View Poll Results: Would it upset you if LFR went away?

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  • Yes

    551 53.86%
  • No

    472 46.14%
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  1. #561
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    This has always been the most ludicrous suggestion from anyone against LFR. Why the hell would anyone want to do something week after week if there not getting anything from it.
    Because you're supposed to earn it?
    Because you're worked or are working for it? The whole point of playing this game for PvE.
    Are you gonna tell me people deserve raid finder epics just because they have the mental capabilities to know they're breathing and alive?
    How about you use that week after week to actually play the game? Doing LFR over and over every week is the saddest thing ever, its like watching a youtube video of the boss kills while you eat some popcorn where you don't progress, just always stuck doing the same brain dead raid.

    Goddamn I'm actually starting to feel bad for people that run LFR.

  2. #562
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    Because you're supposed to earn it?
    Because you're worked or are working for it? The whole point of playing this game for PvE.
    Are you gonna tell me people deserve raid finder epics just because they have the mental capabilities to know they're breathing and alive?
    How about you use that week after week to actually play the game? Doing LFR over and over every week is the saddest thing ever, its like watching a youtube video of the boss kills while you eat some popcorn where you don't progress, just always stuck doing the same brain dead raid.

    Goddamn I'm actually starting to feel bad for people that run LFR.
    Jesus, what the hell is this game, a job now? Do I get paid vacations and healthcare?

    I'm "earning" lower ilvl epics for doing an easy mode raid. You're earning higher ilvl epics for doing a harder mode raid.

    So what exactly is the problem? Are you upset because the text on my gear is still purple? That the models are the same? That somehow me running around in LFR tier deflates your self esteem when you run around in Heroic tier?

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  3. #563
    A stupid question, blizz will never stop lfr, period...

  4. #564
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    How the hell does me going into LFR ruin your raid? Not a single anti-LFR has come up with an answer to this other than "it devalues my epix!!!!!!"
    It doesn't ruin our raid, but the fact that it has a separate lockout and is the fastest way to gear makes us who don't want to do it because we find it boring, have to do it to excel in our preferred difficulty, especially on alts. I think LFR is great for people like you who want to see the content, but the reward shouldn't be so great, it should have rewards, just not ones that are that appealing.

  5. #565
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    He's also tweeted that LFR isn't going anywhere so threads like this are pretty much an exercise in wasting time and chest-pounding. The reality is that making threads about this more or less speaks to the thought that anti-LFR folks really have nothing else to talk about.
    I think what these kinds of threads show is that LFR is a deep, philosophical threat to certain players. LFR doesn't directly affect them, but the success of LFR directly threatens their world view, that difficulty is what makes a successful game.

    In a bass-ackwards way, they have a point. The success of LFR does threaten their philosophy, by showing how flawed and unrealistic it is. And this is another step on the path to game companies catering to people who like easier content, not hardcore minority content.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler

  6. #566
    Titan Adam Jensen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Exilium View Post
    It doesn't ruin our raid, but the fact that it has a separate lockout and is the fastest way to gear makes us who don't want to do it because we find it boring, have to do it to excel in our preferred difficulty, especially on alts. I think LFR is great for people like you who want to see the content, but the reward shouldn't be so great, it should have rewards, just not ones that are that appealing.
    You don't "have to" do it. You're forcing yourself to do it because of a perceived benefit. You can raid normal without setting foot in LFR. You're the one deciding that you "have to" do it. Not Blizzard, not LFR players, you.

    If a video game developer removed tumors from players, they'd whine about nerfing their loss in weight and access to radiation powers. -Cracked.com

  7. #567
    Quote Originally Posted by Trassk View Post
    Fact of the matter is this. LFR works. It does exactly what its made to do, and it doesn't screw up the game, make anything hard for anyone else, its just there for something to do for all the people that do it.

    The only negative thing with it.. and the whining elitists who bitch and moan about it because they don't feel like special snowflakes. So really, there isn't anything wrong with it period.
    Pretty much this. I don't even do LFR unless I want a piece for transmog (white/gold warrior T15 = win) and I'm probably more tired of the idiots crying about LFR ruining 'their game' than the people who actually need LFR are.

