Do you miss the old Talent System?

[Duster505]

The old talent system gave ppl more freedom to play the way they wanted - specially while leveling. Cata and now MOP system have destroyed that choice.

And if you claim players had no choice... thats a lie. There were very interesting and fun builds that were great for leveling even tho they were not the best in pure output numbers. Players could always respec to the best when they got to max level.

I think the old talent system was part of the key of making the leveling experience abit more interesting. Thats just not the case anymore with WOW. I now play games that have this 1 talent per level and its still gives a good feeling to be in control (even tho its not really in any big ways) of how you develop your character.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

The old talent system gave ppl more freedom to play the way they wanted - specially while leveling. Cata and now MOP system have destroyed that choice.

And if you claim players had no choice... thats a lie. There were very interesting and fun builds that were great for leveling even tho they were not the best in pure output numbers. Players could always respec to the best when they got to max level.

I think the old talent system was part of the key of making the leveling experience abit more interesting. Thats just not the case anymore with WOW. I now play games that have this 1 talent per level and its still gives a good feeling to be in control (even tho its not really in any big ways) of how you develop your character.

Players only had choice during leveling, and that's still there but you will always get a ability now with a talent.

[Spraxle]

I miss the old Talent Trees. Not even just the getting a point each lvl, but the making the spec your own. I know they say everyone just went to the net to get their builds but I have always made my own builds. Sure some stuff felt no-brainerish but who cares? Now the specs (for classes that are pure dps mainly) all feel the same, the talents are a ruse in their current state. Especially for Rogues who used to differentiate a lot with talent choices for different things, now they're all the same no matter what.

The Talent Tree revamp is just another step in the homogenization of WoW. Everything plays the same, everything looks the same, everything is the same. They (the devs) cry that they don't want all healers being HoTers but they MADE the game that way. Or that shields feel to mandatory, shit it's been that way since Wrath!

[Time Sage]

The only thing I miss about it is that sense of earning something each level. Not only did you become more powerful naturally (More Health, Strength, Agility etc...) but you also got a talent point, that made you 1% better at whatever it was you choose, or unlocked a new ability.

Earning a talent point as far as we do now does suck from a leveling point of view, but, I love it from a raiding point of view. Can't fault it, lovely system. All they need to do is figure something out to reward those leveling, and it'll be fantastic.

This. There was a certin rush of excitement when you earned a tallent point. Other then that.... nope. Don't miss it at all.

[ro9ue]

I like the new system, I just feel there should've been a few more tiers.

[Servasus]

I miss getting a reward for every level I earn.

I do NOT miss the old talent system. The new one is so infinitely better it's not even funny.

[Haxlax]

I miss them a bit yeah. Not necessarily because it was so much better but because right now, despite being more of a "up-to-you" type of deal, it has to be more complex than it is right now - need even more options and ways to go about your spec. Maybe a separate talent system on the side which cover other kinds of stuff, maybe something along the lines of team play or solo play?

[Deleted]

No, I don't miss the old system, I love the way I can respec infinitely to try other tricks. If anything specialisations should also be as easy to change, so I can try unholy as well.

[Solarth]

The ability to change specs has nothing at all to do with the choices you have. Please stop saying how much you love the way you can change whenever you want. Blizzard could have easily added that to the old system. That is a whole other topic.

[metasine]

I thought part of the unintentionally good of the old talent system was the perceived concept of its complexity.

Yet, you could still find good builds quickly on the internet if you wanted. In a sense, with the old system, you could almost have it both ways. I would like to see the old bc/lk talent system. But I don't think it will happen.

[Solarth]

I thought part of the unintentionally good of the old talent system was the perceived concept of its complexity.

Yet, you could still find good builds quickly on the internet if you wanted. In a sense, with the old system, you could almost have it both ways. I would like to see the old bc/lk talent system. But I don't think it will happen.

I agree with that, but honestly was is complex about a 6 point system....

