Storm, Earth, and Fire advice (what macros and UI set ups are you using?)

[Grubjuice]

I just swtiched to from BrM to WW for the first time last night; and I am trying to get ideas for an optimal set up for Storm, Earth and Fire.

The most I have done so far is set up my WeakAuras to show one parenthetical marker '(' when i have one spirit up, and a second parenthetical marker ')' as well when i have two spirits up, but I still need some help using the ability:


1) Is there any addon or WeakAura set up that will allow me to keep track of which targets my clones are attacking (especially in AoE situations where my own target might die, and i need to switch targets; i don't want to accidentally switch to the targets of my clones and harm my dps).

2) I have a /cancelaura macro to drop both clones on demand, but is there anyway to cancel one clone without canceling both clones? (do i target the target of my clone and press SE&F to cancel just that one clone and not the other?)

3) Are you using Mouseover macros or are you tab targeting or are you manually target switching to apply clones to different targets?

[Beertholomew]

Here is my WA for SEF. Don't remember where I originally got it from, with some minor tweaks. It makes the two bars on the lower right.

Edit: NM found the author: Ròxy@Spinebreaker-EU (Shamarox@mmo-champ)

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[Ph0tek]

Are there any fights where its actually a dps gain to use this ability? I tried h-Tortos without it, and I actually gained dps on the bats. Maybe just because of more time AoEing instead of blowing 2 GCDs on setting up the clones? I sometimes use it on the last door (or maybe 2 doors, depending) on h-Horridon. I haven't really gotten a good measurement for whether that's a dps gain or not. I don't always get to do it because sometimes the DPS requirement on the adds is higher depending on raid comp.

Either way, I'm still not a really big fan of this spell.

[Grubjuice]

Generally speaking two GCDs spent while you are actually running toward the the targets is no particular opportunity loss.

Also clones can jump to targets allowing you to cleave to an suddenly emerging add in one gcd.

I think the spell needs to some revision, but I am a big fan of this spell. Especially since it harkens to the Original Chen Stormstout ability in the Rexxar bonus RPG.

[Daws001]

I recently switched to my neglected WW offspec (MW) and yeah...the ability is weird. I tried using it on trash in LFR last night and it was a hot mess. I used a mouseover macro but I had targeting issues. Turns out a few times I didn't get the clone on the intended target and it was attacking the same one as me. Le sigh.

It is a cool ability but I guess I need more practice with it.

[Grubjuice]

i don't like using mouseover macros for targets that move. Generally mouseover macros work great with static raid frames but not with nameplates that are constantly wibbly-wobbling all around the screen.

I am going to take Beertholomew's Weakaura string and adapt it. that at least will really help me avoid accidentally dps the same targets as my clones and will allow me to track when their targets are about to die.


I will probably stick with Tab Targeting > Manual target switching for now.

[Chiasmus]

I wrote this macro for when I was progressing on Council of Elders heroic so that I could stay on Sul and interrupt while also DPSing the empowered council member:

#showtooltip
/cancelaura Storm, Earth, and Fire
/cast [@mouseover] Storm, Earth, and Fire

What it does is kill any of your currently active spirits and places a new one on your current mouseover target. You don't have to use mouseover targets, but it makes it a lot quicker to get the spirit up than manually switching target, casting it and switching back (you also lose auto attack and Tiger Strikes damage on your current target by doing that). If you use boss frames you also take out the danger of using your Storm, Earth and Fire on the wrong mob.

Using boss frames on Council of Elders heroic meant that I could switch my clone onto the current empowered council member with only one GCD and button press. The downside to using this alone is that you can only have one spirit up at any one time, so I created another macro without the cancelaura in it to place a second spirit.

#showtooltip
/cast [@mouseover] Storm, Earth, and Fire

Finally, a neat way of removing them without having to spend a GCD on casting the spell again is just to use a cancelaura macro on its own.

/cancelaura Storm, Earth, and Fire

Unfortunately if you have two spirits out there's no way to just remove one, however if you use the first macro I posted you can get rid of both spirits and place a new one out in one GCD and button press rather than several.

The biggest problem with the spell is that the spirits, like you, have a melee range requirement on the spells they cast. This means that if the mob moves, it'll take a short while before they react and won't cast any spell during that period. It also applies for spells like Fists of Fury, where they'll keep channeling it if the mob moves away until you yourself stop. Due to this, they don't give you as much DPS as you might expect. It's particularly frustrating to cast a supercharged Rising Sun Kick, only to watch your two spirits chasing after their mobs rather than casting the spell.

There aren't that many opportunities to use Storm, Earth, and Fire in Throne of Thunder, with the only one pretty much being Council of Elders. You can use it on Iron Qon's Quillen, as well as on Twin Consorts during phase three (though make sure to cancel the spirit when Tidal Force or Nuclear Inferno are being cast, since they won't do any damage during them), though you should only do this on farm when you don't need excessive DPS focus on particular mobs.