    For one thing: its not 'their' game. Its Blizzard's. For another, grow up a bit and stop throwing hissy fits about what other people have or have access to. Most people outgrow that around the age of six-seven. Its laughably pathetic to see hundreds if not thousands of 'adults' raging and acting so childishly about this stuff.

  8. #568
    Warchief marthsk's Avatar
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    I'd be happy if all LFR threads, especially those like this one that are veiled as a question, and most importantly, each and every OP that ever started a LFR thread, would go away and never post again.
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  9. #569
    For my own experience, not particularly as I'd only continue to make time for WoW if I was still raiding in guilds that cleared everything on normal at least. In principle I would be pissed though, as it would almost definitely be for removed for one of the unbelievably stupid and petty reasons that make up 95% of the reasons people dislike LFR.

  10. #570
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    Quote Originally Posted by Osmeric View Post
    And this is another step on the path to game companies catering to people who like easier content, not hardcore minority content.
    Well, there is also the fact that for some people, the difficulty/challenge is what makes a good game. That their opinion may now be minority opinion, does not detract from the merit of their complaints. Conversely, one could say of those who like LFR that they believe a lack of difficulty is what makes a good game; neither side of the argument had any more merit than the other, but it just so happens that those who prefer an easy experience are in the majority, and thus they will be catered to.
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  11. #571
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    You don't "have to" do it. You're forcing yourself to do it because of a perceived benefit. You can raid normal without setting foot in LFR. You're the one deciding that you "have to" do it. Not Blizzard, not LFR players, you.
    Okay, we're not technically FORCED to do it, but when your on a raid team not doing it is detrimental to the groups success in normal mode, some trinkets and set bonuses are very important, not to mention legendary quest progress. You can have your LFR, it just shouldn't be a shared lockout, why would you even need a separate lockout?

  12. #572
    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    Because you're supposed to earn it?
    Because you're worked or are working for it? The whole point of playing this game for PvE.
    Are you gonna tell me people deserve raid finder epics just because they have the mental capabilities to know they're breathing and alive?
    How about you use that week after week to actually play the game? Doing LFR over and over every week is the saddest thing ever, its like watching a youtube video of the boss kills while you eat some popcorn where you don't progress, just always stuck doing the same brain dead raid.

    Goddamn I'm actually starting to feel bad for people that run LFR.
    Funny, because I actually feel bad for people like you, who take a video game so seriously that you actually let it get to you to this degree. And no, I'm not a 'casual' who runs LFR. I'm just someone who is mature enough to understand that *my* preferred way to play the game is not automatically the way everyone else should have to.

    I don't mean this as an insult, I really don't. But I couldn't imagine being so childish or petty as your post makes you sound. Earn? Working for it? Those are words that apply to things like a promotion at work/successful career, a college degree, or having a better marriage/family. World of Warcraft, as many of you seem to have forgotten along the way at some point, is a video game. Its Super Mario Bros with 7.7million people. When you die, do you really think you're going to be remembered for a damn thing you did in WoW?

    "RIP John Doe. Loving father, devoted husband... OH AND LOL SERVER FIRST ONYXIA KILL SCRUBZ"

    Somehow, I very much doubt it.

  13. #573
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    Jesus, what the hell is this game, a job now? Do I get paid vacations and healthcare?

    I'm "earning" lower ilvl epics for doing an easy mode raid. You're earning higher ilvl epics for doing a harder mode raid.

    So what exactly is the problem? Are you upset because the text on my gear is still purple? That the models are the same? That somehow me running around in LFR tier deflates your self esteem when you run around in Heroic tier?
    Its supposed to be fun to earn shit.
    The second you see a game as a job is the second you should just get out, or get paid.
    When we have people with this mentality of "I PAEY 15 BUCKS A MONTH GUISE GIVE ME FREE EPICS" shit just hurts the game.

    and yes people were forced to do that shit at the start of every tier, everyone. From filthy casual to world first guilds, just to get that powerful set bonus or trinket that was not dropping on real raids.

