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  1. #321
    Legendary! Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by citizenpete View Post
    The Icicles have no GCD, but they are affected by haste. At 0 haste 5 stacks are "fired" in 5s but in 2,5s @ 50% haste. You don´t ever need to cast a non FoF IL, because 1 of the Icicles (the oldest) launches by itself if you have 5 stacks and you gain a sixth. They don´t crit (like ignite)
    I repeat from the other thread, under what testing or source do you have to claim that? You're acting as if you've already tried it and know everything about it.

    If it auto-fires upon gaining a 6th stack, that would indeed be amazing, but that would be highly unlikely. FoF and BF doesn't work like that; Fulmination sure doesn't. Accidentally getting a 4th Shadow Orb or 5th Soul Shard/Burning Ember doesn't either; why would Icicles suddenly be any different?

    Unless you have inside information, please don't act like what you say is fact. Everything everyone else (myself included) has said is pure speculation and opinion.
    Last edited by Polarthief; 2013-07-18 at 01:16 AM.

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  2. #322
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    Answerd it the other Thread ^^ Lhiv wrote a guide and a short Q&A

  3. #323
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    Quote Originally Posted by citizenpete View Post
    Answerd it the other Thread ^^ Lhiv wrote a guide and a short Q&A
    Unless MVPs get early PTR testing, I wouldn't accept his information as fact unless it's confirmed by someone else (granted, even if they DID get early testing, I probably wouldn't trust him either)

    For the sake of pure curiosity, could you post a link?

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  4. #324
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    Just trust me with this and read it on his homepage. I already left a quick feedback:

    I really have to test it, but here are some first and quick thoughts about it:

    Frostbolt debuff for IL and WE not gone is pretty disappointing (So many target switches in SoO so far). Not fun!

    The idea sound interesting, seems like to match our frosty topic

    Casting BF FFB may feel underwhelming now

    As I understand the whole new Frostburn, I don´t have to care about it. "It works by itself"?

    What about opening burst? With tons of FoF Proc and Alter Time? Dunno how this should work - yet!

    Waterbolt tied to the new mastery sound weird and frightening in connection with the 15% debuff (again, target switch!)

    Conclusion by just reading patch notes and your explanation (Thank you by the way): Scaling may adressed, burst is adressed, but one of our biggest issues beside scaling, the debuff and the target switch, are not adressed!

  5. #325
    Legendary! Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by citizenpete View Post
    Just trust me with this and read it on his homepage. I already left a quick feedback:

    I really have to test it---
    Stopped reading here because he didn't even bother to test it (again, if he even has access). How the hell does he know how shit works if he didn't even try it?

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  6. #326
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    No I worte, that I have to test it, because he asked for some feedback. I just left some quick thoughts about it under his article. Go read it and we will discuss it - tomorrow because I have to go to bed now it´s damn late in germany

    http://lhiveras-library.com/content/...g-live-icicles


    Really hope it is not against the rules to post that link. If thats the case, I´m sorry!
    Last edited by citizenpete; 2013-07-18 at 01:29 AM.

  7. #327
    High Overlord Omnink's Avatar
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    The frost changes is a wait and see type of thing because there is a lot to speculate about, but the debuff needs to go and 15% damage should be caked in with Ice Lance/welly bolt. I don't see why we still need to stack a debuff.

  8. #328
    The Icicles hover around the head, kind of like Soul Shards.
    They float in launch position, and when launched, they shoot out of their slots, looking much like little Ice Lances, with a similar travel speed.
    There is some concern that the whole thing is too visually "busy," and the devs are interested in feedback on this point.
    Judging by description it should look awesome! Hope the "too visually busy" part won't lead to bland and almost invisible effects. I like the animation of Soul Shards over the head, so icicles are welcome above mine! =) Want to see a video with animation.

    Q: Are Icicles modified by damage-decreasing effects?
    A: Yes. If your target is taking 50% less damage, it will also take 50% less damage from Icicles.
    /sigh Reduced twice by resilience and other dmg reductions. Might be not good enough for PVP and lead to haste stacking... or Frost sucking...
    Last edited by Nightfall; 2013-07-18 at 01:53 AM.

  9. #329
    Legendary! Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by citizenpete View Post
    No I worte, that I have to test it
    Oooh, gotcha, though tbh, it sounds like something he would have said Still, I'll give it a quick read.

    Quote Originally Posted by citizenpete View Post
    Really hope it is not against the rules to post that link. If thats the case, I´m sorry!
    Shouldn't be. Even if it is, I requested it, so it'd be on me.

    Edit: Q: Do I get Icicles from healing the Water Elemental, which I have named "Squirt" as all right-thinking Mages do?

    *Rolls eyes* Everyone knows the cool Mages name it "Squishy".
    Last edited by Polarthief; 2013-07-18 at 02:22 AM.

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  10. #330
    After reading Lhivs post, I kinda feel that this has potential. I mean, if Blizzard really wanted to, they could tune it so mastery becomes a really powerful stat, which would help us in PvE. Also, I think the mechanics of it could be pretty fun. Frost will probably have even more on demand burst for low-medium health targets that need to die quickly, and managing Icicle stacks could be really fun. Looking forward to at least test it.

  11. #331
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylol View Post
    After reading Lhivs post, I kinda feel that this has potential. I mean, if Blizzard really wanted to, they could tune it so mastery becomes a really powerful stat, which would help us in PvE. Also, I think the mechanics of it could be pretty fun. Frost will probably have even more on demand burst for low-medium health targets that need to die quickly, and managing Icicle stacks could be really fun. Looking forward to at least test it.
    Agreed. I assume Blizzard knows in terms of mages that Frost needs buffing above the other two specs and as such they won't bring us into 5.4 without doing so. It's shitty how with this new Icicle thing rolling out we also see a nerf to Frostbolt, but again I'm assuming Blizzard isn't done with Frostbolt yet or Icicles will simply be powerful enough to make it alright.

  12. #332
    Legendary! Polarthief's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seanothan View Post
    Agreed. I assume Blizzard knows in terms of mages that Frost needs buffing above the other two specs and as such they won't bring us into 5.4 without doing so.
    You haven't been around long, have you?

    That's definitely not the reason they'd leave us hanging, just FYI, but they are at least showing some level of potential here.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Bringing this back up because, according to him (and I'm guessing his insider information), all of this stuff is accurate, and if that's the case, it is, in fact, a +12% damage to FFB, FB, and Water Elemental (because Icicles auto-fire if you gain a 6th).

    What I don't understand is why they would go about doing this because it still nerfs Frostbolt and BF, in addition to them saying they want us to have a "unique mastery that isn't just +Damage". It's unique about how it goes about activating this damage, and hopefully, it looks as cool as Lhivera says, but it's still just a flat 1.5% per Mastery point damage. It does the same thing any +%Damage Mastery does, with the added benefit of looking awesome and allowing a player to launch a few icicles quicker with an Ice Lance (or rather a FoF; we're NOT expected to use IL if non-FoF'd if they autofire)

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  13. #333
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    Because they're not yet done with the numbers and are just testing stuff? Sheesh.

  14. #334
    Quote Originally Posted by Shangalar View Post
    Because they're not yet done with the numbers and are just testing stuff? Sheesh.
    I think if they make it 2% rather than 1.5% per mastery point, that it'd fully solve frosts scaling issue.


    I'm guessing the stat priority in the current 1.5% would be Crit til shatter crap > haste til haste cap with legendary meta > mastery > haste past cap > crit past cap


    However if it goes to 2% it may end up being Crit til shatter > mastery > haste > crit


    I'd still like however for it to be 2% and haste still be strong to a CERTAIN point, because frost should be a fast pace spec. And the icicles only increase that.

  15. #335
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vynestra View Post
    I think if they make it 2% rather than 1.5% per mastery point, that it'd fully solve frosts scaling issue.
    It still wouldn't because other specs/classes scale too good in multiple areas (Fire via Crit and Ignite ==> Combustion for example)

    There's also the issue of target swapping (FUCK THESE STACKS, WHY ARE THEY STILL HERE?!)

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  16. #336
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    Why they kept the stacks is perplexing. My guess is they want to see how IL is in pvp with the buff before they remove it from the frostbolt debuff.
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  17. #337
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtmzac View Post
    Why they kept the stacks is perplexing. My guess is they want to see how IL is in pvp with the buff before they remove it from the frostbolt debuff.
    So why did they keep WEllyBolt on it? Why didn't they compensate Frostbolt so it's actually worth casting in PvP?

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  18. #338
    Mechagnome jtmzac's Avatar
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    Well you're going to do 15% less damage from your IL's in your DF combo if you don't stack the buff. I'd say that warrants casting it.

    Why they kept waterbolt I have no idea. It does make it look like they're rolling out the changes over time and there's more to come.
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  19. #339
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    Quote Originally Posted by jtmzac View Post
    Well you're going to do 15% less damage from your IL's in your DF combo if you don't stack the buff. I'd say that warrants casting it.

    Why they kept waterbolt I have no idea. It does make it look like they're rolling out the changes over time and there's more to come.
    Good luck keeping that up with an 8s duration that also gets instantly removed from dispels, immunities, and other ways to remove a simple slow effect (and there is a PLETHORA of them)

    Seriously, it's not that it SHOULD be removed, it NEEDS to be removed.

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  20. #340
    Quote Originally Posted by Polarthief View Post
    It still wouldn't because other specs/classes scale too good in multiple areas (Fire via Crit and Ignite ==> Combustion for example)

    There's also the issue of target swapping (FUCK THESE STACKS, WHY ARE THEY STILL HERE?!)
    ....3% mastery per point LOL. Omg. We'd be doing 250% of our frostbolts dmg as an icicle xD

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