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  1. #1

    Heroic Megaera...How do we fix this

    How do we do better on this fight we're getting to the 5th rampage and then dying every single time. Logs posted below. Thanks for your help.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...zp/?enc=bosses

  2. #2
    Just throw some more cool downs at it, it's the hardest rampage of the fight (you will have lust for the 6th) maybe start with barrier and then smoke bomb towards the end.
    Last edited by Migraine; 2013-07-29 at 10:51 AM. Reason: Spelling

  3. #3
    not to be rude but that is not helpful we're already using every cd we have on a rotation. For the one we're dying on we're using smoke bomb tranq and devo aura and still dying.

  4. #4
    Your holy paladin is playing like shit. I haven't armoried him but his playstyle is completely suboptimal.

    He should be EF blanketing the raid and using radiance on the ranged pack to generate HP and build shields even before the rampage hits.

    Also, is he forgetting lights hammer or something? He used wings 9 times in 14 tries??? Holy avenger (2 min cd) 9 times too, wtf? divine favor 7 times...

    Not looked at much else, but that really stood out. Also people are hardly using their healthstones.

  5. #5
    Oggyowl has the right of it. Holy Paladin isn't using his CDs, that'll be a big part of your issue.

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  6. #6
    bomb large heals on the tank with the arcane head debuff and save a cd or two from that rampage for the 5th rampage. the majority of your members are only using healthstones a quarter of the time. healing stream totem is garbage. monk should be using chi burst or zen sphere to help with rampage healing since that's the issue of the fight, not chi wave for single target healing, pop potions on the 5th rampage if needed

    really don't know what else to tell you. maybe make your priest go holy to have more output.

  7. #7
    The Lightbringer Mehman's Avatar
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    Before I say anything, THIS IS FROM A 25 PERSPECTIVE, TAKE IT WITH A GRAIN OF SALT.

    I'm just gonna comment on the paladin as that's what I have experience with.

    He's not using his CD's properly. As Oggy pointed out, he doesn't use Wings/HA/DF on CD. But he did use Arcing Lightning. I'll give him that.. 2k ticks is ~ 20 times (assuming 10 players hit for 10 seconds of it on average), which is too damn low. It's off CD every or (if your Dps is amazing), every 2nd Rampage. Which given 14 attempts should easily be 45+.

    A good CD rotation for a paladin is HA -> Wings -> HA -> DA+DF -> HA (Potentially Wings if it really owns you) -> Wings + Guardian. It's what I use, and I really can't complain about the result.

    My guilds last kill: http://worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-hd...?s=7782&e=8218

    Had a look at his armory (If that is him, I assume it is) and the first thing I have to say is: I really fucking hate him. Wish I had that mace. No problems with gearing maybe except the int Serpent's Eye he's using, but eh.
    He is using EF, HA and LH which are mandatory. However, the talents are getting me.. He's using Glyph of Illumination (which requires a crit build to be really effective), and he's going mastery, that doesn't add up. Glyph of Avenging Wrath REALLY doesn't give a lot. Assuming 450k health it gives you 4.5k health a second, or a total of 90k over the duration. Not gonna save you. Glyph of Beacon of Light isn't that good on this fight either as there's not any tank that takes no damage (meaning you probably won't be switching Bacon around), so it's a waste. Overall, I'd probably have him get Glyph of Divinity, Glyph of Protector of the Innocent and something random, doesn't really matter what the third is. Could maybe go with Glyph of Light of Dawn if it's specific people dying instead of everyone.

    Again, 25 perspective, add salt.


  8. #8
    Tell your paladin to actually use his healing cooldowns.

    He has HA talented and used it once in a 6 minute attempt. He can use it on rampages 2/4/6. It's immense for rampages.

    He only used divine favour once and avenging wrath once, it can be used on rampage 1 and 5 too.

    He never used his divine protection once on the attempt I checked. 40% magic damage reduction for 60% of a rampage. Yummy!

