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  1. #621
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    MOP has the lowest amount of subs of any WOW expansion. Unless you have detailed information why ppl quit... you have no idea if the web based items are part of the reason why ppl lost faith in what Blizzard is doing with WOW atm.
    I was referring to the quality of the expansion, as well as the frequency and size of the updates.

    Also, quitting over a mount of all things is pretty retarded.

  2. #622
    Quote Originally Posted by Anjerith View Post
    I would say that the sparkle pony probably had more of an actual impact on the game than some helmet models for transmogs. I mean, theoretically, the pony could at least be someones FIRST FLYING MOUNT that they didnt spend gold on - thus cheating, from a point of view.
    This is very true.

    Yet people don't complain much about that, do they? Inconsistancy at its finest.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    Not in the last earnings call. They admitted its also lowering in US/EU. Just not as much as in ASIA.
    Extremely minor drop in US/EU, with the vast majority in China.

    Hense relatively constant. Stop trying to twist the facts just because I answered your question.

  3. #623
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    He's not talking about cosmetic items. That's clear from the words 'level playing field' and 'no gold buying'.

    So sorry, you can't use that quote against them.
    Yes we can. They are also adding XP boost and lesser charms.

    Cosmetic items are also crossing the line since a person that pays sub might like to play it because of cosmetic reasons - not based on toping the meters or killing all bosses. And cosmetic can be very flexible. Paid for new emotes ? Paid for new character models? You can't justify one thing with another.

    WOW players should not need to ask or answer ANY questions about cosmetic or boosting items in a subscription driven game. If they have to... the game is no longer driven by principle of a true subscription driven game. And thats when every subscriber has full right to wonder if he should continue to pay the sub. And judging by this topic.... there are some ppl wondering about this. Thats just understandable considering the turn that the game has taken in the last 2 weeks when it comes to basic principles.

  4. #624
    I didn't read all of the 32 pages, but let me remind you:

    http://www.wowinsider.com/2008/02/20...pproach-to-mm/

    I just think Blizzard has a history of going back on their word. Granted, these are cosmetic items, but IIRC I've seen some stuff about XP boost pots, which are the gateway for p2win.

    So no, thanks. I unsubbed, and will not be coming back, because I felt betrayed. Dramaqueen? Sure, whatever you say, but I'll just shift the time I was playing WoW to catching up on other great games. The Steam sale couldn't have come at a better time.

  5. #625
    Subs remaining constant? Maybe a constant downward trickle. I see 4 maybe 5 people on in my real id list out of ~25 on a good day. Anecdotal evidence is anecdotal, though.

    That said, with the trend now leaning more and more toward the cash shop or whatever, I can't help but think that it's a matter of when, not if, WoW goes F2P. Years ago I would've been up in arms over that idea, but at this point, when it happens, it'll be like "what took so long?". Not that I think $15 a month is a lot (it's not).

  6. #626
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    This is very true.

    Yet people don't complain much about that, do they? Inconsistancy at its finest.

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    Extremely minor drop in US/EU, with the vast majority in China.

    Hense relatively constant. Stop trying to twist the facts just because I answered your question.
    PPL complained about the sparkle pony.

    And again.. you can not make a valid point on how big % of the player base that left in MOP did it because of added number of items that have now shown up in Web store or on anything else.

    What we do know is that game has lost 1/3rd of the player base since the web store was added. We just have no clue how many walked away cause of the turn from a subscriber based game into Web store based game.

    And Blizzard is for SURE not going to tell us that ppl are leaving cause of their Web store even if that was the case.

  7. #627
    Quote Originally Posted by Day Dreamer View Post
    See you back next week ?
    Ah, the old "people never actually quit wow" schtick. You might want to look at sub numbers over the past several years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    He's not talking about cosmetic items. That's clear from the words 'level playing field' and 'no gold buying'.

    So sorry, you can't use that quote against them.
    The gold buying line was already crossed.

    So sorry, you most certainly can.

  8. #628
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    Quote Originally Posted by juazlee View Post
    I just think Blizzard has a history of going back on their word. Granted, these are cosmetic items, but IIRC I've seen some stuff about XP boost pots, which are the gateway for p2win.

    So no, thanks. I unsubbed, and will not be coming back, because I felt betrayed. Dramaqueen? Sure, whatever you say, but I'll just shift the time I was playing WoW to catching up on other great games. The Steam sale couldn't have come at a better time.
    You unsubbed over a datamined potion? Nothing actually announced by blizzard? Nice.

  9. #629
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    He's not talking about cosmetic items. That's clear from the words 'level playing field' and 'no gold buying'.

    So sorry, you can't use that quote against them.
    He also said that "Outside resources don't play into it". And that's completely destroyed in WoW. The more money you have in real life the more cosmetic bonuses you can buy. And the more gold you can legally buy via the guardian cub.

    He mentioned no gold buying, except Blizzard has already legalized that via the guardian cub.

    WoW was suppose to be a game that's fair for everyone who played, so that you can't buy your way to more things, cosmetic or otherwise. Now that fairness is destroyed by a sleazy business model that rewards rich people. Why should rich people get more things than regular subscribers, cosmetic or otherwise, in a video game? It's in direct contradiction to Pardo's quote that: "Outside resources don't play into it".

    And as I've said, there's hardly any limits to how far purely cosmetic microtransactions can be pushed: http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...rotransactions
    Last edited by paralleluniverse; 2013-07-15 at 01:11 PM.

  10. #630
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    I sure as hell dont hope they will add items in the store, other than vanity stuff.. Other than that, im fine with blizzard taking $$ for whatever.. No one is forced to play the game if they dont have the money for it.-...

