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  1. #141
    As it is i can see Purified Bindings of Immerseus + Kardris Toxic Totem as the best combo for Fire.

  2. #142
    Quote Originally Posted by Magemaer View Post
    As it is i can see Purified Bindings of Immerseus + Kardris Toxic Totem as the best combo for Fire.
    That'll be best for arcane until garrosh, considering I don't see garrosh dying in our guild for a few weeks probably..And then EVERYONE will want it if it drops...Ugh so annoying. Still need to test though.

  3. #143
    High Overlord Huevos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vynestra View Post
    That'll be best for arcane until garrosh, considering I don't see garrosh dying in our guild for a few weeks probably..And then EVERYONE will want it if it drops...Ugh so annoying. Still need to test though.
    It looks like they really nerfed it though. The int at max stacks is like 5k lower on the heroic warforged version than it was on the normal before they changed it. Disappointing, but probably needed.
    Last edited by Huevos; 2013-08-02 at 03:34 AM.

  4. #144
    Quote Originally Posted by Huevos View Post
    It looks like they really nerfed it though. The int at max stacks is like 5k lower on the heroic warforged version than it was on the normal before they changed it. Disappointing, but probably needed.
    Yeah, but it was a no brainer compared to the other trinkets...It'll still be really good for arcane because you'll be able to get the stacks so fast...but it depends the rppm, the icd on bindings and rppm on the totem may just be better in the long run.



    Got some new, slightly irrelevant results because of the trinkets changing.

    With alpha and omega + bindings

    in 597 seconds, almost 10 minutes I did 122m.

    With alpha and omega + toxic totem

    in 588 seconds I did 119.9m

    This is with full tier 16 mage gear, and the trinkets. Also used pot flask and food, lust both times.

    I think the second test alpha and omega had more up-time, not 100% sure. I know during my burst it proc'd back to back, so it was basically full lust full alpha and omega...really strong.

    I'm hoping with the alpha and omega nerf, and it now being renamed and a drop off garrosh, that it's not nearly as strong and totem's slightly nerfed multistrike with an int rppm proc, and immerseus bindings with icd int TOGETHER are better. Have to wait and see.

    Granted overall essence of yu'lon was 2.1% of my dmg, granted it should be a little higher since it benefits more from bindings than the totem.

    It doesn't scale with arcanes mastery atm, next ptr patch it'll do 200% of sp, which would bring it up to prob 4.2 - 4.5% of our overall dmg, and IF it scales with arcane mastery it would go up further to maybe 7 - 7.5% of our overall damage..Would be nice lol.
    Last edited by Vynestra; 2013-08-02 at 06:25 AM.

  5. #145
    Field Marshal Vouxility's Avatar
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    Trinket Changes

    Kardris' Toxic Totem
    -Equip: 1959 Critical Strike
    -Equip: Your attacks have a 14% chance to trigger Multistrike, which deals instant additional damage to your target equal to 1/3 of the original damage dealt.
    >>RPPM<<

    Frenzied Crystal of Rage
    -Equip: 1959 Mastery
    -Equip: Your attacks have a 3,11% chance to Cleave, dealing the same damage to all other nearby targets.
    -Equip: Yout attacks have a chance to grant 11.761 Intellect for 15 sec.
    >>75 s ICD<<

    Edit:nvm, havent read the posts bevor
    Last edited by Vouxility; 2013-08-04 at 02:47 PM.

  6. #146
    I think the bindings and toxic totem may end up being better for arcane.


    I may need to retract that statement, either I am getting great rng with black blood of y'shaarj or it definitely beats kardis's toxic totem. This is terrible news if it is true, as the trinket off the last boss may be our bis...That sucks majorly. Luckily we'll prob kill it every week once it's down since it'll be the last heroic boss...but it kinda sucks.


    Yeah the testing seems to consistently confirm bindings and black blood of y'shaarj are about 6m dmg ahead of bindings and totem over 10 minutes. Pretty consistently over quite a few tests. Almost every test ends in 122m for the bindings and totem and 128m for the bindings and black blood...every test. Varies a few hundred k, but usually ends in that ballpark every time. I've tested both literally 5 times. This sucks. I don't want the trinket off garrosh to be bis, and I really like the totems multi-strike...but it's just weak.
    Last edited by Vynestra; 2013-08-06 at 03:21 AM.

  7. #147
    Bloodsail Admiral Nathyiel's Avatar
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    A good analysis on Amply trinket: http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/9573278620#5
    The answers is 42
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  8. #148
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    Okay this explains why I only get around 190k PTR on dummies vs 240k on live with frost. Very good analysis. But it is interesting, so many people tend to say frost feels stronger on PTR than on live o_O I gues they are not really on PTR

  9. #149
    Bloodsail Admiral Nathyiel's Avatar
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    It can feel strong when you spam 400k/500k Ice Lance. But there's difference between feeling and being strong.
    Actually, I feel that FoF proc rate is a little low ...

