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  1. #461
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    When Sylvanas needed the horde, their scientists were still doing their research of a new and more deadlier plague. After the event at the Wrathgate Putress betrayed Sylvanas and the Horde and she needed to get rid of him and Varimathras.

    After these events the Lichking was defeated and she got the Val'kyr under her command, too.

    The horde no longer is useful for her, she doesn't need the horde any longer with all threats eliminated the civil war and lich king and access to the plague and val'kyr necromancy. Its just the focus on the civil war over at orgrimmar and perhaps other stale mmo reasions why the story can't progress for her.
    Same can be said about Lor'themar Theron, her most important and perhaps only ally in the region.
    Except as stated in Tides of War, she's more fearful than ever and knows she can't hold up against the Alliance forces in Eastern Kingdoms should they come knocking on her door. What saved her was the discovery of Pandaria and Anduin being captured, shifting Varian's attention to Pandaria.

    Her relations with Lor'themar and the Elves are also strained and the Elves would be more likely to go to the aid of the Alliance than the Forsaken. Lor'themar is an ally of hers out of necessity currently but he wanted to join the Alliance and has made it clear he detests Sylvanas.
    Last edited by Bullettime; 2013-07-28 at 12:46 AM.

  2. #462
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Forsaken Blight isn't infectious like Scourge Plague and kills people instantly like a toxic gas (vs. Plague killing over 3 days). Also, it doesn't turn infected into undead, it just kills them.
    why shouldn't forsaken have access to infectious scourge plague and their own killing plague? The corn was here.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Amorise View Post
    The second Sylvanas tries to use the plague on a city, she'll be slaughtered. If she somehow gets to Stormwind to use it, Ironforge along with the Blood Elves, Argent Crusade, and Ebon Blade would come down upon her.

    This thread is full of Sylvanas fanboys who are pretty much blind to reason or established lore and power. It's a ton of hypotheticals "well the Forsaken can raise dragons!" or "the Forsaken can just instaplague everywhere on Azeroth with no ramifications!"

    Sylvanas wouldn't even be in the Horde if she were confident she would take over Eastern Kingdoms. Her forces are dwindling and she even admitted in Tides of War that she was fearful that Garrosh's aggression could result in the Humans and Dwarves marching north in revenge and she doesn't have the military strength to hold against them.
    No word about dragons from my side.....so i am free to ignore this. Sylvanas don't need dragons.

    Sylvanas is very tricky and dangerous, you seem to never have played wc3: frozen throne where Arthas had a hard time to survive the ordeal with her? She is known for her deadly traps. She won't be slain easily. She is the Banshee Queen not a fragile mortal and has survived Arthas.(uh, well in a way....)
    When she was well and alive as a blood elf general, she gave arthas a hard time to catch and kill her, she was a pain in the ass.

    Sylvanas was fearful? Can only be in a novel, indeed. I quested with her, heard her talking in gilneas and silverspine, no fears of garrosh she thinks he is an dumb oger, pretending to be serving and weak while doing more research on the plague.
    If anything is moving north, it will be a disaster at the same levels what we saw at the wrathgate. This will be the alliance last move. The conter offensive wil seal the fate of mortal kings and their fragile realms.

    Besides with the fall of Garrosh the kor'kron guards in Undercity will be gone, too. This, together with the added Val'kyrs and having not much of a business in the civil war over at Kalimdor yet, only strenghtens her position.

    Lor'themar would be a fool to betray her as she is the most important ally of the blood elves. He is sealing his own fate and the history books will remember him of the last ruler of the blood elves after the atrocity that will take place and make sylvanas army even bigger.
    Last edited by Tyrannica; 2013-07-28 at 01:07 AM.

  3. #463
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    why shouldn't forsaken have access to infectious scourge plague and their own killing plague? The corn was here.
    You do realize if she made a Scourge type plague, the Argent Crusade would mobilize and join the Alliance in wiping her off the face of Azeroth right? This is the epitome of being a fanboy. It's been stated in the lore already that Sylvanas can't defend her land and is fearful of invasion. No hypotheticals. Just canon lore.

