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  1. #261
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    It has been my experience that most people are incapable of this.



    Absolutely. People will always form opinions about something. It doesn't matter whether someone's opinion is a product of a vivid imagination or cold hard facts, that opinion will govern their behaviour.

    There is world of difference between saying:

    "Cash shops are bad because the service they offer is not in the interests of the players",

    and saying:

    "Cash shops are bad because people are stupid and will react badly to them."


    I think that objectively the items being offered by the cash shop will add a lot of value to the game for a lot of people, and hence are a good thing. That being said, I do agree that the backlash from paranoid, irrational people who fear all sorts of crazy outcomes from this feature, could end up causing more harm than the good done by the feature itself.

    This, by the way, is not the fault of the cash shop....
    No - it would be fault of Blizzard if they came out talking about paranoid irrational people acting like they didn't care one bit.

    We are yet to see how Blizzard is going to implement this shop. True... How are they going to connect new currency with real money will be one of the big question. s

  2. #262
    For me, it all really boils down to a simple fact:

    Quite a few people are unsatisfied with Blizzard's performance regarding some areas of the game (content design, quality, longevity etc.). Thus, I have good reasons to believe that subscription money mainly funds projects X and Y and not WoW. With cash shop it gets even worse - I have no reason to believe that subscription money goes anywhere else than funding Project X and Project Y *as well as* making more stuff for cash shop! For me that's an unacceptable practice and that's why while I'm perfectly OK with sub-based game, I'll never support game that double (triple-, quadruple-) dips.

    In my opinion, most people defending such 'corporate business decisions' are very shortsighted and unable to connect the dots.

  3. #263
    I still don't really see what's wrong with the store. I wouldn't buy anything other than pets or mounts, unless they brought out something really awesome, but as long as the store doesn't feature anything game-changing, like super epic gear, then I don't see what the problem is. If some players want to spend their money on things like that as well as subscriptions, let them.
    It's so simple: if you don't like something, don't buy it. So far, nothing that's been brought out is a game-changer. The closest they've come is the experience boost potion, but if some players want to race to max level to be able to raid and PvP at a high level, then let them. Personally, I enjoy the levelling process, so I won't be buying the pot until I get sick of it, which would usually be level 60-85.

    I'm not noticing the game suffer at all due to the store. Designing silly crowns is as useful as designing silly mounts, but they don't change anything. So perhaps we end up with fewer mounts obtainable in-game because they were put in the store instead - but the way I see it, if these mounts weren't designed for the store, they probably wouldn't have been designed at all. It's not as if they design a set number of mounts a Quarter and then say "right, we've got our 10 mounts. But instead of adding 3 of them to the game in either raids, factions or achievements, let's put them in the store instead" - if not for the store, those 3 mounts wouldn't have been designed. We're not missing out on any content because a single mount or a single crown was designed.

  4. #264
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    Quote Originally Posted by baal-80 View Post
    I'll never support game that double (triple-, quadruple-) dips.
    So, you've already quit your account at least two years ago?

  5. #265
    Quote Originally Posted by Mekh View Post
    $15/month is a non issue to a single person. $15/month times the number of western players plus whatever the asians do is a figure I'd like keeping on my budget aswell if I was Blizz, because people would obviously have to be buying items for $15/month so the whole thing doesn't turn into a loss - and the only way to make people buy stuff at that rate is what you obviously oppose: making at least some of the items mandatory.
    Exactly. If paying the sub fee keeps the item shop from being P2w then everyone should support the sub fee. If you have ever actually played a P2w game they are very expensive. The sub fee also keeps out trolls from making new accounts. It also keeps out entitled freeloaders. St least with the sub fee if you choose not to buy from the item store, they will still get your sub. People should not expect to play a game for free.

  6. #266
    Quote Originally Posted by Nivis View Post
    So, you've already quit your account at least two years ago?
    That's correct. I unsubbed at the end of WotLK.

  7. #267
    Quote Originally Posted by baal-80 View Post
    In my opinion, most people defending such 'corporate business decisions' are very shortsighted and unable to connect the dots.
    In my opinion, people against the store see dots which doesn't even exist...

  8. #268
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    I have another option than not just buying stuff from the store. I have the option to not pay the sub in the first place.
    And this makes sense why? Why would stop playing a game you enjoy, because of the addition of things you don't need, have no effect on you, and never had in the first place?

    You may convince yourself and even a few others that this is a "principle" worth fighting for. But that "principle" just makes flat out no sense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    How mandatory it is to buy stuff doesn't matter.
    Actually, it is everything. When something feels mandatory, it becomes a grudge purchase and generates feelings of resentment toward the game. As long as those who aren't buying the items aren't feeling like they are losing out, there is no real reason to feel resentment.

    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    There is not a single in game cash shop game that charges players sub fee and then has in game cash shop as well.
    So what? How is this even relevant? Do you think that telling the Wright Brothers "there is not a single person who has successfully flown in a flying machine" would have been a good reason for them to give up on the idea?

    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    Those games have the decency to let the in game chash shop pay for the service of using those items... whenever they want. Thats just a fact that you or Blizzard can not ignore. Consumers have every right to demand BLizzard doing the same if they add in game cash shop.

    And Mister...it does NOT matter how mandatory the store is IF players are asked to first pay for the box + the expansions + sub. There is not a SINGLE game out there today that has mandatory clause that you have to buy and item in the store before login in. Every person in the world can try out every game and just see how mandatory the ingame store is. Many of them allow for perfectly acceptable enjoyment for free and even have means of allowing players to change to ingame shop currency without spending money.
    The only pertinent question here is what exactly has actually changed by them adding a few items to the cash shop? If someone was ok with what they were paying Blizzard before these announcements, I see no logical reason to be unhappy now.

