LFR ToT -> Flex SoO

[Pisholina]

Here is the question I have for the people that may have tested the PTR version of SoO: How possible would you say is raiding Siege of Orgrimmar on flex mode with LFR ToT gear? I used to raid normal modes and a bit of heroic mode in WotLK and Cataclysm, so I wouldn't say skill is much of an issue.

[Deleted]

I think you are probably exactly the target audience of Flex.

[nekobaka]

The numbers are still being messed with and likely to change before hitting live. Given that the developers target for Flex is the LFR crowd I would say that it will be designed with the intent that LFR ToT geared players to be able to jump into baring any tuning screw ups like the last two tiers on 10 man. Based on your previous raid experience it sounds like you can handle if Flex tuning gets a little sloppy. Things are still subject to change given it is Flex's debut and I hope Blizzard does it proud.

[Deleted]

It depends a lot on your group really, but it won't be the gear holding you back. Flex is supposed to be tuned on the easy side, so that you will never need to get the ''best'' aka easiest size for specific bosses.

If you go with a trade pug though, I am sure they will find a way to make it hard ;p

[Trubo]

Should be fine seeing as SoO LFR will probably be doable in full T14 Normal (489/496).

[Deja Thoris]

I'd imagine 502 lfr gear would be a bit tough if it rewards 540 gear.

502 is a little low since valor gear is 522, scenarios are 516 and most people have a sprinkling of upgrades too.

[Mirishka]

While there's no exact metric for balance (as proven by fights like Horridon) in general LFR difficulty is not a good target point when discussing Flex raids. It'll be a bit harder, in between LFR and normal, but they've stated there will be a notable increase from LFR.

Flex is meant more for people who enjoyed 10man raids in Wrath and most of Cata, before they were consciously made harder in Mists. Personally I think the difficulty of normal 10s was meant as an invisible incentive to make people consider 25 raiding... 25s are much, much better balanced. Pre-nerf Horridon for example felt 100% less insane in 25 than in 10man.

[dashflash890]

I'm just looking forward to flex . I'm a middle of the pack raider. I do both lfr and normal now I only have to do is Flex and normal will never have to step into a LFR agaiN

[Lucyrotten]

I would guess that people who are LFR raiders from 5.2/5.3 with valor upgrades and scenario gear (as was mentioned) and some upgrades thrown on the better pieces will be able to progress through flex while also running SoO lfr. It's not meant to be facerolled and one shot by that audience and won't be. It should be be able to be tackled at a more leisurely pace for the friends and family guilds that liked being able to do casual 10m raiding before 10 and 25 were normalized.

[Stevecow]

LFR gear is good enough for Normal modes. It will be just fine for Flex.

[Ayreyne]

Flex is meant more for people who enjoyed 10man raids in Wrath and most of Cata, before they were consciously made harder in Mists. Personally I think the difficulty of normal 10s was meant as an invisible incentive to make people consider 25 raiding... 25s are much, much better balanced..

I'm looking at it as a way to enjoy both lock-outs again. I hated when 10 and 25 man began sharing a lockout.

[Squishei]

Flex is tuned to 506 gear (the first wing), and currently the first 2 are quite easy, whereas the last 2 of the wing are quite hard. Depending on which 2 they change it would be difficult or quite simple but we have not be able to test the later wings yet.

[Woobels]

Flex is currently very overtuned for the ilvl they give you and the designated audience of the mode.
It'll probably get nerfed substantially so it's hard to comment on right now.

[cFortyfive]

If skill really is not the issue even in the current so called overtuned status it didn't really pose any challenge.

whereas the last 2 of the wing are quite hard.

Really ? Went there with a couple friends and some randoms and well especially the sha thing in a box was really easy didn't even actually have to play the mechanics the way it was set up - those experiences might change though depending on the actual numbers of players I guess. It was still though probably too hard for the target audience so I suppose it will be even easier.

[Squishei]

If skill really is not the issue even in the current so called overtuned status it didn't really pose any challenge.

Really ? Went there with a couple friends and some randoms and well especially the sha thing in a box was really easy didn't even actually have to play the mechanics the way it was set up - those experiences might change though depending on the actual numbers of players I guess. It was still though probably too hard for the target audience so I suppose it will be even easier.

Hard is a very loose term I guess. But doin the fight the way I assume is intended not just zerging (the 3rd boss) actually added some healing strain. The 4th bosses health seemed a little high, but doable. Granted dont forget some number of people may be easier or harder depending on the fight so it's probably just all relative.

Overall wasn't terribly off though.

[Deleted]

LFR gear is good enough for Normal modes. It will be just fine for Flex.

Well, the OP asked about ToT LFR for SoO Flex, there's a larger gap in ilvl between the two. We aren't talking SoO LFR gear remember.

I'd say that it depends on your skill. Cause good raiders would be able to clear Flex SoO in ToT LFR gear - specially with gem and cloak - while casual players might find it difficult. But then again, there's VP items, crafted items and the option to upgrade. So unless you just dinged 90 and haven't got anything other than LFR gear (no gem or cloak either), then I don't think it will be an issue.

There's really only one way to find out - go try it. And if it proves too hard, go do SoO LFR first.

[Pisholina]

Well, the OP asked about ToT LFR for SoO Flex, there's a larger gap in ilvl between the two. We aren't talking SoO LFR gear remember.

I'd say that it depends on your skill. Cause good raiders would be able to clear Flex SoO in ToT LFR gear - specially with gem and cloak - while casual players might find it difficult. But then again, there's VP items, crafted items and the option to upgrade. So unless you just dinged 90 and haven't got anything other than LFR gear (no gem or cloak either), then I don't think it will be an issue.

There's really only one way to find out - go try it. And if it proves too hard, go do SoO LFR first.

That was exactly my question. I was mostly asking because of the DPS / healing / tanking requirements. Just if the tanks can survive in LFR ToT gear, if the raid can survive with that amount of healing and if the DPSers can pull the numbers to beat the enrage timers. But you make a good point, I should check it out for myself. I will follow the raid testing schedule closely.

[Deleted]

Depends on the group and how you define ToT lfr gear. If you're mixing it with however many 522's as well as upgrades you should be fine. If you're saying 502 ilvl you'll probably find it a bit rough =P.

Exactly. If you have nothing but 502 gear, it most likely won't be doable for you. Remember how people couldn't kill more than Jin'rokh in the beginning? ToT was tuned around 502 gear and previous Tier's LFR was 483. There's an even bigger gap between this Tier's LFR and the Flex mode of next Tier.

But again, if you have nothing but 502 gear, no Legendary meta gem, no cloak, no VP items - you've kinda been slacking. Try to get some Normals done now, it really isn't all that hard. There's also Heroic Scenarios with 516 ilvl gear. So just get on it and Flex mode won't be hard.

[unholyness]

Should be fine seeing as SoO LFR will probably be doable in full T14 Normal (489/496).

Lfr is 528 Item level with Flex 540 Ilevel and Normal 553, Heroic 566. 489/496 for a 528 raid? You realize the required item level is higher than that right?

[MrExcelion]

Flex is currently very overtuned for the ilvl they give you and the designated audience of the mode.
It'll probably get nerfed substantially so it's hard to comment on right now.

What he said. Got tuned to 506 (around LFR ToT) and it definitely wasn't a cakewalk when I did Flex Mode. You'll have the new LFR to do at the same time though. (should come out a week or two later)