  14. #574
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    I would most likely quit if LFR went away.
    The guild I'm in now has raiding teams and I'm unlucky enough to have joined late.
    Love the guild but no guild raids for me so I see the content with LFR only.
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  15. #575
    Quote Originally Posted by marthsk View Post
    I'd be happy if all LFR threads, especially those like this one that are veiled as a question, and most importantly, each and every OP that ever started a LFR thread, would go away and never post again.
    I agree 100% with you.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    and yes people were forced to do that shit at the start of every tier, everyone. From filthy casual to world first guilds, just to get that powerful set bonus or trinket that was not dropping on real raids.
    Uh oh.... looks like sommmmmebody forgot that LFR is locked, without exception, at the start of the each raid tier - unlocked in wings over the course of weeks and even months, when the guilds that actually clear content when it matters have normal modes on farm.

    So yeah the whole 'OMG HARDCORE WURLD FIRST GILDZ HAVE 2 DO LFR TOO OMGWTF' argument is kind of a bunch of horseshit.

  16. #576
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Jensen View Post
    How the hell does me going into LFR ruin your raid? Not a single anti-LFR has come up with an answer to this other than "it devalues my epix!!!!!!"
    Allright I'll do my best to address this. A vast majority of this is based on my own observations playing since release. For some background to give you perspective, in Vnailla I did BGs primarily with a LOT of UBRS runs as a druid. In BC I PVPd with some Kara raiding as a hunter. In wrath I casual AND hardcore raided as a hunter. In Cata I casual dungeons and light pug raids. In Panda I primarily have done LFR. I'll start with the devalue epix argument.

    Epics used to be something to strive for. In most games, people strive to be as good as they can be and to be what is best. It's why MOBS and Shooters have rankings. It's why people actually try and win in near every player vs player type game. MMO RPGs, like pen and paper RPGS were about this same concept except against a non player entity. You tried to clear the whole thing. You certainly didn't HAVE to, nor were you really expected to. It was like trying to get a high score on an arcade game. You simply tried to get as far as you could get. Epics were the equivalent to having your initials on a high score.

    I can really only offer my own perspective as a non raider (except for in Wrath) from here on out. This meant cool looking gear had value, as things that are rare tend to have. When I saw someone in raid epics it was cool. I knew they must be good or devoted and know a lot. And it was a driving force for me to keep going. I wanted some purple text for myself. There were other ways of getting epics of course, though they were long and tedious, either through crafting or long quest chains. Those things are why I logged on every day.

    Devaluing raiding is another point. Before LFR I pugged, or tried to. I had a lot of fun doing it. I think ice crown was probably the pinnacle for pugging with its stacking debuff/buff/whatever. It was nice because even the people I know who were super casual or even downright bad, made progress with pugs. Wanting to see the raid was a pretty large motivator as was the gear to a lesser extent. While progression was much slower than a raiding guild, it ensured I wasn't "done" with the raid in a couple weeks time. I kept going back, trying to form a better and better pug to progress further and further. Honestly, after a couple weeks in LFR, having killed all the bosses, I lose near all interest in stepping into LFR again, even for the gear.

    Now a different point, I know many people who don't care to play anymore. These people have been playing for YEARS, some since burning crusade, some since wrath, some since day one. Why is it they all get the desire to leave at the same time? Certainly it isn't just that the game wore it's welcome at the same time for everyone. You see there is something wrong with over convenience. Some things that are good for the players, aren't necessarily good for the game itself. In an MMO an important aspect, one that WoW used to have, is that it felt like a world. Many things detracted from this, flying mounts probably being the first. Then there was the prominence of ports for everything. Then there was instant teleports into dungeons and then the same for raids, LFR. Cross server is something that didn't help with this either. At the same time, crafting became much more bleh, but quicker to get through and people wound up with tons of money, meaning they could buy what they wanted without need of leaving the AH. No more being in the world. Inconvenience lends itself to a stronger feeling of "world" and made thigns take longer making people be on longer.

