flexi ilvl 540 confirmed

[Karon]

I think they know that Horridon was a massive mistake, it was imo was the worst tuned second boss in the history of WoW.

We where stuck on it for 8 weeks.

It has been nerfed 3 (4?) times already.

Since we killed it we have killed a new boss every single week since (and this week we had a < 10% wipe on DA).

Horridon was overtuned, but after the first nerf it was ok. Hard, but ok.

I am pretty sure they are never going to do that again (they have said as much).

They said the exact same thing about one class only legendaries. That was before Dragon Soul.

Please don't think they do what they say.

They say what you want to hear from them, nothing more.

[RickJamesLich]

I thought blizz said they weren't going to set it up so normal and hardcore raiders would have to run LFR or flex.... when flex drops stuff that's better than the previous tier's heroic gear.... looks like they changed their minds and didn't say anything to anybody.

Blizz being blizz I guess lol.

[Frozenbeef]

I'll stick with LFR, having the ability to queue whenever i want to just totally beats out any benefits from normal/flex/heroic for me :P

[RickJamesLich]

inb4 heroic raiders cry that their 543 loot is worse than 548 loot XD.

srsly, can't wait for it.

Congratz, you can get decent gear now with no effort once again lol.

[Osmeric]

They've said chances are upgrades won't be around when 5.4 launches.

So, what are we to spend VP on when 5.4 releases?

I see myself playing the game a whole lot less, if VP suddenly becomes worthless.

[Mad_Murdock]

If there's one crowd that doesn't really complain about gear it's HC raiders, they just go for the best out at the time. Gear QQ is normally from normal raiders and PVPers.

Slight correction there. You don't complain about gear, unless some unworthy filthy casual is wearing something that looks similar. Then you light up the forums with how they "didn't earn it!" :P

I'll stick with LFR, having the ability to queue whenever i want to just totally beats out any benefits from normal/flex/heroic for me :P

Well, for Flex raids, I would hope you would be enticed to do it because it's aimed at being easier than normal and is aimed at letting folks run with their friends without having to overly worry about raid comps and such. Guilds can now carry the players that can't quiet cut it in normal, but are fun people to play with.

[Pitkanen]

I thought blizz said they weren't going to set it up so normal and hardcore raiders would have to run LFR or flex.... when flex drops stuff that's better than the previous tier's heroic gear.... looks like they changed their minds and didn't say anything to anybody.

Blizz being blizz I guess lol.

Well, I would go with blissful ignorance. 1,000 people saying... we won't get our raid all the trinkets/tier we need from normal by the time you unlock Flex... doesn't accomplish much. Really no delayed time table will work. We only saw 2 normal caster lei shen trinkets in the first 8-10 weeks of farming...

[heltvild]

Yeah no way that will stick - the presumption is normally that LFR gear would be tuned around what an average player would need to start killing things in normal. It should be at most 522 so as not to just automatically make ToT irrelevant.

So you want the Flex gear to be 522 and LFR to gear to be what? 510?`10 ilvl upgrade from last lfr?

[Floopa]

Congratz, you can get decent gear now with no effort once again lol.

I'm a heroic raider and my average item level is 547 (because Lei Shen refuses to drop his healing trinket >_>).

[Count Zero]

So, what are we to spend VP on when 5.4 releases?

I see myself playing the game a whole lot less, if VP suddenly becomes worthless.

There will be a valor dump. Blizz may be a lot of things, but one thing it's not is stupid enough to have literally nothing to spend your valor on (not counting old-tier valor gear).

It will either be upgrades for a valor gear vendor. Possibly both, but I think just one is fairly likely. They just haven't decided yet. I think a lot of it depends on whether 5.5 is actually a (minor) content patch with the lore-follow up, valor upgrades turned back on, and possibly some other catch-up mechanism (maybe one or two heroic dungeons that drop 516 gear from all the bosses) or an extended pre-NewXpac patch (as in, just a lore follow up from the SoO fallout, then the actual pre-NewXpac patch being 6.0)

[Embermoon]

If normal is 553, and flex is 540, then it stands to reason (to me), that LFR would be 13 ilvls lower, at 527, especially if there is no gear upgrading for the rest of the expansion. Then again, they may just come along and bring upgrades back out, for 5.5, so that guilds can finish up with experiencing all of the raid content.

[bennafflock]

I think it's a little ridiculous, that flex raids will be getting gear almost equivilent to my BiS gear from this tier, just by going in and killing some bosses, tuned lower than normal modes

[NeverStop]

Eh 540 Flex makes gearing up alts a lot easier.

