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  1. #1

    "Players rarely argue for less convenience." - Ghostcrawler

    This has to be the most infuriating tweet I have ever seen from Ghostcrawler

    Either the community managers are doing an atrocious job, or the designers are pretending complaints don't exist

    I mean, players have been complaining about WoW being more and more casual-friendly since WoTLK, complaining about its accessibility and convenience. This story really begins with the implementation of LFD towards the end of WOTLK, then flying mounts in cataclysm, and finally LFR. Dozens of LFR threads are made weekly, how come players rarely argue for less convenience?

  2. #2
    Honorary PvM "Mod" Darsithis's Avatar
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    A small vocal minority has been complaining. The vast majority has not.

  3. #3
    Because what is happening on the forums is a miniscule part of the whole picture, but it is all that you see.

  4. #4
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    There might be some who complaing about lfr and such but they're not as common as complaints about inconvenient things.

  5. #5
    yes, like 1% of the playerbase have been complaining about wow being too casual. the rest is totally fine with it.

    blizzard dont care about some whiners on the offical forum/mmo champ.

  6. #6
    Look at it this way, if you have encountered 100 complaints about a feature on a forum, in your experience that's alot, but really it's a very small minority. Also, people who have something to complain are more eager to post it on a forum then people who are a fan of something in the game.

    It's also why it's so funny most people who create such complaint threads think they are stating bold facts, while really mostly these complaints are a people issue, and not a game issue. This ofcourse does not go for all complaints and it's all very subjective in the end.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Birkhoff View Post
    Either the community managers are doing an atrocious job, or the designers are pretending complaints don't exist

    I mean, players have been complaining about WoW being more and more casual-friendly since WoTLK, complaining about its accessibility and convenience. This story really begins with the implementation of LFD towards the end of WOTLK, then flying mounts in cataclysm, and finally LFR. Dozens of LFR threads are made weekly, how come players rarely argue for less convenience?
    Or perhaps you are doing a terrible job at perception. Just because you see people complain on WoW forums, MMO-Champ forums, etc does not mean a lot people are complaining. For instance let's say wow has 8million people, 1million between various forums (for instance MMO has ~372k). Now if every single one of the 1 million people complained you would still only have 12.5% of the people complaining about this. Would that 12.5% be worth it to drastically change things back when the remaining 87.5% are content?

  8. #8
    Hey just wondering, how is it they can measure the 1% when the vast majority don't even give feedback at all?

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Darsithis View Post
    A small vocal minority has been complaining. The vast majority has not.
    QFT. There is a ton of stuff to do, all of it is not easy.

  10. #10
    The problem with LFR complainers is that most of them are casuals themselves, as it makes no sense why somebody in a hardcore guild would care about what goes on in LFR.
    Most people would rather die than think, and most people do. -Bertrand Russell
    Before the camps, I regarded the existence of nationality as something that shouldn’t be noticed - nationality did not really exist, only humanity. But in the camps one learns: if you belong to a successful nation you are protected and you survive. If you are part of universal humanity - too bad for you -Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Birkhoff View Post
    This has to be the most infuriating tweet I have ever seen from Ghostcrawler

    Either the community managers are doing an atrocious job, or the designers are pretending complaints don't exist

    I mean, players have been complaining about WoW being more and more casual-friendly since WoTLK, complaining about its accessibility and convenience. This story really begins with the implementation of LFD towards the end of WOTLK, then flying mounts in cataclysm, and finally LFR. Dozens of LFR threads are made weekly, how come players rarely argue for less convenience?
    The only people doing this are the people who get mad enough to figure out how to use the forums. No one is going on there saying how much they like the changes, they just play the game.

    They have more metrics than you or I, the fact is is the same people have been working on the game since BC. Like it or not, they are the same exact people that made the game people remember so fondly that dislike it now. They obviously know what they're doing.

