Is Mists of Pandaria the greatest PvE expansion ever created?

[FobManX]

BC and WOTLK were better(if you forget about TOC).

[Raugnaut]

Cata was good because:
Brilliant lore all over.. Deathwing was explained in great detail..
Tier 13 was a good instance.. Yes, Spine sucked, but it's hard to get everything right.. Rogues got their 5th and 6th legendary.. Too much legendary rogue love though... T13 didn't last nearly as long as T10 did.. 3-4 months shorter actually..
Gearing in Cata was easy, but no epic loot pinata, like WotLK.. You could have several raid geared alts in Cata, it's almost impossible in MoP, due to time..

Deathwing, explained? Where exactly was Deathwing explained in cata as more then "Bad dragon, kill for lewtz"? NO background, NO connection established. All he did was fly around one shotting lvling nubz, and then turn into a thousand sparklies.

DS was a GOD-aweful instance. You say that Spine was the only failure? Spine, imo, was the only fight in there that BARELY passed difficulty challenges. 7/8 Failures=1 major fail instance. Normal, the ENTIRE raid was "stack, tunnel boss, collect loots". On heroic, you would get a few extra mechanics here and there, but no-where near enough for it to be worthwhile- the previous tiers before that, and the tiers after that, are more challenging in a SINGLE boss fight then the ENTIRETY of DS was put together!

Easy lewtz in Wrath? In Wrath, to get decent Ilvl gear, you had to RAID ICC, at least 10 man normal, first couple of bosses. In Cata, push button, afk, recieve loots. (Free 378 set from dungeons, free 384 set from LFR, piss easy to get 397 set from normal DS, and anyone and their retarted pet monkey could get loot from first 3 in H DS)

Sure, T11/T12 were very good instances- H Ragnaros is an extremely epic fight. T13 was such a giant let-down after T12, that it should be struck entirely from the records of all raids ever. Free lewtz for everyone and their mothers (LFR), piss easy fights that a face-rolling derp-a-herp retard could complete, short instance, almost no interaction with the "end boss" (GIANT TENTACLES FTW RIGHT?), terrible conclusion to the fight (OMG SHE PREGGERS!?!), ect, ect.

Sorry, but anyone that uses "T13" and "good" in the same sentence has the sense of aesthetics in which they would probably look at a pile of shit and call it natural art.

[Gsara]

Id say overall I prefered BC, but for just raids I like them both. The only bosses I really liked in cata was heroic Rag, Nefarian and Ony, and Sinestra, the rest were just bland. Mists ToT is ok but the previous tier were just blah

[Trakanonn]

I preferred Wrath PERSONALLY - Although, MOP has some Fantastic stuff for Raids!

Im surprised WOTLK gets so much criticism, I loved it. Pugging ICC/TOC/etc etc for like a year was actually fun.

[SurrealNight]

MoP is my favorite expansion so far though part of it comes from loving my BrM Monk so much. I have enjoyed the raid tier's so there are enough good things to outweigh so of the bad (like the way to many dailys).

I personally didn't like BC at all and WotlK was good and my main was a Blood DK but it wasn't problem free either.

[Daws001]

No, I think BC is still the reigning raid champion. I do think MoP is the best one since then, however. I think they've come up with some great and interesting boss fights and I love the lore and feel of the different raids. And we're not done yet!

If we're factoring in other pve elements like the Monk class and pet battles, then MoP is definitely my favorite expansion. I also LOVE Pandaria. Aesthetically and lorewise they hit it out of the park for me.

[Findus707]

Maybe YOU don't have doubts, but other, including myself, says the opposite..

MoP is on a fast track to becomming the worst expansion in history of WoW...
When MoP was released, it was on par with TBC.
When v5.1 was released, it slip down between TBC and Cata.
When v5.2 was released, it slip down on par with Cata.
When v5.3 was released, it slip down between Cata and WotLK..

Unless v5.4 is truely epic, it will slip down to the level of WotLK or possibly below....