    She simply doesn't have the manpower to hold up in a long battle and if she were to be the aggressor on more than Gilneas, she has a lot of groups who want her head on a stick. She's already being eyed by the Ebon Blade and Argent Crusade as is.
    Last edited by Bullettime; 2013-07-28 at 12:50 AM.

  4. #464
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Forsaken can repopulate from the many graveyards across EK, which they do. There are many more dead humans than there are living. They use Val'kyr in battles because it gives them an edge.
    there is probably a limit to that though...cause of decomposition and what not
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  5. #465
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    why shouldn't forsaken have access to infectious scourge plague and their own killing plague? The corn was here.
    Arthas destroyed all the granaries storing the Plague. There is no way to access the original Plague vector. All the Forsaken have is what has been floating around in the environment and incubating in various animals. And its turning people undead was directly tied to Ner'zhul's necromancy, it was designed to turn humans into undead under his control so he could feed off their souls.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  6. #466
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    The horde no longer is useful for her, she doesn't need the horde any longer with all threats eliminated the civil war and lich king and access to the plague and val'kyr necromancy.
    Makes me recall that one quest - The New Forsaken
    "Speaking frankly, the Forsaken of yesteryear were a sniveling, pathetic group. We huddled together in decrepit old human buildings, hiding from the Scourge, cowering from the Alliance, and groveling at the foot of the Horde.

    Look before you now, and see the product of the new Forsaken. We have made our mark here on Azeroth, and that mark will grow. Our dominion will soon blanket the world!"
    We have faced trials and danger, threats to our world and our way of life. And yet, we persevere. We are the Horde. We will not let anything break our spirits!"

  7. #467
    Quote Originally Posted by Dreknar20 View Post
    there is probably a limit to that though...cause of decomposition and what not
    It's not something so prohibitive that Blizzard can't write it off so long as there are still bones.

    So many people have died across Azeroth, that you can walk across any patch of land, no matter how remote, and have no problem finding a corpse to raise a ghoul/skeleton.
    Last edited by Aquamonkey; 2013-07-28 at 12:59 AM.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  8. #468
    High Overlord Mshadowz's Avatar
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    With how often the Alliance defends themselves, she could probably take it in a week.

  9. #469
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Forsaken Blight isn't infectious like Scourge Plague and kills people instantly like a toxic gas (vs. Plague killing over 3 days). Also, it doesn't turn infected into undead, it just kills them.
    Actually, it does. If you look at the testing done during multiple quests its clear the Plague DOES turn its victims undead - before they fall over dead. Its clear the intent of the Plague was always to turn victims into Forsaken and it was just in an unfinished or failed state - something that's possible now with the Val'kyr.

    With Pandaria under control, Garrosh gone and a temporary peace between the Horde and Alliance... The Forsaken need to keep their heads firmly down to avoid being curbstomped. While the Alliance didn't make the most of their victory (infact its less a victory for the Alliance and more one for the Kalimdor Horde) they still came out of the conflict strongly. Until they rebuild even the entire Horde couldn't stop the Alliance steamrolling most of Eastern Kingdoms if the Forsaken tried anything.

  10. #470
    Quote Originally Posted by Durandro View Post
    Actually, it does. If you look at the testing done during multiple quests its clear the Plague DOES turn its victims undead - before they fall over dead. Its clear the intent of the Plague was always to turn victims into Forsaken and it was just in an unfinished or failed state - something that's possible now with the Val'kyr.
    Yes, they tried to make it convert people into undead, but they never got it to work so it's moot.

    EDIT: Also, it's not as simple as just replicating the Plague's effects. They don't want any new undead created by it to default to the LK's control. They have to separate the "LK control" from the "make undead" functions which is hard since they were so closely tied together in the original Plague.
    Last edited by Aquamonkey; 2013-07-28 at 01:31 AM.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  11. #471
    Not likely. Hold the line, yes. Conquer the same area as three major races, no. Especially if she doesn't have support of allies. And the necessary troops needed from the other members of the Horde would leave them vulnerable to counter attack.