  12. #12
    If you count all the "real" wow players, the ones that actually made it to max level, played for more than a couple of months, dont just use it as Habbo Hotel (I.E they actually play the game). I think it is alot more of the % of players that dislike conveinence than some people think.
    Of course convenience is a broad term. Personally I think alot of people hate what LFR has done to the game. at least 25% of real players would argue that I reckon.
    www.twitch.tv/xchrispottertvx
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  13. #13
    Brewmaster xindykawai's Avatar
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    People need to understand that usually people will speak to complain, rarely to tell they like something, they would most likely get bashed by haters right after it ...

  14. #14
    What about the 4 million players that left WoW but don't bother to complain?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrispotter View Post
    If you count all the "real" wow players, the ones that actually made it to max level, played for more than a couple of months, dont just use it as Habbo Hotel (I.E they actually play the game). I think it is alot more of the % of players that dislike conveinence than some people think.
    Of course convenience is a broad term. Personally I think alot of people hate what LFR has done to the game. at least 25% of real players would argue that I reckon.
    What exactly has it done to the game? You know, aside from adding an option that nobody is forced to do.

    Nothing? Then I doubt it is anywhere near that high of a percentage, since there is no real reason to want it removed.

    And to answer the thread, I imagine he likely discounts these whiny posts because they are completely baseless.

    Also, make no mistake, you guys are a very loud vocal minority, not anywhere near the majority.

  16. #16
    GC is pretty oblvious to anything anyone wants in this game. The design team has shown over the years that their idea is the only way. Just read the piles of dev responses on MMO each news post, and it's basically "No, you're wrong, we don't see this as an issue".

    Less convenience? No one would argue for that because people want things to be easier. Well, here you go, 3 years later, this is the game THE COMMUNITY has asked for.

  17. #17
    Deleted
    So apparently people on the forums only account for a small minority of the playerbase? Well then why on earth did blizz listen to the forum complainers in 4.1 and decide to nerf all the heroics...

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Birkhoff View Post
    I mean, players have been complaining about WoW being more and more casual-friendly since WoTLK, complaining about its accessibility and convenience. This story really begins with the implementation of LFD towards the end of WOTLK, then flying mounts in cataclysm, and finally LFR. Dozens of LFR threads are made weekly, how come players rarely argue for less convenience?
    I hear people complain about LFD, but yet those same people don't form their own groups and fly out to the dungeons. It's really hard to take people who complain about flying and yet see them sitting on their Lost protodrakes at the AH door.

    I haven't read anyone ask for 2 hour hearthstones, the removal of first aid or for first aid to take 3-5 mintues to apply. I don't see people asking for only 1 graveyard at the bottom of valley for the entire map. I only see a tiny percent of the raiding community ask for heroic only raids. I do see a handful of people complain about Heirloom gear, while wearing heirloom gear.

    So I'll hand the mic over to you. Can you give me us you top 20 list of inconveniences you like to see added to the game. If you could be bothered, could you explain why you believe those items would be awesome for everyone and will increase sub numbers 100% ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kuel View Post
    So apparently people on the forums only account for a small minority of the playerbase? Well then why on earth did blizz listen to the forum complainers in 4.1 and decide to nerf all the heroics...
    Who said they only listen to the Forum complainers? Who said they didn't listen to the un-subscribers ?

  19. #19
    Honorary PvM "Mod" Darsithis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kuel View Post
    So apparently people on the forums only account for a small minority of the playerbase? Well then why on earth did blizz listen to the forum complainers in 4.1 and decide to nerf all the heroics...
    Because they have access to far more data than you do which includes how many people drop from groups, how many groups failed to complete the dungeon, the average run time of the dungeon, and the mechanics players tried to skip. It was based on that that they made their changes.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Birkhoff View Post
    What about the 4 million players that left WoW but don't bother to complain?
    How do you know they have something to complain about? Maybe they just grew tired of the game, or they found another game, or they havn't time/money to play anymore.

    You dont have to hate/dislike a game just becuase you leave it.

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