Pretty much all this, too many dailys which i felt i had to grind to get some gear in the start, and just more dailys kept coming.
The raids just felt boring and lame for me, not much new from former raids, same things over again.
TBC is still my favourite expansion.

[Deleted]

Horrible and boring dungeons with unimaginative raids. Lore and its experience are a big part for me and its when mop failed- so yeah, fighting someone like Lei Shen is not something memorable.

The Forgotten Depths are probably the worst raid experience in the game - a good damn cave with a turtle and 3 rainbow warms.

I guess the game just lost the niche that drove me to raid in wotlk. Oh magnificent Ulduar, how much of a fanboy I am....

props to Challange Modes, a great addon. Scenarios could use a little more work than this 5min grindfest. Tillers Farm is a good addon.

[Stingray]

Maybe "PvE" means more than raiding to some people, but as far as raiding goes, I think the best expansion ever is a contest between TBC and MoP. The other 3 can be ruled out because:

* Classic isn't truly an expansion anyway, but its raids were pretty uninspired and gear came too slowly which caused a lot of problems. Its main appeal is that everything was still new to most people, and there were still strong server communities.
* WotLK had tons of problems: having to run 10/25 each week to maximize gear and achievements, T7 was a complete joke and can hardly be considered a real raiding tier, T9 you had to run 4 times each week and was only 5 bosses in two rooms, and then T10 had issues like the zone nerf and last boss being seemingly actually tuned with nerfs taken into consideration.
* Cataclysm: T12 and T13 weren't all that great, and their rapid zone nerfs also sucked. Then T13 dragged on forever while ridiculousy nerfed, probably the worst time period in WoW history other than T7.

As far as MoP goes, it's brought large raids with interesting bosses, and has introduced various things that make raiding more interesting, such as Thunderforged/Bloodsoaked gear, VP upgrades, coin rolls, and a huge variety of loot again (vs the extremely simplistic loot tables in Cataclysm). It remains to be seen how long T16 will drag on, which could pull down MoP's rating a bit, we'll have to see.

BC had some issues such as a 10-man raid (Karazhan) being part of the progression path for 25-man raiding, which was strange and screwy. But it gets big points for none of the raids being watered down with LFR or "normal" (aka easy) modes.

[Polybius]

So much hyperbolic hypocriticism in this thread. Lets go through them shall we..

Why would blizz give you content if they dont want you to experience it.

No one needs to do dailies anymore, there are MANY MANY other ways to get lesser charms now, you can grind mobs, you can do pet battles.

Yea exactly, stop bitching CM's provided their purpose, if you want its actual difficulty, stop buying it for gold from people who have gear, or just do it in full 463 dungeon blues, you know.. if you want a genuine exper

Why would you want to level a crapload of alts?. Before patch 5.2 there weren't many alternatives to obtain lesser charms. Blizzard gives us content to experience it the way it should be. If you bought an EA game and couldn't progress or "pass it" are you going to blame the company? So much for "bi***ing".

[SinisterAsc]

This is the best raiding expansion since TBC, Every single raid so far has been pretty good, the only one I didn't like much was HoF.

[Zonex]

Why would you want to level a crapload of alts?. Before patch 5.2 there weren't many alternatives to obtain lesser charms. Blizzard gives us content to experience it the way it should be. If you bought an EA game and couldn't progress or "pass it" are you going to blame the company? So much for "bi***ing".

I have no idea if youre agreeing with me or not, i cant read the tone of your post.

Anyway, prior to 5.2 a LOT of reputations gave gear upgrades. If you wanted those upgrades, you'd do dailies and get charms anyway. The reputations daily grind and elder charms provide the same benefit, better gear for raiding. If youre not going to do one, whats the point of doing the other?

[Silversorrow]

Idk why people continue to think that it is hard to gear alts in MOP. After my hunter main (536 Ilvl) priest alt has a 528 Ilvl without a single boss kill in ToT normal/heroic, or any normal raid this entire expac actually. My Shaman alt also has a 524 Ilvl and though it has a few ToT normal kills it has only received one piece of loot from that raid and it is not even equipped yet cause it would break my set bonus if I did. Got a 516/513 (tank/dps) Ilvl dk alt and a 506 Ilvl monk alt too of which neither have set foot in a normal raid this tier.