    - - - Updated - - -

    This test was made with T15. It could be a little more with T16 ?
    Was there made with PTR change ?
    Last edited by Nathyiel; 2013-08-06 at 09:49 AM.
    The answers is 42
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  10. #150
    Everyone seems to say that "amplification trinket" is really really powerful.
    If so correct, what about using two of them ?? The intellect one and the "any onther stat" one, just for the sake of having twice the amplification...
    What about this kind of combination ??

  11. #151
    Pls read the link.
    Its really obvious
    Now, I can't speak for every spec, but outside of very heavy aoe fights, 2 amplification trinkets, even with completely useless procs, will most likely be the best trinkets for most specs in the game.

  12. #152
    Warchief Kuni Zyrekai's Avatar
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    They'll get nerfed. Just watch. If a passive is good enough to warrant skipping over a useful proc entirely, it'll get nerfed. Hard.
    Last edited by Kuni Zyrekai; 2013-08-06 at 10:45 AM.

  13. #153
    All they need to do is make all unique equipped or make the healtrinket only work for healers like for example in ToT some procs only work for some classes.
    Or restrict the trinkets to certain classes. I dont think they really nerf them.

  14. #154
    Warchief Kuni Zyrekai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomathan View Post
    All they need to do is make all unique equipped or make the healtrinket only work for healers like for example in ToT some procs only work for some classes.
    Or restrict the trinkets to certain classes. I dont think they really nerf them.
    I don't personally think they have the ability to restrict passives to a spec. They can't class lock them because moonkin/ele/shadow.

    You're telling me with a straight face that for current gear values, something with 3548 secondary stats in addition to the crit bonus, as a passive, won't get nerfed? They could halve it and it'd be an amazing trinket.

    Edit: Mmm, I could be wrong. Amp seems to be a spell effect rather than a traditional +stat. It's still the same spell used across all three trinkets, though. They'd have to duplicate them for each type, str user/int caster/healer, and then restrict that by active spec. I don't know if they can do it, but they likely could if they really wanted to.

    Still, it's attempting to fix an issue that shouldn't exist. The trinkets are amazingly over budget.
    Last edited by Kuni Zyrekai; 2013-08-06 at 11:06 AM.

  15. #155
    Just make the trinkets unique equip and put them all under the same flag like they already do for lfr/normal/heroic rings/trinkets of the same name just different difficulty so that you can't wear two of them even if you wanted to.

    Really though I don't think anything is wrong with a trinket being crazy good as long as it doesn't trivialize the content especially in the last tier of an expansion.
    Last edited by Turkey One; 2013-08-06 at 11:20 AM.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuni Zyrekai View Post
    You're telling me with a straight face that for current gear values, something with 3548 secondary stats in addition to the crit bonus, as a passive, won't get nerfed? They could halve it and it'd be an amazing trinket.
    Should i link you the legendary cloak?
    They could make what they want. If its good or bad is some other question.
    Maybe they nerf it. Maybe they change it to restrict it. Maybe they dont change anything. We dont know. And in the end it doesn't really matter. For the DPS at the end of the fight this is a major part but not the only one. If the success in balancing the speccs with or without 2 AMP-Trinkets then im fine with it. But this is another (and bigger) problem.

  17. #157
    Bloodsail Admiral Nathyiel's Avatar
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    please don't overlook this trinket.
    example: I have 15k haste and 5k mastery (it could be 10k + 10k or any combination)
    15k*1.14=17.1k (+2.1k) & 5k*1.14=5.7k (+0.7k)
    total gain: 2.8k passive secondary stat
    Yes, stat rating have to be taken into account. 1/425 for haste and between 1/300 and 1/600 for mastery, depending on each spec. (frost icicle is currently at 1/342.85, frostburn was 1/300).
    But globally, the gain will be the equivalent for every class.

    The damage crit bonus is more difficult to value but I will try.
    Fire spec have a lot of crit and big number, so it will take full effect of it. Even more, Combustion will douple dip this bonus.
    Arcane spec haven't a lot of crit but every arcane blast that crit will make this forth of it. A 500k AB will crit for 114% resulting in a 1070k damage !!
    Frost spec haven't a lot of crit but 30%/35% of the damage is 100% crit but not for a lot of damage.
    Possible conclusion: Fire gain a lot from this bonus. Arcane and Frost will gain more from the other 2 bonus.

    The biggest advantage of this bonus is it's scaling. But in raw number, it's maybe less than other trinket.
    The answers is 42
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  18. #158
    Warchief Kuni Zyrekai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Turkey One View Post
    Just make the trinkets unique equip and put them all under the same flag like they already do for lfr/normal/heroic rings/trinkets of the same name just different difficulty so that you can't wear two of them even if you wanted to.

    Really though I don't think anything is wrong with a trinket being crazy good as long as it doesn't trivialize the content especially in the last tier of an expansion.
    Sure, that's likely the only way they'd realistically be able to restrict them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomathan View Post
    Should i link you the legendary cloak?
    You're aware that I'm talking about secondary stats using the 553 version's 14% in comparison to Black Blood 572 version's 2339 haste, right? Also that I'm using it in relation to HT15 stats, which means it gets a fair bit higher in the tier it's designed to be used in. There's no way to cut it, it's over budget by miles. I don't care about some arbitrary piece of gear that's got an ilvl 50 higher and has the wrong slot mod. But sure, what's the cloak's secondary total, 2964? Still looking at over 3.5k on the reg version, and I'm not accounting for the crit bonus part of the passive.

    Blizz doesn't like things being over budget. They tend to fix them. I'm simply saying that the most likely course of action will be the amp effect being nerfed fairly hard. Even if gets halved, I seriously would not be surprised in the slightest, because it's still a BiS piece even at that point. Even a shared unique-equipped flag across all the amp trinkets doesn't mean they won't get nerfed. They're too strong. Any trinket that you would blindly use the strength or healer version of simply for the passive gain is too strong. Agi doesn't have one. They'll take one of ours if it's that strong.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Nathyiel View Post
    total gain: 2.8k passive secondary stat
    You just did the math on the 553 reg version, in this tier's gear. Compare that 2/3rds of the passive effect against the passive stats on http://ptr.wowdb.com/items/105648-bl...ood-of-yshaarj

    Consider Blizz's stance on things like trinkets. The passive effect is the same value for any given ilvl, with the exception of stamina. Sure, this one will fluctuate a bit, but 2/3rds of a passive outstripping the HWF trinket's passive that's 20 ilvls higher? No. Just wait.
    Last edited by Kuni Zyrekai; 2013-08-06 at 12:40 PM.

  19. #159
    Bloodsail Admiral Nathyiel's Avatar
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    @kuni: I haven't made the comparison. I was thinking the passive would be a lot bigger.
    But even at 10%, it will be more than 2k at ~550 ilevel.

    Is Amp too big or the other too little ?
    Or Blizzard will use it to help is balance between spec, like they did with Sinister meta.

    But yes, there will be more change.
    The answers is 42
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  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Kuni Zyrekai View Post
    Sure, that's likely the only way they'd realistically be able to restrict them.



    You're aware that I'm talking about secondary stats using the 553 version's 14% in comparison to Black Blood 572 version's 2339 haste, right? Also that I'm using it in relation to HT15 stats, which means it gets a fair bit higher in the tier it's designed to be used in. There's no way to cut it, it's over budget by miles. I don't care about some arbitrary piece of gear that's got an ilvl 50 higher and has the wrong slot mod. But sure, what's the cloak's secondary total, 2964? Still looking at over 3.5k on the reg version, and I'm not accounting for the crit bonus part of the passive.

    Blizz doesn't like things being over budget. They tend to fix them. I'm simply saying that the most likely course of action will be the amp effect being nerfed fairly hard. Even if gets halved, I seriously would not be surprised in the slightest, because it's still a BiS piece even at that point. Even a shared unique-equipped flag across all the amp trinkets doesn't mean they won't get nerfed. They're too strong. Any trinket that you would blindly use the strength or healer version of simply for the passive gain is too strong. Agi doesn't have one. They'll take one of ours if it's that strong.

    - - - Updated - - -



    You just did the math on the 553 reg version, in this tier's gear. Compare that 2/3rds of the passive effect against the passive stats on http://ptr.wowdb.com/items/105648-bl...ood-of-yshaarj

    Consider Blizz's stance on things like trinkets. The passive effect is the same value for any given ilvl, with the exception of stamina. Sure, this one will fluctuate a bit, but 2/3rds of a passive outstripping the HWF trinket's passive that's 20 ilvls higher? No. Just wait.

    We have to keep an eye on it in the next few patches, but this trinket is off the first boss, which almost guarantee's that it'll be highly accessible for spell casters. They've done a lot of trinket balancing, and if it isn't nerfed now I don't think it's going to be. If they don't make the trinkets much stronger than last tier, people won't get the new ones.

    I disagree with how much emphasis they're putting on trinkets, but at this point it's slightly necessary unfortunately. They made the last trinkets pretty strong, so they must out-do the previous ones. I don't see amp getting nerfed, but I do see it being bis for every caster...Like I said it drops off immerseus, so it'll probably be in everyones hands pretty quickly, along with the first heroic boss to die as well. I wouldn't see an issue unless it dropped of like garrosh, where it'd be much less accessible.


    Regarding that post -- How did frost completely die with the rppm change? Also that's really crappy that with the rppm changes we lost so much dps. They did say they were buffing everyone to compensate correct?
    Last edited by Vynestra; 2013-08-06 at 10:55 PM.

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