the damage from Frostbolt and FFB is pretty big, and I don't think the Ice Lance buff(s) make up for that. Don't know what they're planning, maybe this is a multi-build issue.
    Seems like it. Definitely don't see this alone fixing Frost at ALL (even if the damage is "fine", it won't be that much better than live due to the still poor scaling issue on Crit and Haste)

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

  19. #299
    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    Seems like it. Definitely don't see this alone fixing Frost at ALL (even if the damage is "fine", it won't be that much better than live due to the still poor scaling issue on Crit and Haste)
    Depending on how good this mastery is, mastery could be strong and help the stat capping. They might be on the right track, depending on how this mastery works out but they'll need to buff FFB to compensate for the mastery loss and just remove the frostbolt stacks/maybe buff frostbolt too.

    Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.

  20. #300
    Immortal Polarthief's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    (USA) Florida
    Posts
    7,404
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylol View Post
    Depending on how good this mastery is, mastery could be strong and help the stat capping. They might be on the right track, depending on how this mastery works out but they'll need to buff FFB to compensate for the mastery loss and just remove the frostbolt stacks/maybe buff frostbolt too.

    Hope for the best, prepare for the worst.
    They need to just remove the stacks entirely, buff Frostbolt to compensate (which also buffs the Mastery further), buff Brain Freeze as compensation of losing old Masteries, make this new thing only proc from FB/FFB or FB/Wellybolt, not all three or we'll stack them up way too quickly.

    I really want to know if we're expected to cast non-FoF'd IL in PvE now.

    Retired Veteran Raider: [T14] 10/16H, [T15] 12/13H, [T16] 7/14H
    BTag: Polarthief#1411 (I'll only accept with notice/name is recognizable)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •