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  1. #1241
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Do you think perhaps your personal history is coloring your perception here?
    Who's perception isn't colored by personal history? Yes, I know it is.


    Tell me one person that doesn't get upset when someone that has made a rape accusation later changes the story.

  2. #1242
    Quote Originally Posted by ciggy View Post
    Who's perception isn't colored by personal history? Yes, I know it is.


    Tell me one person that doesn't get upset when someone that has made a rape accusation later changes the story.
    Maybe you should try to divorce your personal history from your views regarding women and rape
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  3. #1243
    People like
    Quote Originally Posted by darenyon View Post
    stuff like this is why "Mens Rights" isnt taken seriously.
    Quote Originally Posted by darenyon View Post
    kind of like how mens rights is about male supremacy then?
    Quote Originally Posted by darenyon View Post
    thing is almost all areas where men "dont have equality" originates from patriarchy, which many men fight tooth and nail to maintain (hence all the virulent hatred for feminism). so it has to start with men to stop that kind of thinking by supporting feminism. but they wont cause "feminazis want my testicles" or whatever. So its kind of a catch 22.
    Quote Originally Posted by darenyon View Post
    that 99% of rapists are men, and 90% of those are done to women?

    not really feminism, just facts.

    - - - Updated - - -


    and im not going to call you dumb or incompetant either, just another example of why mens rights isnt taken seriously.
    its all those women and minorities fault.
    who have the unwarranted perception that what they feel is an issue is -the- issue - and that no other issue can be discussed before theirs do irreparable damage to their own causes.
    Not only is it bad for discussion of the topic that they find important; it's also bad for them as people.

    They fall to a point where they feel that their kneejerk emotional responses should dictate how the legal system should handle cases as sensitive as rape.
    They dismiss issues that they deem "irrelevent" - even though those issues are similar to the ones they want to talk about.

    The modern feminist agenda is bogus. It doesn't stop at "equality".
    From modern feminism, you get shit like the Warren Farrel protest
    (I can't post links; sorry - quick YouTube).

    If you want to talk about real issues women have in our society, that's more than fair. It's a conversation many would empathize with and listen to if it were posed in a concise, organized manner.
    But it often isn't. Irrational, emotion-driven ragefests like the Warren Farrel protest in Canada is what modern feminism represents and upholds - and it's despicable.

    If you feel compelled to spout out things similar to the quoted poster, do whoever might read what you post a favor and keep it in.
    Going off about how one movement is a joke (offering nothing to back up your claim) and the other is legitimized is juvenile; and just supports people's already-existing opinions of modern feminism.

    For the record: Modern feminism is damaging to the goals and tenets they claim to be trying to uphold.

  4. #1244
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiili View Post
    The Swedish National Council for Crime Prevention.
    http://bra.se/bra/bra-in-english/home.html
    please when linking be specific "http://bra.se/bra/bra-in-english/home/crime-and-statistics/rape-and-sex-offences.html" is the link you want.
    and also more importantly the thing you want to link to is The Swedish Crime Survey, granted i don't know if that is available in English so I´l give you that one.
    however without knowing the numbers and methodology in question its useless and i forward you to CDC study where 2% is nowhere near accurate.

  5. #1245
    Soki you're being pretty hypocritical
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  6. #1246
    Legendary! darenyon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soki View Post
    People like

    who have the unwarranted perception that what they feel is an issue is -the- issue - and that no other issue can be discussed before theirs do irreparable damage to their own causes.
    Not only is it bad for discussion of the topic that they find important; it's also bad for them as people.

    They fall to a point where they feel that their kneejerk emotional responses should dictate how the legal system should handle cases as sensitive as rape.
    They dismiss issues that they deem "irrelevent" - even though those issues are similar to the ones they want to talk about.

    The modern feminist agenda is bogus. It doesn't stop at "equality".
    From modern feminism, you get shit like the Warren Farrel protest
    (I can't post links; sorry - quick YouTube).

    If you want to talk about real issues women have in our society, that's more than fair. It's a conversation many would empathize with and listen to if it were posed in a concise, organized manner.
    But it often isn't. Irrational, emotion-driven ragefests like the Warren Farrel protest in Canada is what modern feminism represents and upholds - and it's despicable.

    If you feel compelled to spout out things similar to the quoted poster, do whoever might read what you post a favor and keep it in.
    Going off about how one movement is a joke (offering nothing to back up your claim) and the other is legitimized is juvenile; and just supports people's already-existing opinions of modern feminism.

    For the record: Modern feminism is damaging to the goals and tenets they claim to be trying to uphold.
    its not feminisms or feminists fault that men ignore the continued role of patriarchy in damaging men. blame feminists all you like, it doesnt address the problem. nor does victim blaming further mens rights cause in any way.

  7. #1247
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Maybe you should try to divorce your personal history from your views regarding women and rape

    That's just not going to happen. I can't let myself believe you don't realize personal history is what helps us form views.

  8. #1248
    Legendary! darenyon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pebble View Post
    I am in no way trying to diminish the difficulty in coming forward as a rape victim, but consider this... As hard as it is for women to come forth, it's much harder for men.

    We don't get the luxury of being considered liars, we just get laughed at.

    The fact that many women don't report it is basically irrelevant, men don't either (and arguably many more men).
    and mens unwillingness to come forward is the kind of thing that should be addressed by "mens rights" instead of painting rape victims as liars.

  9. #1249
    I am Murloc! Tiili's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goblinpaladin View Post
    please when linking be specific "http://bra.se/bra/bra-in-english/home/crime-and-statistics/rape-and-sex-offences.html" is the link you want.
    and also more importantly the thing you want to link to is The Swedish Crime Survey, granted i don't know if that is available in English so I´l give you that one.
    however without knowing the numbers and methodology in question its useless and i forward you to CDC study where 2% is nowhere near accurate.
    The CDC study is in USA, not Sweden.
    Last edited by Tiili; 2013-07-12 at 09:32 PM.
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  10. #1250
    Quote Originally Posted by ciggy View Post
    That's just not going to happen. I can't let myself believe you don't realize personal history is what helps us form views.
    I try to separate personal history from the data I use to make claims about entire groups. You should try to do so as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  11. #1251
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    <feminist hysteria>OMG, 1/4 of the womenz will experience rape in their lifetime !! This number is soooooooooo huge that i can only deduce that a big percentage of men are rapists, since no rapist can rape hundreds or thousands without being noticed !! OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOGMOGMOGMOGMOGOMGOMGGMO!!!</feminist hysteria>

    Hey, come on, rapists are only a vast minority in the male population, so this huge number makes no sense. But let's agree that those make up numbers are excellent to give the moronic rape culture "theory" some ground and to spread the misandry. If you use your brain power, and apply some logic to this study, you will notice how harmful feminism has become.

  12. #1252
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    I try to separate personal history from the data I use to make claims about entire groups. You should try to do so as well.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Do you think perhaps your personal history is coloring your perception here?
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    Soki you're being pretty hypocritical
    You know, it's funny - with the poster you quoted, you bring up that their personal experience colored their perception - yet with a poster like Tiili, you're fine with letting that slide.

    Do you see the irony there?
    When a person whose view may be skewed from their own bad experience holds an opinion that's congruent with that experience, but they hold the same view as you, it's fine to not mention it, right?

    Maybe you just didn't read Tiili's posts - but it happens all the time with this sort of discussion - where one party calls out the other, but doesn't call out their own party on the bullshit they do.
    Last edited by Soki; 2013-07-12 at 09:38 PM.

  13. #1253
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tiili View Post
    The CDC study is in USA, not Sweden.
    yes and the numbers aren't universal?, do we believe, quoting myself:
    Quote Originally Posted by goblinpaladin View Post
    and where is that statistic from?
    the clear majority of offenders are FEMALE, so either the Swedish girls are either so attractive no one ever says no or moraly superior to American women or more likely you just don't have any real stats.
    so do you believe any of those things i stated?, or have any good of your own? and even more importantly if you say your numbers are universal and thus applicable, why aren't mine?

    ED
    then you numbers are useless (in reply to below)
    ED-2
    since people can either not remember what i wrote on the preceding page or didn't read it the full quote:
    Quote Originally Posted by goblinpaladin View Post
    and where is that statistic from?
    the Holy Grail of feminists seems to be the CDC study shoving 1/4 females being raped, and not getting into the completely retarded methodology and definition of rape,
    "For male victims, the sex of the perpetrator varied by the type of sexual violence experienced. The majority of male rape victims (93.3%) reported only male perpetrators. For three of the other forms of sexual violence, a majority of male victims reported only female perpetrators: being made to penetrate (79.2%), sexual coercion (83.6%), and unwanted sexual contact (53.1%). For non-contact unwanted sexual experiences, approximately half of male victims (49.0%) reported only male perpetrators and more than one-third (37.7%) reported only female perpetrators "

    now keep in mind that their definition strictly limits rape to penetration, a definition no one else shares: The researchers freely admit that they are not using the FBI or any state’s definition of rape.

    but looking at those stats the number of males raped jumps to 1/16 - a Far cry from the reports 1/71 and the clear majority of offenders are FEMALE, so either the Swedish girls are either so attractive no one ever says no or moraly superior to American women or more likely you just don't have any real stats.
    Last edited by goblinpaladin; 2013-07-12 at 10:07 PM. Reason: note at the end

  14. #1254
    I am Murloc! Tiili's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by goblinpaladin View Post
    yes and the numbers aren't universal?, do we believe, quoting myself:


    so do you believe any of those things i stated?, or have any good of your own? and even more importantly if you say your numbers are universal and thus applicable, why aren't mine?
    Definition differs from country to country, some countries don't count rape against your partner as rape. I didn't say my numbers are universal, I said they're specific to Sweden.

    And what do you mean with majority of offenders are female? A big majority of reported rapists are men(98% in Sweden).
    Last edited by Tiili; 2013-07-12 at 09:40 PM.
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  15. #1255
    Quote Originally Posted by igualitarist View Post
    <feminist hysteria>OMG, 1/4 of the womenz will experience rape in their lifetime !! This number is soooooooooo huge that i can only deduce that a big percentage of men are rapists, since no rapist can rape hundreds or thousands without being noticed !! OMGOMGOMGOMGOMGOGMOGMOGMOGMOGOMGOMGGMO!!!</feminist hysteria>

    Hey, come on, rapists are only a vast minority in the male population, so this huge number makes no sense. But let's agree that those make up numbers are excellent to give the moronic rape culture "theory" some ground and to spread the misandry. If you use your brain power, and apply some logic to this study, you will notice how harmful feminism has become.
    What data leads you to think that number is incorrect?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Soki View Post
    You know, it's funny - with the poster you quoted, you bring up that their personal experience colored their perception - yet with a poster like Tiili, you're fine with letting that slide.

    Do you see the irony there?
    When a person whose view may be skewed from their own bad experience holds an opinion that's congruent with that experience, but they hold the same view as you, it's fine to not mention it, right?

    Maybe you just didn't read Tiili's posts - but it happens all the time with this sort of discussion - where one party calls out the other, but doesn't call out their own party on the bullshit they do.
    So unless I also criticize the people you want I the way you want I'm wrong.......k.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  16. #1256
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    So unless I also criticize the people you want I the way you want I'm wrong.......k.
    No. I'm just criticizing you for calling someone who had a bad experience, but on the other side of the table, out - but ignoring someone who is essentially doing the same thing, but who shares your opinion.
    That is hypocrisy.

    It's also an indication of how modern feminism operates - and, when you look at it that way, it makes sense that nobody takes feminism seriously.
    Last edited by Soki; 2013-07-12 at 09:45 PM.

  17. #1257
    Quote Originally Posted by Soki View Post
    No. I'm just criticizing you for calling someone who had a bad experience, but on the other side of the table, out - but ignoring someone who is essentially doing the same thing, but who shares your opinion.
    That is hypocrisy.
    So when someone points out that you're doing in your post exactly what you're attacking the post you quoted for doing your answer is "no u".
    Quote Originally Posted by Nixx View Post
    Everyone is pro-US. They just don't know it yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fyre View Post
    Internet lives in the sky, don't need no cables for that.
    A nice list of logical fallacies. In picture form!

  18. #1258
    I am Murloc! Tiili's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Soki View Post
    No. I'm just criticizing you for calling someone who had a bad experience, but on the other side of the table, out - but ignoring someone who is essentially doing the same thing, but who shares your opinion.
    That is hypocrisy.
    I'm not making ridiculous claims saying that the data provided are false because of various reasons(Not fitting what they believe it to be), most ridiculous one has to be someone saying it was political propaganda when someone provided data and that it was false because of that.

    Like here: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...a#post21728295
    Last edited by Tiili; 2013-07-12 at 09:49 PM.
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  19. #1259
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    What data leads you to think that number is incorrect?
    Well, apparently the study relating to the 1 in 4 women will be raped in there lifetime was hosted in 1985? And it included
    Have you had sexual intercourse when you didn’t want to because a man gave you alcohol or drugs?
    An affirmative counted as rape.

    Which author of the article likened to
    An affirmative answer was counted as rape. In other words, a women who regretted a one night stand after a night of drinking was considered as having been sexually assaulted.
    http://aspiringeconomist.com/index.p...istics-1-in-4/
    http://www.leaderu.com/real/ri9502/sommers.html

    This is just me researching it mind!

    It isn't my personal view.

  20. #1260
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
    So when someone points out that you're doing in your post exactly what you're attacking the post you quoted for doing your answer is "no u".
    I think the modern feminism movement is a shell of its former self; and the MRA movement isn't far behind.
    I don't know where you're getting the notion that I contradicted my point in that post; but you're clearly in no position to call out hypocrisy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tiili View Post
    I'm not making ridiculous claims saying that the data provided are false because of various reasons(Not fitting what they believe it to be), most ridiculous one has to be someone saying it was political propaganda when someone provided data and that it was false because of that.
    Uh, yeah, nobody said that.
    What they -did- say was that people shouldn't wave off false-positives of rape-claims as "never happens" (like you seem to be trying to), because it's definitely a thing that happens often enough for it to be a concern.

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