  11. #631
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    Actually, its known why there are low subs. China. A huge number of Chinese players unsubscribed recently, either due to changes in the law (which is common in China, it also happens in between TBC and Wrath for them with the game being offline for near a year) or because there's a huge number of domestically created Free To Play titles available there now.

    Subs outside of China have remained relatively constant.
    What change in the law? The release of Wrath was held up due to Government red tape but WOW was offline for almost a month due mainly to poor planning on the handover from The9 to Netease. If the large number of F2P games were responsible for the loss of players in China why were Netease's other games that use the same payment model as WOW largely unaffected? In fact Netease saw an increase in revenue during 2012 of 12% which they attributed in part to "... the outstanding performance of our self-developed games..."


    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    Extremely minor drop in US/EU, with the vast majority in China.

    Hense relatively constant. Stop trying to twist the facts just because I answered your question.
    Do you have any figures to back this up? Q1 2013 results show that like for like Non-GAAP (which does not defer expansion income) Subscription revenue was 9% down on the previous year which does not support your supposition that the drop in Western markets was "extremely minor."

  12. #632
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    Quote Originally Posted by Day Dreamer View Post
    Too bad all other MMOs out there are garbage. The only quality indicator about them being Horrible Disgusting Garbage - Nice Smelling Garbage.
    Hahaha. That's why they have thousands of users right?

    Anyway, been playing WoW for 8 years, it's getting kind of old.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jessicka View Post
    I'd like to know why. As I already pointed out above, TCG stuff was around long before Rob Pardo made that statement; the cash purchases we had at that point when he made that statement were more exclusive and a lot more expensive. How is their making those things more readily available, and cheaper, making it worse?
    Who said I was happy with TCG getting all the cool stuff?

    But as I said earlier, enough is enough.

    People don't call it quits with their friends over a single disagreement. But there is a breaking point.

  13. #633
    What YOU need to realize is the difference between
    a mandatory fee to be able to play a game.
    an optional fee to make your character look better(taste/opinions apply)

  14. #634
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamez View Post
    What YOU need to realize is the difference between
    a mandatory fee to be able to play a game.
    an optional fee to make your character look better(taste/opinions apply)
    Raid gear is optional too. So is it OK that they sell that?

    And if you don't actually mean mandatory and optional (despite the fact you used those exact words), and actually mean cosmetic and non-cosmetic, then what is the limit of cosmetic microtransactions that you find acceptable?

  15. #635
    Quote Originally Posted by paralleluniverse View Post
    Raid gear is optional too. So is it OK that they sell that?

    And if you don't actually mean mandatory and optional (despite the fact you used those exact words), and actually mean cosmetic and non-cosmetic, then what is the limit of cosmetic microtransactions that you find acceptable?

    raid gear is mandatory to raid properly/effectively.

  16. #636
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamez View Post
    raid gear is mandatory to raid properly/effectively.
    So how do world first guilds raid in the first few weeks of new tiers? Raid gear is NOT mandatory. Many people raid without the best raid gear, like trials to raid guilds. Raid gear is helpful. And I think you should update your words so that they articulate what you really mean.

  17. #637
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    Quote Originally Posted by paralleluniverse View Post
    So how do world first guilds raid in the first few weeks of new tiers? Raid gear is NOT mandatory. Many people raid without the best raid gear, like trials to raid guilds. Raid gear is helpful. And I think you should update your words so that they articulate what you really mean.
    You could argue that raiding itself is optional.

  18. #638
    Quote Originally Posted by paralleluniverse View Post
    So how do world first guilds raid in the first few weeks of new tiers? Raid gear is NOT mandatory. Many people raid without the best raid gear, like trials to raid guilds. Raid gear is helpful. And I think you should update your words so that they articulate what you really mean.
    yeah so let the "world first guilds" raid in PvP gear and tell me how that goes for them.
    better yet, let hem wear tuxedos costumes to make it more "stylish"

    raid gear is mandatory to raid properly, whether you like it or not, (skills also i guess)
    the question (how much raid gear level is required?) ill let you do the speculation depending on a few guilds that are fully heroic geared ready for the next raid tier.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    You could argue that raiding itself is optional.
    by his logic, the entire game is optional

  19. #639
    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    What we do know is that game has lost 1/3rd of the player base since the web store was added. We just have no clue how many walked away cause of the turn from a subscriber based game into Web store based game.
    Wait, I was told by many many reliable sources here on MMO-Champion that all the people who left, did it because of LFR and because Blizzard dumb the game down. Now we're changing it to the web store ?

  20. #640
    Quote Originally Posted by Gamez View Post
    yeah so let the "world first guilds" raid in PvP gear and tell me how that goes for them.
    better yet, let hem wear tuxedos costumes to make it more "stylish"

    raid gear is mandatory to raid properly, whether you like it or not, (skills also i guess)
    the question (how much raid gear level is required?) ill let you do the speculation depending on a few guilds that are fully heroic geared ready for the next raid tier.

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    by his logic, the entire game is optional
    It's not mandatory. Your PvP gear example proves nothing. Some guilds probably could raid in PvP gear, hence proving that raid gear is not mandatory. Some raid guilds can raid by taking off 1 piece of raid gear, again proving it's not mandatory. It's helpful, not mandatory. It is possible to raid without the best raid gear, or having 1 gear slot empty.

    Many people also don't raid, which again shows that raid gear is not mandatory, as you said. So you've misspoke and should correct your statement in order to explain yourself better: that raid gear provides a tangible, non-cosmetic benefit, and selling raid gear would be selling power.

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