I also do not do dailies or anything to get charms on any alt other than what they get from normal day to day kills or loot chests or whatever.

[Marxman]

Idk why people continue to think that it is hard to gear alts in MOP.

I don't think the argument is that it's harder to gear alts, the argument is that it's far more time consuming than it has been in the past. It's also WAY more RNG-based than it was previously, because lolLFR loot system, etc.

I'd actually be okay with the time consuming part... it's the damn RNG that I can't stand. LFR should not be the primary gearing method, and definitely shouldn't be the catch-up method in the future. RNG is bad.

[Brakthir]

You do know, that you were limited to 10 (ten!) dailies, the majority of TBC, right? It wasn't until the end,it was raised to 25..
Besides I never claim to hate dailies, quite the contrary.. But in MoP they have made TOO MANY without limitingthe amount you can do per day..

MH was a GREAT raid. It kept you on your toes, as you had to actually conserve mana for the boss, aft fighting 8 waves of trash...

You pretty much invalidated your entire opinion just here. MH was one of the worst raids I've ever raided. Boring bosses filled with boring trash. Archimonde was the only fun fight. It was awful then and it's awful now.

[Tojara]

Stop trying to say catch up mechanisms are way harder today than in the past. In TBC you needed to be attuned to raids and the only way you could feasibly get gear is from doing raids themselves. The reward from doing out of raid activities, aside from PvP (in which only the weapons were good for PvE) was absolutely nil. If you wanted to get into a good guild you either needed to know people and have them carry you through content until you're geared, or you had to start with a base guild and work your way up. People just picking up random lowly geared people never happened.

Even taking LFR out of the picture there are a lot more things you can do as a single person to get you ready to raid if that's your goal. The option to be carried is still there, and given that their current model is to nerf previous tiers by a bit, it's far easier to boost somebody now than it was in TBC.

Today you have VP, crafted items, LFR, heroic scenarios, and even the BMAH. And just like in the past the option to have that person be boosted through current content is STILL there, as it always has been. Hell you even have PvP to an extent, given that the PvP stats don't take away from the budget of the item.

For somebody that can't get boosted by a guild, getting back into raiding and getting your feet wet in it is easier than ever. Finding a guild might be more difficult, but catching up gear wise is a lot easier when you compare TBC to MoP. I can't with a straight face say that catching up is easier in MoP compared to say Cataclysm, but it's hard to do that when you have 5 mans that can be chain ran dropping fairly good gear.

It's fine to have an opinion and this thread is clearly all opinion based as to what expansion as a whole you enjoyed more. But having an opinion that it was easier to catch up in TBC isn't something you can have an opinion on when there is plain as day evidence that this wasn't the case.

[FraQture]

BC is still the best PVE expansion.

Agree.

/10chars

[Leonidazz]

Raid bosses encounter have never been as complex, and challeging as they are now, if you are serious when you say any other expansion was better then MoP you are blind and clearly reading about wow not actually playing it. Hell even bosse from Grimbatol have more mechanic then most of TBC bosses. so really stop trying too hard to live on denial. i take it 90% of the guys on this thread dont actually raid or take LFR as raiding.

I cant deny that there were some very exceptional bosses in other expansions, their interaction with lore or just kuz they were soo awesome made their expansion shine but the whole raiding pack we were given in a single expan have never been as good as in MoP.

TLDR


**-----Vanilla---****
Unfinished raid bosses delivered to the comunity as raid was the worse time of wow, wiping to broken bosses (hi C'thun) till they got fixed yes fixed not nerfed was just awful, but undestandable since it was a new game at that point.

**-----TBC---****
Kara was the 1st raid instance that made me go wow this place is awesome! such an amazing instance desing. but the bosses were shit and having to farm it for over a year was crap. yes you had to run kara for new recruit that were worted. and Badges.
Loved Illidan but only kuz i love his lore not the Boss mechanic.
I liked the KJ encounter.