    The priest doesn't use prayer of mending. It's fire and forget on Cd in rampages. I also didn't see a barrier used in the attempt I checked. 25% less damage for 12 seconds afaik.

    rogue used feint and cloak of shadows once on the 6 minute attempt I checked. Granted I know sweet fa about rogues but doesn't that reduce dmg they take?

    Shaman used shamanistic rage once. 30% damage reduction.


    Basically, long story short. You need to use everything at your disposal. You aren't. Get every person to run thru their talents and CD's and map them out properly per rampage.


    Edit: Tishko actually made a really important point. I always make a dps call out when the head is 10% so the healers can get closer to the rampage stack spot. Ofc you don't camp there incase of cinders or ice beams but I find being in position quickly makes a MASSIVE difference. Get there even 2 seconds late and it feels like an uphill battle. get there on time to start pumping out heals and it *feels* more stable.
    Last edited by Deja Thoris; 2013-07-29 at 08:12 AM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by oggyowl View Post
    Your holy paladin is playing like shit.
    You don't know him, you have no right to be mean, he didn't do anything to you! Ppl wouldn't ask for help if they played perfect.

    You can kill this boss, im not the best with log editor so i will tell you what i see and then we can fix it. I guess your holy pala uses his cds on the 3rd rampage, your druid tranqs on the 4th during the lust, and you probably should have barrier for the 5th where you die.

    3rd Rampage is not that much of an issue, dont blow cds there, use healthstones, and AG from shaman. and some minor stuff which will be up for next. On 4th you lust, you should already count that as a cd, save tranq, use the pala cds and spirit shell. On the 5th that you die use tranq + aura + warrior cds, which will leave you with spirit shell, barrier, smoke bomb, AG, healthstones, personals for the last.

    Because you lust on on 4th rampage the fire head dies too fast so generally speaking 1 min cds will not be up, such as paladins hammer. On the other hand your stacking point is going to be in front of arcane head, which is too far for your healer that is healing the poison head tank. Looking at logs i can certainly say that nobody from your healers is infront of the arcane head 1-2 seconds before the rampage, so nobody is really healing. You don't have spirit shell because it didnt come off cooldown, so the time it usually gives you is now no more.By the time you start healing raid is dead.
    We used warlock portal from arcane to poison head so our druid who is healing the poison head tank can just click it when we call the head is on sub 5% so the moment rampage hits he will tranq, which will give time for the other healers to stack up hots and shields.

    Fix your positioning and you will kill the boss. Good luck!

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Tishko View Post
    You don't know him, you have no right to be mean, he didn't do anything to you! Ppl wouldn't ask for help if they played perfect.
    While that's actually true, there's quite a bit of difference between "perfect play" and "whatever the hell that paladin is doing".

    On 14 wipes only 3 were under 2 minutes. That means 11*2+3=25 wings/holy avenger. While it's understandable to not reach that number as that would be perfect play regarding that particular aspect, he used 9 of each. That's way below half of them.

    Do you think they'd kill any boss, not only meg, if everyone used his/her CDs like that?

    Also, as has been mentioned above, 125 EFs on 14 trys is about 8 EF/try. He's only using it on one tank, maybe both, instead of blanketing the raid.

    TL,DR: If that's how your paladin heals on every boss, you have been carrying him. Consider having him read a guide to improve or simply recruit another healer.

