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  1. #101
    Herald of the Titans Injin's Avatar
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    Classic wow was piss easy, anyone could do it IF they had enormous amounts of time to throw at the game. That's why it was so popular.

    Now that wow is more like an arcade game with rpg elements, it's less popular.

    Gear caps can be overcome by anyone with time to spend (i.e. fire res gear farming, simple patchwerk bosses that just need more number output to beat etc). Skill caps are naturally exclusionary because if you don't naturally have the skills you are SOL on doing current content. A player who hits a gear wall just thinks "ok I go farm some more and come back" but a player who hits the skill cap goes "oh well, lets find a new game."
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  2. #102
    The Patient Arainie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mad_Murdock View Post
    You can cut the grass with a pair of scissors or use a lawn mower. Does using the pair of scissors really feel more rewarding ? You can walk to school up hill in the snow both ways or you can ride the bus. Does walking up hill feel more rewarding ?
    Now see, that's where we who liked how gaming was more in the past greatly differ in opinion. I cycle 6km to work and 6km from work every day because I feel good about it. I could take the bus or a car if I had one, money isn't the issue in this case. I rarely even consider taking a bus if cycling is an option, because hell I like the fresh air and the little workout I get every day even though I'm an active football/soccer player and visit the gym regularly.
    Translate this in to gaming and you might just understand how some of us feel. I want the ride there to have at least some speed bumps and left turns, because quite frankly it feels completely unrewarding to roll downhills on a straight road and be rewarded for just getting to the end. You could argue that I could build my own speed bumps and turn between the right and left lane to get some action, but that's not really the same thing.

    Now, my post is not directed at MoP, it's directed at gaming in general. It's directed at how everything's become so optional (read building your own speed bumps), and how the new generation shun mandatory challenges as a result of this. In WoW, can practically stand in a capital and be teleported to your dungeons and raids all day long, sit half AFK in them and still receive the same reward as those who commit energy and not only time in to it. If you don't force what you may call a challenge upon people, many will take the lazy way with the least effort. In fact, most will since it's in our human nature.

    It's great that there are optional things in-game as well for those who don't enjoy raiding and PvP, but when everything's optional even for a Heroic raider (please, don't read hardcore world first competitor) it's gone a bit too far in my opinion. You can boost your chances of loot by coins you get from dailies, and reputation might sometimes be nessecary, but everything else is thrown at you, even money for flasks and food these days. I enjoyed the nature around how raiding was in the past, the ritual of preparation that caused social gatherings in guild chat and on ventrilo. Everyone simply raidlogs these days and you don't see much of people.

    Guess why? Well everything's optional, so they say "screw this" and log off!

  3. #103
    And yet when Blizzard puts a purple ring behind a daily grind that takes 15 mins a day for 15 days the hardcore raiders throw a shit fit that they had to do something beyond plunging into a never ending cycle of dungeons. Oh and it was Blizzards fault for putting it there and not their guilds fault for demanding that they get that ring.

  4. #104
    The Patient
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gimlix View Post
    People who casually play will only experience the standard stuff and those are indeed not challenging for most of the people that play World of Warcraft.
    But those who take their time in the game notice that there is hard stuff out there, Heroic Raiding isn't a facepalm at all.

    That's why WoW is so great, you got Gameplay for Casuals and for Hardcores.
    One big world
    This, definitively this.
    There's still a sense of achievement to gain in the game.
    The thing is, before, achievement was measured by the "uniqueness" of the gear. Now achievement is measured by ilvl.
    For me at least, achievement is measured by the efforts I made to clear an encounter. Memories are all I need to feel epic in my level.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    Is taking a tram up to the top of a mountain as rewarding as hiking it? Does driving a car up a long steep hill feel like as much of a challenge as riding a bicycle up it?
    And there we have our fundamental questions. What am I doing ? Why am I doing it ?
    Your mowing the lawn. WHY ? If you're goal is to build stronger hands and forearms, then Scissors is clearly the correct answer. If your goal is to cut the lawn and get back to something more important (to you) then the lawnmower is the correct answer.

    Why am I hiking the mountain ? Is it to get dire needed medical supplies ? Then I'd say the Tram is your answer. Out for the view and exercise and conquer it ? Then Hiking is the correct answer.

    The problem we have in WoW,is you(not you personally) want to apply your reasons for climbing the mountain to my reasons. You climbed the mountain with no shoes, wearing speedos and believe that's how everyone else should do it. I want a coat, boots and someone to serve me hot coco every 30 mins. You demand I complete the climb in under 8 hours, I want to take 45 mins breaks and read the paper.

    So you have your savage manly man way of climbing that mountain and I have my guided tour, won't break a nail way. What's wrong with that ?

    Now see, that's where we who liked how gaming was more in the past greatly differ in opinion. I cycle 6km to work and 6km from work every day because I feel good about it. I could take the bus or a car if I had one, money isn't the issue in this case. I rarely even consider taking a bus if cycling is an option, because hell I like the fresh air and the little workout I get every day even though I'm an active football/soccer player and visit the gym regularly.
    Well, I say you're a lazy sissy who is spoiled rotten!(not really) I had to walk 10 miles, in the frigid cold and I never complained! These days you kids sit on your fancy little sissy bikes that weighs less than 10lbs, wearing your sissy helms in case you fall off. In my day we had two round 500lbs stones and a stick and that's how we traveled! If we fell off, we cracked our skulls and died and we were happy! That's how real men do it!

    You see we can play the old man's "Back in my day, we had it worse" all you want. You choose to Bike because you enjoy it, would you enjoy walking those distances ? In a suit and tie, in the summer, if there is no showers available ? Once upon a time people may have enjoyed endless grinds because at the end of it, it felt good and rewarding. Others, and I guess we can just generically say "These kid today", don't see the value in doing something "just because" Maybe they have it right and don't waste gaming time doing boring grinds for minor rewards.
    Last edited by Mad_Murdock; 2013-07-23 at 08:38 PM.

  6. #106
    Well of course making the game easier is wrong, no need for an essay or 22 page thread.

    Easier means no reward system and that's why we play the game in the first place.

    Thank you.

    ps if you don't play for that then we need to find you another game.

  7. #107
    Mechagnome Kuel's Avatar
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    I agree with the OP. Wrath created the 'Wrath Babies'. Blizzard is catering to the players that started in Wrath, Cata and MoP. That's the new direction for the game. I, personally, don't enjoy it, however, I do enjoy WoW at it's core and that's why I still play. If blizzards design plan fails (Unlikely) then they will change it accordingly...

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