What is the tipping point on pay to win in this game?

[cityguy193]

So obtaining gear that others need to pay for for its looks isnt pay to win to a great deal of people.
So isnt the potential leveling of alts faster.

1) What if a year from now, blizzard releases new spell effects that you need to pay for. That does not affect combat.
Or the ability to buy a level 80 new alt, that does not affect combat.

2) What if we took it a step further, blizzard releases new player models, but you need to pay for their use. That does not affect combat.
Or the ability to buy a level 90 alt(when the expansion level cap is 95), That does not affect combat.

3) What if we went further still. Blizzard now releases entirely new races. They revamped racials at this point, so no racial affects combat anymore, and provides a cosmetic distinction. In this way, this does not affect combat
Or the ability to buy a max level alt with max riding. This does not affect combat.

Everyone has their tipping point. For some people it was the gating of minipets a while ago, for some people now, its the selling of gear looks. A year from now we could end up in step 3 and it would still be for purely cosmetic and quality of life changes, but at this point, it certainly feels like pay to win.

[Deleted]

The tipping point was years ago when they added the stupid mount for sale via $.

[cityguy193]

The new upgraded player models being sold only from the item shop would be completely in line with the arguments of those who are defending the upcoming item shop.

Blizzard could do just that, and people would still stick their head in the ground and defend that practice.

[Evil Inside]

With 8 million subs they dont need and I dont think they'd be stupid enough to go to such crazy measures to get money.

[cityguy193]

With 8 million subs they dont need and I dont think they'd be stupid enough to go to such crazy measures to get money.

The sub number is consistently falling. They should be worrying about their shrinking revenue.
And I would argue by slowly introducing these things into their online store, they are making their playerbase docile enough to put these changes in.

[MisterMxyzptlk]

Pay to win means that you pay for the best gear/stats. while all those things would be stupid, they still are not pay to win

[Deleted]

To be fair, allowing people to spend money to be exclusive via mounts or pets etc isn't pay to win.

I could argue that I don't LIKE the fact that they're adding transmog gear to the item shop, or the leveling buff, but I wouldn't say that it's pay to win.

[cityguy193]

Pay to win means that you pay for the best gear/stats. while all those things would be stupid, they still are not pay to win

What if they added the ability to buy Elder charms in the store. You still need to do the content, but you can buy extra rolls for money. It still technically does not affect combat.

You claimed best gear/stats. What if you had the ability to buy LFR gear for money. That isnt the best gear by any metric, and still would technically not be pay to win.

[MisterMxyzptlk]

What if they added the ability to buy Elder charms in the store. You still need to do the content, but you can buy extra rolls for money. It still technically does not affect combat.

still not pay to win

[MerinPally]

"Pay to Win" just by definition of the words means that you get a huge advantage from buying something extra. None of the above suggestions or anything on the store, are similar to this. Therefore, none of the above make it a pay to win system. Pay to play, and pay some more if you like the vanity items or a time save. That's all.

[cityguy193]

still not pay to win

Take it a step further. Now blizzard adds in the ability to select the drop obtained from killing a boss, for money. You can buy your way out of RNG with money. This still technically does not affect combat

- - - Updated - - -

"Pay to Win" just by definition of the words means that you get a huge advantage from buying something extra. None of the above suggestions or anything on the store, are similar to this. Therefore, none of the above make it a pay to win system. Pay to play, and pay some more if you like the vanity items or a time save. That's all.

So you would be perfectly content with every single suggestion?

[Deleted]

First of all, none of these are pay to win, lol.

Second of all, new player models will NOT be sold through the store.

Third of all, just let it go. The store is happening, it's here, and it's not going to be the huge P2W jizzfest you all seem to think it will be.

[PaladinBash]

None of those things impacts the game at any level. I'd even buy all 3 of those things (not the alts coz I like levelling). I can't see how it bothers anyone I'd spend money to get something cool in the game. I'm in Australia so I'd pay double subscription to have actual servers here so I don't have to PVP with 300 ping.

[Lochton]

Please, do a search for already threads of same subject. Just because the title is different, it's still about the same thing. In the end, if the wrong people enter the discussion they will all have the same end statement.

But no, I don't think Blizzard would sell their new models on the store. And the tipping point for me would be if there was sold the new updated race models or buffs (This is not the XP boost I'm talking about - No, real buffs like xx% crit/mastery/haste/spirit/hit so on, or gold).

I'll add to the note of this overused subject already - I do support the store as long as they do not head the way I said. And for now, they haven't nor planning to.

[Lochton]

Take it a step further. Now blizzard adds in the ability to select the drop obtained from killing a boss, for money. You can buy your way out of RNG with money. This still technically does not affect combat

No, but that -IS- P2W, your example pointing that you pay your way out of RNG so you get a certain item. That is basicly like buying the item in the store.

[cityguy193]

First of all, none of these are pay to win, lol.

Second of all, new player models will NOT be sold through the store.

Third of all, just let it go. The store is happening, it's here, and it's not going to be the huge P2W jizzfest you all seem to think it will be.

There is no evidence that says that player models in the future will not be sold in the store. I am not talking about the updated base race models for orcs, humans, etc.
Imagine they release models, such as red outland orc, or wildhammer dwarf, leper gnome, etc. I could see those models easily be sold in the store.

[Lochton]

Famous last words.

You will not believe the amount of people saying "oh its fine gear will NEVER be on the shop" when they introduced mounts.

Suck it to all those people. This is a downwards spiral and if it keeps up I wont be around to experience it.

But, gear still isn't sold in there store. So, I don't really see anything here. What they chose to sell is luxury/transmog/cosmetic, not actual gear that you need.

[dracco4heads]

untill you can pay for an in-combat benefith, and edge over other players, i dont have a problem with it... when you can buy items with actual stats i see it as a problem.

[cityguy193]

No, but that -IS- P2W, your example pointing that you pay your way out of RNG so you get a certain item. That is basicly like buying the item in the store.

How is that any different from buying a max level alt with LFR gear. You get a head start on raiding instead of leveling, so you have more chances to win over RNG.

[Lochton]

There is no evidence that says that player models in the future will not be sold in the store. I am not talking about the updated base race models for orcs, humans, etc.
Imagine they release models, such as red outland orc, or wildhammer dwarf, leper gnome, etc. I could see those models easily be sold in the store.

Special models, yes. I can imagine that in the store, and I don't mind. That's you wishing to be special, so you may as well suck it up. Base models on the other hand, more important tihngs, I don't think they would touch the store.