  11. #11
    Brewmaster Cherrypowdah's Avatar
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    pop bloodlust on 5th rampage and everything you have left on the 6th one, this way you get full benefit of lust too and head will be 20% after rampage end. then you can just spread after 6th rampage and gg boss dead

  12. #12
    The only way to fix Heroic Megaera wipes is by acquiring more NUMBERS.On some pulls, you spend over minute and a half on a head, while they should be dying much faster.
    Also, your holy paladin is under performing - his HPS varies from 50-70k, while holy is exceptionally strong on megaera (producing over 100k hps should be normal for him at 535ilvl, even on attempts where he gets fucked by the ice beam). From a quick glimpse at your logs, there are very obvious mistakes on his side - only 43!!! holy shock casts out of 63!!! possible on your 6:21 attempt. Glyph of Illumination is a big no-no and a mana loss. No divine plea uses (not OK, unless he is always full mana). He runs Holy Avenger instead of Divine purpose, which adds a decent healing cooldown, but he fails at utilizing HA - only 1 use on your 6:21 attempt and he pretty much popped HA, DF and AW at the same time (which makes me believe he has some swifty macro for healing, also a big no-no). I got this info just from looking at 2-3 attempts and your paladin's armory - have him visit Fix My Heals thread in paladin section and people there will be able to help you out more.

    As far as overall strategy for the encounter goes - have you considered solo tanking Meg? With our setup (brewmaster/prot paladin, no plate dpses available in the raid), we found that having prot paladin solo tank 2 heads and having brewmaster pick up and solo kill arcane wyrms increases raid dps significantly.
    Setup for solo tank strat is very simple - the tank has to have 2 CDs planned per head for breaths (should be extremely easy with a DK's AMS and rotating his personal CDs and externals (PS, Sac+Ironskin). Aim to get 2 breaths per head and push the head with 37s or less left on Rot Armor timer to insure that the debuff resets. Second tank picks up and kills adds (in DPS or tank spec, whichever he is comfortable doing).
    If you put your BrM on add duty, ring of peace and glyphed breathe fire trivialize the stun interrupts.
    The only tricky part about this strat is figuring out the placement of melee group for breaths, but there are plenty of guides on the internet.

    ~Oh, and what other people said about your 1 min cds not being up for 5th rampage is correct, BUT this is where pre-planned CD rotation comes in. Your pally healer either has to save light's hammer for 5th rampage and not use it during bloodlust (what I do) or have AW, DF or HA (preferably 2 our of 3) available for 5th rampage
    Last edited by chopp; 2013-07-29 at 08:45 AM.

  13. #13
    Mechagnome Sarthan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Femoris View Post
    not to be rude but that is not helpful we're already using every cd we have on a rotation. For the one we're dying on we're using smoke bomb tranq and devo aura and still dying.
    Not to be rude but he gave you the information you needed. Your raid doesn't use pots, CDs, or health stones. That is why you are failing.

  14. #14
    I don't want to turn this into a pick on the pala thread since theres a most people don't use damage reduction cd's / HS well or at all but doesn't he even have the meta gem yet? A huge load of his gear is upgraded which shows he valor caps but no legendary meta is odd to me.

  15. #15
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    Hi, we're starting this boss on wednesday and just wanted to check what you guys think of my initial plan
    (we're 10man with ~539 ilvl and 9/13 hc down)

    Comp:
    tanks: druid / prot warr (optionally protadin)
    healers: resto shamy/druid and either disc or holy.
    dps: hunter, dk, spriest, boomkin, mage (Optionally warlock/rogue/windwalker, but they're bit low on dps side...)

    Cooldown rotation for rampages:
    1st. Personals, nothing else
    2nd. rallyin cry + slt
    3rd. Tranq + barrier.
    4th. tranq + demobanner.
    5th. Rallyin cry + vamp + slt
    6th hero, barrier, personals, whatever's left.

    We'll have dk with blood pres on nether worm duty.

    Any tips would be greatly appreicated
    Last edited by santa666; 2013-07-29 at 09:48 AM.

  16. #16
    Lust on the 5th head, just not right at the start of it, its a bit of a shitty head that one so the faster it goes down the better. For the last just use whatever you've got left. If you're dying with 3 raid cd's up then I'd say either your healers are going oom due to poor cd management or people aren't using their own cooldowns properly, it's a real hectic fight when your progressing on it so everyone really needs to do whatever they can to help the healers.