**-----WotLK‎---****
Loved ICC kuz how hard HLK was and the lore behind him made me love him so much (no homo) but other then LK other bosses were just ok.
Ulduar its just such an amazing place the whole instance its just wow! Yogg 0 lights mechanics, Fire figther Dificulty or the massive gear check at Algalon. such great bosses, But other then that it was all trash and not worth mentioning.

**-----Cata‎---****
OMG BWD! loved the concept of fight of the blind dragon easy mechanic but very neat concept. Heroic Omnotron was sooo Chaotic i loved it! who didnt like flying around on A'lakir Heroic yeah the instance wasnt that good but it wasnt bad either. pls dont even mention Sinestra i still have nightmares with her, and HLK.
Liked Firelands a lil too mostly Beth'tilac boss encounter Alysrazor and Ragnaros but the place got nerfed sooo soon that most random casual raiders think it was always such an easy instance when it was not.
DS Hagara is the only boss I actually liked in whole instance.

**-----MoP---****
Spirit Kings heroic felt like doing Omnotron all over again, Chaos everywhere, Loved it! but yeah game is too hard so they nerfed it and made bosses spawn in a set order.
WoE, who can soak this spark!? OMG HALP hahaha such a heavy movement fight and full of wake up or die baddie. loved it! up for a dance melee dps?
Imperial Vizier, amazing fight yey burn phase! oohwait shit dodge rings! dude force and veeer ress pls!
Empress! anub'arak on crack? such an intense fight not even funny.
Protector of the endless once again another council fight i liked a lot, it pushed your gear soo bad that it was hard not to mess up your stack of corruption. did any1 end up killing it Heroic Elite after all?
The sha, jesus you just have to see it yourself or not believe it. such an amazing fight on heroic.
in ToT theres just not a single heroic boss that you can tag as an easy boss for the average guild. yeah sure my guild that get Realm 1st every tier just stomp the bosses but its not the same for every guild out there and the whole ToT Instance its very nice in dificulty.

[lazzy]

Full of Nostalgia for a game you misremember from 5+ years ago. All of those annoying dailies you claim to hate plagued all of TBC too. In fact, the legendary BC, the greatest expansion in the history of gaming, was when daily quests became the norm. Thats all TBC was. Dailys to get your drake mount. Dailys for the ogre people. Dailys for the nether ray mounts. Dailys on the sunwell isle. The entire expansion was moving between daily quest hubs.

You actually said the tillers farm was a bad thing. lol. What a joke. You are clearly just trolling. Being able to farm all of my own consumables without needing a gather profession or gathering alts is one of the best ideas ever. I will be extremely disappointed if there is not a new version of the tillers farm in the next expansion.

Lol, I played BC and what he pretty much said was correct. I think YOU remember wrong.

You did need groups to do group quests. I don't see how you're even denying this, Hell nagrad had a entire quest chain that required a group to kill elite animals. LK group quests were extremely easy. I solo'd the drake for ToC dailys every day. I solo'd the Elite quests in Dragonblight with the exception of the last big ass bone drake you call from the sky i 2 manned that one.

BC did have dailys but you didn't have to do them for any reason at all. We also had cap per day so doing the daily cap took all of 30-40 mins on Isle of Quel'Danas. The rewards were also a lot better. These "Daily grinds" Could usually be completed in a completely separated way if you chose to do so, Eggs for drake, forget what for the nether ray but you could grind a item. I got my drake within about a week because i farmed eggs because "I wanted to". I wasn't hindered by dailys only.

Heroics were hard for just about everyone. There is no denying this, even if you had good gear heroics like sethekk halls and shadow labyrinth were not easy to clear.

SSC was a really good raid, Hyjal was fun but its not amazing it's still better than any raid in Cata and MoP.

I think BC is the best place to lvl after they destroyed what vanilla was.

Id rather do 1-70 3 times than 71-90

[Paarthurnax]

No tier is perfect, but the boss fights and the instances themselves have been over all pretty positive. Throne of Thunder in particular has been really solid. The only thing MoP is missing PvE wise is a major lore baddie.