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  1. #21
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    Yeah I imagine we'll be pretty overgeared for it now as well - if we don't have to level Overcharge additionally in P2, then major bonus; I'll amend the guide at that point as most people working on it will be 540ilvl minimum by now I'd have thought.

    Thanks for the info Sagerz.

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  2. #22
    You level overcharge for the same reason you level dif chain, because boss takes a lot more time to be burned down from 66 to 30%. In my view leveling overcharge is the harmless thing you can do. It is something that doesnt hit your raid, and the extra overcharge will never be on the same platform, so you will just have overcharge on all 3 quadrants. Sparing energy off from bouncing balls is better, as this dmg is unavoidable. If you are starting to progress now, it might be easier to start 3 healers just to do the transitions, but 2 makes p3 shorter, and p3 is a bitch with 3 healers, unless you have a dk. Anyway if u have the dpsers i will suggest you dont even try with 3, since with gear now if u go 2 healers you should kill the boss in the first few tries you go into p3.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Tishko View Post
    You level overcharge for the same reason you level dif chain, because boss takes a lot more time to be burned down from 66 to 30%. In my view leveling overcharge is the harmless thing you can do. It is something that doesnt hit your raid, and the extra overcharge will never be on the same platform, so you will just have overcharge on all 3 quadrants. Sparing energy off from bouncing balls is better, as this dmg is unavoidable. If you are starting to progress now, it might be easier to start 3 healers just to do the transitions, but 2 makes p3 shorter, and p3 is a bitch with 3 healers, unless you have a dk. Anyway if u have the dpsers i will suggest you dont even try with 3, since with gear now if u go 2 healers you should kill the boss in the first few tries you go into p3.
    Funny, we considered going 1 healer. There's literally no damage until p3.

  4. #24
    Pandaren Monk
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    Doubt we'll spend much time on him, if anything at all.
    But this guide was just top notch, already linked it to my members incase we do decide to progress him
    Kudos<3

  5. #25
    Field Marshal Zyphenz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by oggyowl View Post
    Funny, we considered going 1 healer. There's literally no damage until p3.
    Considered the same . Was basically only the stacking lightning debuff inbetween platforms that did damage.

  6. #26
    killed him last night - 2 healed, did not level overcharge. had to slow down in p2 before 2nd transition to avoid pushing while bad things happened.

    dps is a non-issue in this fight

  7. #27
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    Hey, Excellent guide, will be pulling out some tips and strats from it to use ourselves.

    I was hoping to get some overall advice. We've been having trouble.. a lot of trouble with the first transition. We've tried 2/2/3/3 as well as 1/3/3/3 and we always seem to get the worst RNG on the platforms with 2 or 1. (Having helm, + double bouncing + diffusion chain on a pala + hunter platform will usually kill the hunter (me))

    Here are some logs of the fight, and last nights stream can be found below as well. Looking for any advice on how we can get past this fucking shitty transition.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/zl0scopr5hmnazyf/ - 1/3/3/3 setup for transition.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/660y4z2o7uihxvsh/ - 2/2/3/3 setup

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/frzaoq7pf75letba/ - 2/2/3/3 as well.

    Stream - http://www.twitch.tv/x_levante_x/b/438257967

    Our available setup comp wise.

    Prot Pala
    Prot War
    Blood DK

    Resto Shaman
    Disc priest / Resto Druid

    Hunter x2
    Warlock
    UH DK
    Mage
    Arms warr
    Elemental Shaman

    I'd really appreciate any advice that anyone has. I really feel like we should be getting past the transition after over 60 wipes. We've seen p2 maybe 5 times for no more than 10-20 seconds..

    Thanks,

    Dév

  8. #28
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    UPDATE:
    We started on him this reset and got a couple of nights in.

    On the 50th wipe we hit phase 3 for the first time, albeit with a lot of dead raid members from the 2nd transition. We've hit it a couple of times again since then, with the same issue on the second transition.

    We 2 healed on the first night, then due to availability 3 healed on the second night - this gave us a lot more room for error with sorting out the lightning orbs during phase 2, which took us about 5 phase 2 attempts to get pretty solidly. The only pain was that it was very very tight on the DPS to do it without leveling Overcharge once we stopped using Heroism to smooth the phase out. We'll be going back to 2 heal tonight so should be looking at more consistent second transition wipes.