    Harming the social aspect is what is next. I met a lot of players pugging, and a lot of guilds I would later join. I soon learned who TO invite and who NOT to. I had a lot of fun interactive with these people. LFR has non of that, no required communication and I don't think I've ever added a single person to my friends list who was from LFR. You could say, "go form a pug" as many people do. But as Blizzard says, people are always more likely to take the path of least resistance and this isn't just about me, it's about what the community is doing. It's the fact that the community at large seems to be failing to make the social connections anymore outside of who you think is witty and funny in trade chat.

    Lastly, WoW changing means other MMOs have changed. This isn't universal as I'm sure you can find examples of MMOs that try and be "old school" or what have you. But since WoW is the number one MMO making the most money, it is the one most oftenly mimicked. This means a lot of what comes out is catered to the same more "casual" demographic. So because of WoW changing, the MMO genre overall has changed away from the group who originally supported it.

    LFR isn't the prime cause for many of these things, but it definitely is a part of all of them.

  17. #577
    Quote Originally Posted by Muradu View Post
    Well, there is also the fact that for some people, the difficulty/challenge is what makes a good game. That their opinion may now be minority opinion, does not detract from the merit of their complaints.
    Oh, I'm not saying they don't have a right to their personal preferences. What they're doing, though, is trying to use those personal preferences to conclude that the feature is objectively bad, or failed, or immoral, or something. And I suspect that's because the success of the feature is deeply, personally threatening to their Weltanschauung.
    "There is a pervasive myth that making content hard will induce players to rise to the occasion. We find the opposite. " -- Ghostcrawler
    "Almost every time I have gotten to know a critic personally, they keep up with the criticism but lose the venom." -- Ghostcrawler

  18. #578
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I agree 100% with you.

    - - - Updated - - -



    Uh oh.... looks like sommmmmebody forgot that LFR is locked, without exception, at the start of the each raid tier - unlocked in wings over the course of weeks and even months, when the guilds that actually clear content when it matters have normal modes on farm.

    So yeah the whole 'OMG HARDCORE WURLD FIRST GILDZ HAVE 2 DO LFR TOO OMGWTF' argument is kind of a bunch of horseshit.
    You never had x tier never drop ever for months? or a trinket like rune?
    I've done quon and the bird boss over 10 times on heroic and still no boots or belt. coining every week. 25 man. Of course I have crafted and rep replacements but what if it was a tier piece or a trinket, would be an upgrade even as lfr version.
    nice autism
    Last edited by Skadovsk; 2013-08-07 at 06:13 PM.

  19. #579
    Quote Originally Posted by Skadovsk View Post
    You never had x tier never drop ever for months? or a trinket like rune?
    I've done quon and the bird boss over 10 times on heroic and still no boots or belt. coin included.
    nice autism
    Missing the point.

    True Hardcore Guilds have fully cleared Normals before the first LFR wing even opened. Somehow, they magically did this without their precious tier bonuses or OP'd trinkets. Anyone that feels they can't do the same thing isn't Hardcore by that definition, but only by the definition that means they will spend an unnecessary amount of time trying to get every single numerical advantage they can to compensate for the fact that they are not as good as they think they are.

    All while belittling LFR and those that are quite content with it.

    And if you are clearing heroic, then why do you need shit from LFR?

  20. #580
    Quote Originally Posted by Deathgoose View Post
    Missing the point.

    True Hardcore Guilds have fully cleared Normals before the first LFR wing even opened. Somehow, they magically did this without their precious tier bonuses or OP'd trinkets. Anyone that feels they can't do the same thing isn't Hardcore by that definition, but only by the definition that means they will spend an unnecessary amount of time trying to get every single numerical advantage they can to compensate for the fact that they are not as good as they think they are.

    All while belittling LFR and those that are quite content with it.

    And if you are clearing heroic, then why do you need shit from LFR?
    Well the idea is they do LFR in conjunction with normal/heroic. Because there are the few pieces that will be unlucky and not drop for them outside LFR. In that case LFR drops do offer a decent upgrade, albeit a temporary one.

    Also running LFR and normal/heroic concurrently means double the chance of gear drops, even if some of that gear isnt the best, it could still be a temporary upgrade, especially where set bonuses are involved.

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