[Nobleshield]

Slight correction there. You don't complain about gear, unless some unworthy filthy casual is wearing something that looks similar. Then you light up the forums with how they "didn't earn it!" :P

The people saying this usually aren't even real hardcore, they're midcore wannabes who are better than average but nothing compared to the top guilds. I have never ever seen anyone in a legit top-end raiding guild (e.g. Paragon, Method, Blood Legion, etc.) come and spout the whole "Filthy casuals don't deserve gear" and "LFR should be removed/drop no loot", it's always some wannabe.

[Embermoon]

The people saying this usually aren't even real hardcore, they're midcore wannabes who are better than average but nothing compared to the top guilds. I have never ever seen anyone in a legit top-end raiding guild (e.g. Paragon, Method, Blood Legion, etc.) come and spout the whole "Filthy casuals don't deserve gear" and "LFR should be removed/drop no loot", it's always some wannabe.

Agreed. I've only ever seen true top-players highlight issues regarding class or boss mechanics. Even that wasn't so much complaining, as it was giving feedback to Blizz, for how to better tune the game.

- - - Updated - - -

I think it's a little ridiculous, that flex raids will be getting gear almost equivilent to my BiS gear from this tier, just by going in and killing some bosses, tuned lower than normal modes

When that time comes, you'll be decking out in 553 gear, looking towards 566, when they're still working on 540 gear. Why does that have to be ridiculous?

[Mad_Murdock]

The people saying this usually aren't even real hardcore, they're midcore wannabes who are better than average but nothing compared to the top guilds. I have never ever seen anyone in a legit top-end raiding guild (e.g. Paragon, Method, Blood Legion, etc.) come and spout the whole "Filthy casuals don't deserve gear" and "LFR should be removed/drop no loot", it's always some wannabe.

Someday when I have enough energy to care, I might set out to monitor the forums and take note of the progression of the complainers. I normally just roll my eyes and go on. Personally I don't think you'll see a top10-20 guild bashing LFR runners and such, because it might offend some of their fan base. But I have to imagine some of their members have opinions about it.

I think it's a little ridiculous, that flex raids will be getting gear almost equivilent to my BiS gear from this tier, just by going in and killing some bosses, tuned lower than normal mode

T14N dropped 496, T15 LFR dropped 502. What's the difference ? Someone getting gear slightly better than last tiers BIS really isn't that bad, they are still behind the new BIS. I'll admit I'm only looking at this from a very selfish perspective. I don't have to run last tier to gear up alts. If Flex stays close to what they are aiming for, people will have to at least try to kill the bosses, versus show up and AFK. Granted, the better guilds will probably still be able to carry 1-3 folks, but that's always been the case

[stryfe1]

Taken from WoW Insider (http://wow.joystiq.com/2013/05/20/pa...h-ghostcrawler)

Ghostcrawler states: "Our current plan for 5.4 (which I'm probably not supposed to talk about at all yet) -- is that there won't be valor vendors, and the upgraders will just stick around. There will still be some alternative ways for players to gear who don't want to go into raids, but we'll see. That's our plan for now, we might also have them go away again when 5.4 launches, then come back again."

Obviously he is stating that it could be either, but current plans are for the valor upgrades to still be around in 5.4

So there will be something worth spending valor on.

[Deleted]

Flex raid is basicly the same as LFR. If you have any interest in the game avoid it.

[Deleted]

Heroic raiders won't seek themselves to Flex. Perhaps the first 2-3 weeks to get the OP trinkets, but not for any other reason. Item upgrades will probably not be available the first few weeks anyways, so 540 is worse than 541 (except the OP trinkets).

[unholyness]

A wild guess, based on what has been said by developers previously, is 528.

GC said it would be 528 lfr, it was 536 for Flex but the baddies whined that they should get higher ilvl gear even though flex will be a joke,Normal is 553 Heroic is 566

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I think they know that Horridon was a massive mistake, it was imo was the worst tuned second boss in the history of WoW.

We where stuck on it for 8 weeks.

It has been nerfed 3 (4?) times already.

Since we killed it we have killed a new boss every single week since (and this week we had a < 10% wipe on DA).

I am pretty sure they are never going to do that again (they have said as much).

You should see the PTR then, some of the first bosses are harder than horridon lol. It isnt the fights it is the player base as a whole that is bad making fights harder than they really are.

- - - Updated - - -

Congratz, you can get decent gear now with no effort once again lol.

It doesn't matter how much gear they get. IF anyone has raided with a bad player, you can gear them all you want and they will still pull horrible numbers and stand in fire, Gear doesnt fix stupid.