And just when you thought the NSA spying couldn't get ANY worse...

[Laize]

We find out that the DEA has been using information that Obama spent the last few months assuring us would not be used to prosecute non-terrorist Americans... to prosecute non-terrorist Americans.

What's more, the agents have been coached on how to conceal the source of the information they got so that no one outside of the highest echelons of the executive branch know where the information came from. They're essentially doing what money launderers do... except they're putting people in jail with it.

I shouldn't be surprised... but I am.

Off I go... to write another letter to my congressmen.

[Deleted]

pointless to write any letters to anyone, they do what they wanna do and you elect them.... not that it would be different if you elected someone else

[Archangel Tyrael]

It's the GOP's fault.

I mean, Obama can't do anything because of congress, no, actually, I mean, you're a racist, no one is perfect, Obama is doing the best he can!

[smelltheglove]

in before the "if you have nothing to hide" crowd shows up

[Raptor With a Saber]

SO criminals went to jail, don't see anything wrong with that.

[Kalyyn]

Aside from making history's best attempt at creating a live reenactment of Fahrenheit 451, they're also moving most of the NSA's server administration over to automated control.
http://www.dailytech.com/NSA+to+Axe+...ticle33145.htm

It's not quite Skynet, but that certainly won't stop me from calling it that.

[s_bushido]

Today, the SOD offers at least three services to federal, state and local law enforcement agents: coordinating international investigations such as the Bout case; distributing tips from overseas NSA intercepts, informants, foreign law enforcement partners and domestic wiretaps; and circulating tips from a massive database known as DICE.

The DICE database contains about 1 billion records, the senior DEA officials said. The majority of the records consist of phone log and Internet data gathered legally by the DEA through subpoenas, arrests and search warrants nationwide. Records are kept for about a year and then purged, the DEA officials said.

Wiretap tips forwarded by the SOD usually come from foreign governments, U.S. intelligence agencies or court-authorized domestic phone recordings. Because warrantless eavesdropping on Americans is illegal, tips from intelligence agencies are generally not forwarded to the SOD until a caller's citizenship can be verified, according to one senior law enforcement official and one former U.S. military intelligence analyst.

So...you're upset that they won't tell you where the initial tip came from (from which they go back and build a case) or that they're receiving tips in the first place?

[DarkTZeratul]

Aside from making history's best attempt at creating a live reenactment of Fahrenheit 451...

Gotta say, I find it hilarious that everyone knows Fahrenheit 451 is about a world in which books are banned and burned, but nobody who hasn't read the book even remotely understands why.

[Wilian]

Waiting for more pro anti-privacy apologists to enter thread.

[Kalyyn]

in before the "if you have nothing to hide" crowd shows up

I'm usually part of that crowd, but I draw the line at the internet. The internet is our last bastion of lawlessness. It's the only place you can go where rules do not apply. If we start policing the internet, where else is there to go?

[Angoth]

SO criminals went to jail, don't see anything wrong with that.

without the ability to learn the source of the damning evidence. This prevents them from being able to find any evidence of their innocence from the same or related sources. Basically, it keeps them from being able to mount a defense against ghosts.

So, they might not be real criminals. We just have to take the prosecution's word for it.

[Wilian]

I'm usually part of that crowd, but I draw the line at the internet. The internet is our last bastion of lawlessness. It's the only place you can go where rules do not apply. If we start policing the internet, where else is there to go?

Hand-written messages you give out personally.

[Kalyyn]

Gotta say, I find it hilarious that everyone knows Fahrenheit 451 is about a world in which books are banned and burned, but nobody who hasn't read the book even remotely understands why.

Well, my interpretation was that the government was attempting to control the information that people were consuming. They wanted to protect the country from "dangerous knowledge".

Do you disagree?

Also, I could be wrong, but I'm about 99% sure I've read that book.

[Wilian]

Well, my interpretation was that the government was attempting to control the information that people were consuming. They wanted to protect the country from "dangerous knowledge".

Do you disagree?

That is Orwellian, not Fahrenheit stuff.

[smelltheglove]

I'm usually part of that crowd, but I draw the line at the internet. The internet is our last bastion of lawlessness. It's the only place you can go where rules do not apply. If we start policing the internet, where else is there to go?

considering that it is a vehicle for communication, it makes a lot more sense than warrantless searches of physical property. not that i advocate privacy violations in either case

[Laize]

So...you're upset that they won't tell you where the initial tip came from (from which they go back and build a case) or that they're receiving tips in the first place?

The tips are from SOD. SOD generates the tips via NSA wiretaps.

Do you really not see the problem here?

[Kalyyn]

That is Orwellian, not Fahrenheit stuff.

I think the whole point of the book is summed up by Montag's conversation with Captain Beatty. It's been a very long time since I've read it, but it was Beatty basically telling Montag that books were dangerous because the ideas could hurt people. They could offend them, anger them, or provoke them to violence. So the books had to be burned.

We're currently in something which vaguely resembles a digital-age version of that.

[SL1200]

This doesn't surprise me at all. What does surprise me is that people are surprised about it. I think it's wrong, but they've been doing it for many many years and nobody said a word.

[Al Gorefiend]

in before the "if you have nothing to hide" crowd shows up

Sounds the trumpets, here comes my chariot

in before the "if you have nothing to hide" crowd shows up

Fear not citizen, I have arrived.

A country relies on stability and security by guarding itself from the outside and inside. I'd rather the government knows what I had for breakfast than to not know where a mass-murdering terrorist could potentially be hiding.

[s_bushido]

The tips are from SOD. SOD generates the tips via NSA wiretaps.

Do you really not see the problem here?

They said in that very article that the NSA isn't their only source of information...

And that's not even what the defense lawyers are concerned about.