  12. #472
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    Humans are very weak, but allowed to be spared their lifes for the sake of a story. >.>
    Sigh.

    This thread gets more absurd every page.

  13. #473
    here's the thing you have to realize the Blood elves would be a TARGET not an ALLY in this proposed scenario. A target I might add which is very close they would likely be attacked early on causing the horde to mobilize in order to keep a major foothold in the Eastern Kingdoms.

    the Frostwolf clan already don't support the forsaken and would likely be a voice in Kalimdor for moving the Horde war machine against them.

    So you have in the north the Forsaken dealing with the Argent dawn(who are we kidding they WILL get involved seeing as the majority of their deaths was to free the land from plague contamination and undead rule) and the Blood Elves who will refuse to have defended Silvermoon for so long just to become more undead.

    in the central part of EK the Bloodfang pack is using guerrilla tactics along with the Wildhammer clan.

    in Khaz Modan you have the largest air force in all of Azeroth. Planes, Copters, gryphons, skyships... a bunch of bats will never get close enough to carry the plague which will mean the forsaken will have to try and maneuver catapults in mountains against dwarven siege tanks

    In the south lies Stormwind the head of the Alliance receiving aid from the Kirin Tor, Darnassus, The Exodar, The Cenarion Circle, the Earthen Ring, and perhaps even members of the Shattered sun who had once before felt the need to show support at Theramore

    and If the Forsaken did cross the Horde by trying to take all of Eastern Kingdoms for themselves they would then have the Horde marshaling their navy to head straight for the Undercity.
    The world was just as bad when you were young as it is today. You only see it now because of your age.

  14. #474
    Quote Originally Posted by Amorise View Post
    You do realize if she made a Scourge type plague, the Argent Crusade would mobilize and join the Alliance in wiping her off the face of Azeroth right? This is the epitome of being a fanboy. It's been stated in the lore already that Sylvanas can't defend her land and is fearful of invasion. No hypotheticals. Just canon lore.

    She simply doesn't have the manpower to hold up in a long battle and if she were to be the aggressor on more than Gilneas, she has a lot of groups who want her head on a stick. She's already being eyed by the Ebon Blade and Argent Crusade as is.
    she is just pretending to be weak.

  15. #475
    Herald of the Titans MrHappy's Avatar
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    given the new "friends" the val kyr....yes yes she can
    www.cherishyourit.ca MCTS - Win 7, MCTS - AD, A+, Security+

  16. #476
    Quote Originally Posted by MrHappy View Post
    given the new "friends" the val kyr....yes yes she can
    Most of which are already dead and never were an "IWIN" Button. Hell we beat the Scourge and they had much more than just that.

  17. #477
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    Arthas destroyed all the granaries storing the Plague. There is no way to access the original Plague vector. All the Forsaken have is what has been floating around in the environment and incubating in various animals. And its turning people undead was directly tied to Ner'zhul's necromancy, it was designed to turn humans into undead under his control so he could feed off their souls.

    You really missed all the forsaken quests where alliance prisoners get something to eat/drink and turn into undead condition, right?

  18. #478
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    You really missed all the forsaken quests where alliance prisoners get something to eat/drink and turn into undead condition, right?
    And if it worked, Sylvanas wouldn't have been so relieved to have Val'kyr to repopulate the Forsaken.

    Yes, they tried to make it convert people into undead, but they never got it to work so it's moot. It's not as simple as just replicating the Plague's effects. They don't want any new undead created by it to default to the LK's control. They have to separate the "LK control" from the "make undead" functions which is hard since they were so closely tied together in the original Plague.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)

    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  19. #479
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    You really missed all the forsaken quests where alliance prisoners get something to eat/drink and turn into undead condition, right?
    only temporarily and die soon afterwards most likely the plague is too much of a strain on the corpse to use it long term
    The world was just as bad when you were young as it is today. You only see it now because of your age.

  20. #480
    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrannica View Post
    she is just pretending to be weak.
    This statement is proof that the thread has gone as far as it's going to.

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