    DEVBOY:

    The first transition is still a little shaky for us, even with phase 2 looking quite solid at this point. The transitions are definitely the toughest part of the fight - once you get each main phase under control it's rinse and repeat, the transitions have a lot of RNG and require quick thinking and very good movement!

    We have done 2 setups that have both worked decently during the first transition:

    1/3/3/3
    Night #1 (2 tank/2 heal) - Prot Paladin / Prot Warrior, Elemental Shaman, Hunter / Fury Warrior, Frost DK, Monk / Disc Priest, Mage, Boomkin

    Night #2 (2 tank/3 heal) - Prot Paladin / Brewmaster, Disc Priest, Hunter / Fury Warrior, Frost DK, Monk / Disc Priest, Mage, Elemental Shaman


    The 2nd night worked a lot better, with a healer in each quadrant making it easy to control. Going back to 2 heal tonight, I'll have to make sure that the quadrant without a healer is made up of people that can all immune Static Shock, to negate the danger there.

    Running 1/3/3/3 is very simple, as long as your tank has sufficient speed increases to be able to get helm of command and still get at least 1 Bouncing Bolt if 2 spawn, but also enough healing that they can pick up a Bouncing Bolt add and drag it towards a quadrant with a healer without dying. I play a Prot Paladin, Speed of Light + Nitro Boosts stack, allowing me to actually run against the Helm of Command current if required for a Bouncing Bolt.

    Unfortunately I can't watch your stream until I get home tonight, to see exactly what kind of things were causing you the biggest issue.

    For progression purposes, as far as I know Blood DK is the most limited class with regards to movement speed, so for that reason alone I'd take the Prot Warrior for higher utility. One thing I would say, is that when we switched to a Brewmaster, Provoke increases Lei Shen's speed between pylons which makes the stacking damage a total joke, they also have awesome speed utility and if you are running a /sit spamming Prot Paladin, you could easily use a less geared alt just for taunts, brief periods of tanking and then off tank dps. If the damage you're getting from stacks in between pylons isn't a big deal, don't worry about it though! (In summary, for the transitions, a Prot Warrior is probably more useful, Heroic Leap is particularly strong).

    I'd strongly suggest running Disc Priest as one of your 2 healers - Pain Suppression is useful to let the Prot Paladin stand in shit and /sit for mad DPS and HPS and the shields are very useful during the transitions to give people something else to protect them before their health pool gets eaten away! A Resto Shaman in combination with this should also work well with the +hp buff they give.

    Let me know if there are any other specific scenarios such as the hunter/paladin, I'll have a think on them.... also - as long as your Prot Paladin can get to at least 1 of 2 Bouncing Bolts and then sprint to get the 2nd Bounce whilst picking up the add, there isn't really a reason not to do 1/3/3/3 as it makes it easier for the other quadrant. If they aren't an engineer, then I'd suggest picking up Swiftness potions in addition to Speed of Light to use for that purpose. Additionally, to help solo a quadrant, a Warlock portal from Pylon to Lei Shen on the solo quadrant gives significantly better odds of survival if something goes wrong with helm! Make sure any adds that do spawn from bolts are dragged near to another quadrant for dispels and to get the tank topped up again, but don't get pwned by Overcharge coming from another platform.

    Make sure people are very close together when Overcharge is going to be targeted to keep it in as predictable and confined area as possible. There could be scenarios where you can stack for Overcharge to be placed, spread for Diffusion Chain and then restack for the Overcharge explosion, but this requires very good coordination for a marginal gain in control, so it may be better to just stay fairly close but safe for Diffusion Chain, then stack on whoever for the Overcharge (but only once the adds are in).

    Helm of Command is always going to throw a spanner in the works - with sufficient speed increases on the Helm player, the other people on that quadrant should be able to run on top of them if Static Shock needs to be soaked rather than immuned - just remember to get straight back into position afterwards! This does mean that you don't have to risk soaking Static Shock with 2 players mitigation free, but requires pretty high speed increases from the Helm player and very well could coincide with 2 Bouncing Bolts.

    Take as many Static Shock immune / 90% reduction classes as you can, at which point it becomes significantly easier - some classes can only solo soak if on the same quadrant as a Disc Priest or Holy Paladin (absorb shields ftw), Ele Shaman with full health and Astral Shift+Shamanistic Rage + shields can survive a solo Static Shock, but any of those aspects missing will probably result in death! Deathknights can't reliably solo soak even with AMZ, unless they are topped up and ideally with additional shield. Warriors aren't great either to be honest!