    They are not taking anything away from anyone. You will still get everything you would have got without the cash shop. Worst case scenario: It makes zero difference to you.

  9. #269
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    Quote Originally Posted by d3v View Post
    How does leveling faster equal pay2win? I'm intrigued.
    How does it not ?
    Sure, you cant buy level 90....just yet.... keep being intrigued and you'll see in 6 months

  10. #270
    Quote Originally Posted by Wanko View Post
    In my opinion, people against the store see dots which doesn't even exist...
    Fair point. I might be wrong, of course. The thing is, I have principles in life that I stick to and one of them is 'never bend over to a corporation' (more or less).

  11. #271
    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    How does it not ?
    Sure, you cant buy level 90....just yet.... keep being intrigued and you'll see in 6 months
    The XP buff would just mostly be convenience, because it's not like you could get RaF before now and use that to level characters.

  12. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by baal-80 View Post
    That's correct. I unsubbed at the end of WotLK.
    Yet you still care enough to follow the game so many years later, despite not even playing it.
    Blizzard really must have gotten you hooked.

  13. #273
    Quote Originally Posted by baal-80 View Post
    Fair point. I might be wrong, of course. The thing is, I have principles in life that I stick to and one of them is 'never bend over to a corporation' (more or less).
    If the things were mandatory I would understand your point, but with what we know so far it's just TCG type crap. Now if they start selling heroic level gear then that would be an issue.

  14. #274
    Quote Originally Posted by Nivis View Post
    Yet you still care enough to follow the game so many years later, despite not even playing it.
    Blizzard really must have gotten you hooked.
    I expected such a nonsensical, completely irrelevant reply You have a problem with that or you don't believe me? Want me to link my battlenet profile or something?

  15. #275
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    Quote Originally Posted by Duster505 View Post
    No - it would be fault of Blizzard if they came out talking about paranoid irrational people acting like they didn't care one bit.
    Blizzard are in a bit of a bind here. They announced a cool new feature and got a reaction they didn't expect from a small, but vocal, minority. Blizzard's failing is that they didn't anticipate this irrational, paranoid response. Nor can they rebutt it properly, because doing so would simply add more fuel to the fire. I think from a PR perspective they probably just need to ride this one out and hope that the voice of reason eventually triumphs on the forums.

    The real fault of course lies with the knee jerk response of a small group of people who never thought this through before opening the throttles on their flamethrowers. It would be a sad day indeed if paranoia was to win over reason and logic.

  16. #276
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    Blizzard is more or less soulless now. They are literally a machine that blindly chases money. No "thought process" required. Just crunch the numbers and pick the one that is the largest.

    I'm not using the term just as rhetoric.
    Yeah and that's why they're pumping out more content/features in the next patch than ever before? i'd say alot of the money goes back to the consumer in form of new content or future games, you think they're "blindly chases money" just to gather one big pile? and not using it to make more content for the consumers? right...
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  17. #277
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    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    How does it not ?
    Sure, you cant buy level 90....just yet.... keep being intrigued and you'll see in 6 months
    Levelling faster during the first (few) week(s) of a new expansion would be pay2win. The ability to level faster at the moment is nothing more than a quality of life upgrade for people who, for whatever reason, have sub-level 90 characters they want to get to level cap.

    Ultimately, the term winning implies some sort of a contest, and if you haven't hit level 90 on your main 7 months ago already, you were never in this contest to start with.

  18. #278
    Quote Originally Posted by Raelbo View Post
    Blizzard are in a bit of a bind here. They announced a cool new feature and got a reaction they didn't expect from a small, but vocal, minority. Blizzard's failing is that they didn't anticipate this irrational, paranoid response. Nor can they rebutt it properly, because doing so would simply add more fuel to the fire. I think from a PR perspective they probably just need to ride this one out and hope that the voice of reason eventually triumphs on the forums.

    The real fault of course lies with the knee jerk response of a small group of people who never thought this through before opening the throttles on their flamethrowers. It would be a sad day indeed if paranoia was to win over reason and logic.
    If reason and logic are to win this... Blizzard needs to admit like very other F2P game out there has done - that having both ingame cash shop and mandatory sub is not acceptable way to treat consumers.

    I am actually very surprised how civil the debate about this cash shop is on both official forums and other fansite forums. We have always seen armies of fanboys defending whatever actions BLizzard takes and using totally un-logical arguments. There is plenty of them here as well. But there are ppl that do understand how these things work and are realising like you say - that Blizzard can not do whatever to make money and think the subscribers will just keep paying.

    To me Blizzard is not in any bind. WOW has ALWAYS been sub based game. If few % of the player base is demanding in game cash shop... then Blizzard should come out and simply point out what WOW has always been built around. But if Blizzard wants to add ingame cash shop they simply will have to change the entire business model of the game... with ingame currency that is directly connected with real money like all the F2P games are doing. That is a big step and acting like the BLizzard Web store is the equal in range and scope is just a joke. We all know that.

  19. #279
    By over using the other paid services we told blizzard its ok and they explore new ways of earning money. Ofc its our fault.

    If we never used realm transfer, name change and faction change. Or never bought lame ass pets from the store we wouldnt end up with a p2p game with a f2p store. Which is were we are headed now

  20. #280
    Quote Originally Posted by Malkazam View Post
    Well.. Exp boost interact directly with the gameplay so.. I'm not sur this isnt P2W
    Experience boost is also something you can earn in the game, through heirloom armor and farming Krol the Blade. As a store item it's kind of a waste for anyone but new players who don't have a max level main. Remember those? Would sure be nice to see some again...
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