[Daedelus]

You know, I've been thinking about this over the last few days, and you know what game I think Blizzard could learn a lot from, as far as talents go? Deus Ex: Human Revolution. I've been replaying that game over the last week or so, and it struck me just how like talents Praxis points are. And when you get them, you really have to think - "do I want to have the cloaking device now, and wait on the vision enhancements? Should I get the Typhoon, or is more armor a better choice?" The different augmentations can make a big difference in how your Jensen gets through the game, but it never feels like a bad system, or like some things are just useless.

I agree the aug system is fantastic, and really makes you think but it only works in a game like Deus Ex, where there is no end-game - the whole point of the game is the journey, not what happens at the end. With WoW it's different - you blast through the journey asap (or most people do) and then the game starts at 90.

[Risale]

No, I do not miss the old system where everyone used a cookie cutter build.

Sorry to say but even with the new system you have cookie cutter builds.

[Daedelus]

I much prefer the new system. I actually change my talents now more than once per expansion, often on a boss-by-boss basis.

[Aoyi]

At max level, I prefer the current talent system. I think its much better to have the six tiers of three choices you can swap at any time. Most of the old system wasn't a choice, so it was kind of pointless. That said, I do think the old system felt better while leveling. It gave a much more rewarding feeling even if there wasn't any choice in where I was putting the points.

I think a nice compromise would be to keep the new system, but maybe add in 2 or 3 more tiers so you get that rewarding feeling a little more often in the leveling process.

[Solarth]

I much prefer the new system. I actually change my talents now more than once per expansion, often on a boss-by-boss basis.

I would like to stress again, the ability to change your spec has absolutely nothing to do with the choices of picking talents. Write one code and add a button to the old talent trees and you got the same ability. Actually it would have been better because you could have changed specs that way as well.

[Durandro]

I like the new system, I just feel there should've been a few more tiers.

Pretty much this. Of course, creating all those unique abilities is hard enough without adding even more requirements. Unless every second tier was a boost to a baseline skill (example, 10% extra damage to Fireball). Problem then is certain talents are mathematically superior, thus defeating the purpose of the new talent system.

- - - Updated - - -

I would like to stress again, the ability to change your spec has absolutely nothing to do with the choices of picking talents. Write one code and add a button to the old talent trees and you got the same ability. Actually it would have been better because you could have changed specs that way as well.

There was little point in changing talents, that's the point. There was a 'correct' talent setup, with a tiny amount of variation and usually zero choice on additional abilities.

Currently changing talents can completely alter the way a spec is played!

[Hitei]

I like the new system, I just feel there should've been a few more tiers.

Agreed, although, presumably, a tier will be added with each expansion

[LocNess]

I do miss the old trees. I like the new ones, don't get me wrong, but ultimately I enjoyed placing 71 points rather than just 6 talents or so.

[ComputerNerd]

Well, I'll say that the latest iteration of talents is...interesting, in a very general sense. However, much like 90% of their latest design decisions, it only really opens up or becomes interesting at max level, because of those level 75 & 90 talents (which didn't exist in the old system).

As far as which is better, let's put it like this: I think that even the Cataclysm model, with its horrendous 'forcing you down to the bottom of a tree before you can spend points in another' design, was better than this.
Sure, it's a fair argument for someone to say that they don't think +10% crit damage for 1 talent point is all that interesting. But I'd counter with the psychological effect it all has on the leveling experience. Seeing the whole tree and having the game ask you where you want to put the points every level or every other level gives the player a level of control over their character and something to look forward to that the new system just doesn't afford. In fact, the new system is more like autopilot for 14 levels, make a "choice" between 3 abilities or passives (ooh, a whole 3), and then autopilot for another 14... as if the game (developers?) thinks the players are utterly incapable of making the "right" choices, so it just does it for them instead...


Really? I'd call that pretty regressive, actually. Going from making 40-70 "choices" while leveling to 6 "choices" really takes a lot of that customization out of the players' hands... and in an RPG that just makes no sense. Especially when people make, read, and follow talent guides regardless...

Which is the point I brought up.
People are hung up on the reward rather than what the reward actually is.
The point you got per level means more to people than what the point was actually spent on, which is why I made the suggestion of a per level reward not tied to the talents.
But that is something nobody wants to discuss or talk about.