[Grubjuice]

If you use boss frames you also take out the danger of using your Storm, Earth and Fire on the wrong mob.

Using boss frames on Council of Elders heroic meant that I could switch my clone onto the current empowered council member with only one GCD and button press. The downside to using this alone is that you can only have one spirit up at any one time, so I created another macro without the cancelaura in it to place a second spirit.

what is Boss Frames?

- - - Updated - - -

I often use [mod] modified macros and something like:

/cancelaura [mod] Storm, Earth, and Fire
/cast [@mouseover] Storm, Earth, and Fire

would allow me to Cancelaura or not Cancelaura as i saw fit.

[Chiasmus]

It's part of the default UI, whenever you're fighting against a raid boss you should see a unitframe for the boss appear (normally on the right hand side of the screen). You might have disabled it or are using a custom UI that has it disabled.

Highlighted it in the screenshot below:
http://i.imgur.com/FIGKIY1.jpg

Using modifiers would also work yeah, it's just preference.

[Grubjuice]

ooh yeah I use those, they are not disabled i just didn't know that's what you meant.

[MasterOutlaw]

I use a mouseover macro for casting them and the addon Storm, Earth, and Fire to keep track of them.

[Callypso]

Are there any fights where its actually a dps gain to use this ability?

DPS gain =/= optimal playstyle for your raid, but forgetting that for a moment:

- Horridon doors: Depending on your assignment this can be a dps increase, but it's mostly padding the meters. Not recommended.
- Horridon last phase (one clone on Warlord, you on Horridon). Again, Not recommended.
- Council: Definitly an dps increase. I use it on Warlord/Mar'li while dps'ing Sul fulltime. (note that this will likely change the order in which the bosses get empowered as Mar'li will be on lower hp than mr Cannonball)
- Tortos hc: Assuming you're killing the bats and you don't have too many people bursting them down together, as that will reduce the time you're AOEing devalueing the casts. Situational
- Durumu hc: Icewalls maybe? We have mages/locks in our setup that pretty much make the walls implode instantly, so I usually don't really bother trying to DPS the walls.
- Iron Qon hc: Last phase. Again would only recommend this for farm kills.
- Twins hc: phase 3. Again... only for farm kills.

[Yxiomel]

I use a mouseover macro for casting them and the addon Storm, Earth, and Fire[ to keep track of them.

I use this addon too, it's pretty nice. I use it in conjunction with a macro similar to Grubjuice's, but with nomod in beside the mouseover.

[Pandimus]

#showtooltip Storm, Earth, and Fire
/cast [target=mouseover] Storm, Earth, and Fire

[Totaltotemic]

My biggest problem with SEF is that it's technically very clunky. The idea is great, but the spirits have a host of problems such as:

Ability lag (extremely obvious if you try to spam SCK immediately after another SCK)
Dying (why do they even take aoe damage in PvE?)
Separate buff/debuff tracking (TP into RSK must happen with a spirit up before it starts doing real damage, it's a DPS loss until that happens)
Movement (like most pets, it takes them a second to go and they seem incapable of using abilities while moving)
Inability to cancel just one of two Spirits
Pet positioning (always outermost part of hitbox, meaning trying to AoE with them often leads to mobs on the other side of the pack not getting hit)
Annoying GCD/energy cost (burst equal to 60% of your normal damage costs 1 GCD + 10 energy, 1 chi for TP, then 2 chi for RSK before everything else does decent damage)

and my favorite

Spirits continue to exist for up to 5 seconds after their target has died, continuing to debuff you unless you extremely micromanage a /cancelaura Storm, Earth, and Fire macro.

All of these things added together essentially make them only useful on stationary targets that will exist for 15+ seconds that also don't put nasty things on the ground that the Spirits like to step in. It's also only good for single target cleave, not for buffing AoE. This is why Council is basically the only fight in the tier in which they are useful.

[Deleted]

I'm not using it at all in pve. It has some uses in pvp to prevent someone from capping a flag.

Summoning the clones wastes too much time and the stuff dies too fast anyway.

[Frogged]

Generally speaking two GCDs spent while you are actually running toward the the targets is no particular opportunity loss.

The problem isn't the GCDs in some cases, but the fact that the clones aren't very intelligent. On Lei Shen, they will run away from the boss so you cannot use them for SCK on adds. The same thing happens on Tortos. On Ra-Den or Council, the clone won't be able to follow the target enough to actually copy the majority of your skills.

The skill is amazing in theory but in reality it falls short and can even result in damage losses.

OT: I use a mouseover macro and a cancelaura macro, mousing over nameplates to place clones, when I do use them.

[Delekii]

It's great for tanking mobs while you pickup quest items and run away!

[Grubjuice]

It's great for tanking mobs while you pickup quest items and run away!

laziness! Or as Scrooge McDuck would say "work smarter, not harder"