    Comp wise, I would take as many ranged DPS as you can (of the comp options you've suggested)- whilst it does mean you have to be more careful with Diffusion Chain (especially in P2 where you need to stack for Lightning Orbs spawn straight afterwards), Warrior/DK aren't great SS soakers. That said, we are running Warrior/DK and it's working okay, but it would definitely make life easier if we were running immunity classes instead.

    Suggested comp:
    Prot Paladin
    Prot Warrior

    Resto Shaman
    Disc Priest

    Hunter
    Hunter
    Warlock
    Mage
    Ele Shaman
    1 of Warrior/DK

    Is the Disc Priest / Resto Druid the same player? If not, you could drop all melee for an evening and just focus on getting the transition sorted out with a 3 heal team as well, before swapping back to 2 heal once you've got the control in better shape.

    Hope some of that may help - there will hopefully be people with more experience actually killing this boss about, who may be able to provide more solid transition tips! If anyone has any groundbreaking transition knowledge, I'd also be eager to hear it as it's still the toughest part of the fight for us by a long way.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by sagerz41 View Post
    killed him last night - 2 healed, did not level overcharge. had to slow down in p2 before 2nd transition to avoid pushing while bad things happened.

    dps is a non-issue in this fight
    Would agree; we managed to (just about) push P2 with Diffusion Chain leveled but nothing else, with 3 healers. Dropping back to 2 healers tonight so imagine we are going to have to hold off as well.

    Sagerz - any tips for the second transition? We were doing it 4/4/2 (2 tanks alone), but to be honest I think I could quite easily solo a quadrant there as well, providing that having 5 people on another quadrant doesn't make it too busy!

    The 2nd transition is what we are aiming to get under control tonight, so should look for a kill in the next couple of raids.... currently looking like the 100-120 wipe mark should get us to a comfortable level of experience to get the boss down!

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by oggyowl View Post
    Funny, we considered going 1 healer. There's literally no damage until p3.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphenz View Post
    Considered the same . Was basically only the stacking lightning debuff inbetween platforms that did damage.
    After the first night, didn't feel like this at all - were 2 healing but also didn't have Provoke to make the time between Pylons close to nil. 3 healing on the 2nd night felt like overkill for sure, especially as the other 2 healers had gotten used to the fight.

    Doesn't feel 1 healable so far - though if I stopped /sit spamming, I'd take very little damage from the boss so it would become primarily a raid healing requirement. The transition phases would need some nice off healing, but imagine it could be a viable tactic.... wouldn't have thought it was an easier option though! Will see if I've changed my mind by the time I've got a kill under my belt!
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  9. #29
    Mechagnome Devboy's Avatar
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    Thanks Zabuzan,

    Lots to take in.

    In answer to your question, the disc priest/resto druid is the same player. (currently rerolling from resto to disc)

    We do have an additional Resto shaman that I forgot to add to the available roster, so we could try that too.

    I think one of our issues was our prot pala getting helm and not being able to catch a double bounce on his platform, and then can only catch one afterwards and he ends up with 3 adds.

    But we do have a lot of deaths on other platforms as well.

  10. #30
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    Sorry for the text wall - I hadn't quite realised I'd typed so much!

    Does your Prot Paladin have Nitro Boosts? (ie, is he an engineer?) It makes it significantly easier! Also, if you do have any engineers in the raid team, make sure they have Goblin Glider bound, as if you get knocked off by Helm of Command, you can fly back on to the platform as Glider gives you a bit of lift when activated!

    The only time I end up with an add, is if there is a double Bouncing Bolt on my quadrant - I pretty much always manage to pick up the 2nd bounce of the bolt I missed the first time in that instance. Nitro Boosts + Speed of Light means that even if I get Helm of Command, I can still maneuver around to bolt locations - I imagine Speed of Light also stacks with the speed potions which should work in the same way, but that would need verifying. If not, a Warlock portal should make the difference!

    On several pulls, I got either 2xbolt+helm then 2xbolt OR 2xbolt then 2xbolt+helm, the only time I wasn't able to minimise that to 2 adds, was when an Overcharge was placed poorly on an adjacent quadrant so I couldn't soak properly.