    Quote Originally Posted by santa666 View Post
    Hi, we're starting this boss on wednesday and just wanted to check what you guys think of my initial plan
    (we're 10man with ~539 ilvl and 9/13 hc down)

    Comp:
    tanks: druid / prot warr (optionally protadin)
    healers: resto shamy/druid and either disc or holy.
    dps: hunter, dk, spriest, boomkin, mage (Optionally warlock/rogue/windwalker, but they're bit low on dps side...)

    Cooldown rotation for rampages:
    1st. Personals, nothing else
    2nd. rallyin cry + slt
    3rd. Tranq + demobarrier.
    4th. tranq + banner.
    5th. Rallyin cry + vamp + slt
    6th hero, barrier, personals, whatever's left.

    We'll have dk with blood pres on nether worm duty.

    Any tips would be greatly appreicated
    I wouldn't use the DK to handle the adds in blood presence as it's not needed with your setup and the loss of dps will hurt too, just use a ring of frost on 1 set then aoe them all down using solar beams and such.

    As for cd rotation, you might aswell use barrier on the first or 2nd head because it will be ready for the 5th or 6th head and you also have a HTT from the shaman which you can bang on in there, I'd recommend having an ascendance powered HTT for the 1st/5th head and barrier for the 2nd/6th head.
    Last edited by Hypasonic; 2013-07-29 at 09:32 AM.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Femoris View Post
    How do we do better on this fight we're getting to the 5th rampage and then dying every single time. Logs posted below. Thanks for your help.

    http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/r...zp/?enc=bosses
    Your brewmaster really should pick up celerity and Chi torpedo for this fight. That's about 200-300k healing/target/rampage.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hypasonic View Post
    I wouldn't use the DK to handle the adds in blood presence as it's not needed with your setup and the loss of dps will hurt too, just use a ring of frost on 1 set then aoe them all down using solar beams and such.

    As for cd rotation, you might aswell use barrier on the first or 2nd head because it will be ready for the 5th or 6th head and you also have a HTT from the shaman which you can bang on in there, I'd recommend having an ascendance powered HTT for the 1st/5th head and barrier for the 2nd/6th head.
    Cool, so just rop worms and have dps kill them before it ends/they cast ? (How many should switch, mage, hunter, boomkin is enough ?)

    What about this cd rotation?
    1st. Personals, ascendance powered HTT, nothing else
    2nd. rallyin cry + barrier
    3rd. Tranq + slt
    4th. tranq + banner + personals.
    5th. Rallyin cry + vamp + ascendance powered HTT
    6th hero, barrier, slt, personals, whatever's left.

    Preferably want a set rotation that'll work and we can start learning instantly without having to try lots of combos.
    If we struggle, i'll most likely go on protpala for hammer and BH.
    Last edited by santa666; 2013-07-29 at 10:29 AM.

  19. #19
    It will probably help if you agree with your healers when they use their own cooldowns, as well as raidcooldowns. That way you avoid the not so good healer who "forgets" to pop his wings or anything. I'd not waste anything on the first rampage.

    That said, have a rampage where everyone uses personals and healthstones. That is like one raid cooldown, as well.

    Good luck.

  20. #20
    As well as the obvious issue with the paladin, your death logs show a lot of people getting killed or partially killed by the adds. A lot are showing rampage, add, rampage for example and this shows that you are not handling the nether wyrms correctly. How long do they survive into the 5th rampage? Because they put so much unnecessary strain on the healers that it's not even funny.

    Aside from that, a lot of other people have pointed out the lack of CD usage on the part of the raid, this really is a fight where people need to look after themselves to an extent, good use of personal CDs makes a huge difference here and you should also be making use of any off-healing available to you in the later rampages. You need to really have a go at your team and have them dig through their talent trees and glyphs for anything that will help them to survive, and in the rogue's case, make him actually use his baseline class abilities.

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