    We did stream last night at some point, not sure whether or not it was still early on or later in the evening, but check out our Mage's Stream - should be able to see what I'm doing on there. It may help you with some of the other quadrants too... but we didn't get it under much control until later in the evening so may not have footage that late!
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  11. #31
    Mechagnome Devboy's Avatar
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    Unfortunatly he's not an engineer. But we did have 2 people re-roll engineering purely for the nitro boost.

    I think his awareness might be a little poor, and that he is not moving close enough to lei shen before helm comes in resulting in him falling off sometimes, as well as not having the speed to catch a bolt.

    The warlock portal is currently used on another platform with the least amount of movement boosts. but our warlock is going on holiday this week for about a month... so we are going to be quite screwed without his portals I believe...

  12. #32
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    Yeah pushing in towards the centre before Helm is key - just watch out for Overcharges from other platforms as if other quadrants have strayed towards the lone tank quadrant, the Overcharges can stun you and either cause a death if the tank is low health, or most likely will stop you stacking on Bolt that spawns.

    Note; I'm pretty sure that getting stunned by Overcharge does stop you getting pushed back by Helm :P

    Our Warlock is actually the alt of our Mage, with about a 10 ilvl deficit. The benefit of the portals doesn't really outweigh the DPS difference for us at the moment so we aren't using any portals and it all seems to work fine. It will make Phase 3 a pain though, people will have to run around a lot more!
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  13. #33
    Mechagnome Devboy's Avatar
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    Yea. I think we'd be ok. I'm just getting extremely frustrated with transition wiping, and not being able to practice p2 at all...

  14. #34
    Nice guide but Balance can also solo soak if he puts symbiosis on lock.
    You will get Unending Resolve so pup that + BS and Might of Ursoc. I survive with some 300K Hp left.

  15. #35
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    Markos - Our Boomkin ended up solo soaking without a Lock or a Rogue, I'm not entirely sure how! I'll update the symbi section as well later on - we are still finding it a bit sketchy to solo soak with an Ele Sham or DK as unless they are on 100% health it spells trouble - just need better spot healing on the transition whilst handling all of the mechanics. Thanks for the info re Unending Resolve.

    Devboy - Good luck! When is your next raid? If you come across any other issues (or tips!) then please get the posted on here Once you can hit phase 2 and get the first lightning orbs sorted (we get a full set of orbs on the first one), you'll no doubt work out the timing for stacking/spreading in no time, to ensure you get 3 lightning orbs and minimal diffused lightning.

    One additional tip that I didn't mention anywhere else, is that Warriors can use Mass Spell Reflect and Shamans can use Glyphed Grounding Totem, to force 1 Diffused Lightning to spawn - it's also friendly and attacks the boss if done that way!
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  16. #36
    Mechagnome Devboy's Avatar
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    Well we have a clear up tonight and tomorrow. Assuming we dont have trouble on some of the iffy bosses (Council / Mag / Animus) we should be back to lei shen for Sunday and Tuesday.

  17. #37
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    Good luck with the clear then! We are just extending as we feel pretty over geared for the encounter at this stage - just seems to require some good execution and we'll blitz it. The sooner we get it down, the sooner we can pwn Ra-Den and get (hopefully) a few weeks of break/farm before 5.4.

    Watch this space
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  18. #38
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    Yea, We will likely start extending soon. We want to gear up our rerolling disc priest so she's more geared for Lei Shen. Once we get close, we will start extending I'm sure.

  19. #39
    Stood in the Fire Zabuzan's Avatar
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    We were 2 healing again last night and to be honest, there wasn't really a benefit to it (our 3rd healer was unavailable). It made the transition phase sketchier and gave less room for error with the ball lightnings so we regularly lost someone either over transition one or during phase 2... and still had to slow down on DPS in P2 even without leveling Overcharge.

    Would strongly recommend 3 healing if you have a decently geared alt, it'll be worth it. Running with a Disc Priest as one or 2 of those healers, or Mistweaver Monk, means you can still push the DPS when you need to. It also means your tank is at zero risk, so can constantly spam /sit and stand in AOE without fear of death.... 450k Vengeance ftw.
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  20. #40
    My guild is progressing on it atm, got to last phase a couple of times, so might not relevant for us anymore, but this guide is very extensive non the less.
    Nicely done.

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