Bottom Lane - Bad team or am I noob?

[Hraklea]

So, I'm coming back to LoL after a time not playing any MOBA (actually, I played once in a while against DotA 2 bots), and yesterday happened something - 3 times, I think - that I'm not sure if I'm wrong or not.

As far as I know, the bottom lane is where the "AD Carrier + Support" goes, correct? Is the goal of the AD Carrier to be there farming or should the AD Carrier and the Support push the lane and pressure the turret? Because I saw people pushing (even when I was the ADC, my Support was AoE'ing the creeps like crazy), and it seems to me that, if I push the lane, the opposing jungler will gank me from behind.

Is it right or wrong to try to stay under your turret, protecting yourself from ganks, as much as possible in the lane phase as ADC? Should I, as ADC, push the lane?

Thanks.

[Deleted]

Always assume you're the one who could improve. Even if your team was bad, look for ways you could have helped your team rather than just how they were terrible and you were ok.
Sorry for no specific advice, but generic philosophical advice is what's needed here; don't blame others, improve yourself.

[Halyon]

So, I'm coming back to LoL after a time not playing any MOBA (actually, I played once in a while against DotA 2 bots), and yesterday happened something - 3 times, I think - that I'm not sure if I'm wrong or not.

As far as I know, the bottom lane is where the "AD Carrier + Support" goes, correct? Is the goal of the AD Carrier to be there farming or should the AD Carrier and the Support push the lane and pressure the turret? Because I saw people pushing (even when I was the ADC, my Support was AoE'ing the creeps like crazy), and it seems to me that, if I push the lane, the opposing jungler will gank me from behind.

Is it right or wrong to try to stay under your turret, protecting yourself from ganks, as much as possible in the lane phase as ADC? Should I, as ADC, push the lane?

Thanks.

If you have the advantage in skill/champions, you should push, within reason. Your support MUST ward in that case to prevent your ass from being shredded by the jungler. However, supports aoe'ing the minions will mess up last hitting, so that isn't your fault, that's them being jerks. If you're premade you can communicate and agree on things on the fly, that's a bit harder when you have some random person who may play a different way then you, and it may work well with some other people, but doesn't mean it works for everyone. That's why I always try the hardest to get either top mid or jungle.

- - - Updated - - -

Always assume you're the one who could improve. Even if your team was bad, look for ways you could have helped your team rather than just how they were terrible and you were ok.
Sorry for no specific advice, but generic philosophical advice is what's needed here; don't blame others, improve yourself.

This is also a good point.

[Hraklea]

...don't blame others, improve yourself.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to imply that my losses were not my fault.

[Itakas]

What neveryevery said is pretty ok in general about most of lanes. My exp from bot lane, it varies a lot on enemy and your sup/adc/jung how to play it. I usualy play sup if i am bot and with good ward placing + looking at mini map you can push the t1 tower easy without fear of enemy jungler ruining your day. Ofc the adc should always get the last hits on mobs. The down side of early tower push is that your jungler has a hard time ganking since only option to really gank is tower dive and ofc without good wards and map awereness you are easy target for ganks. The good side is that the enemy adc might/will lose some cs because of tower kills and after you kill the t1 tower you open new gank paths for your jungler/rest of team.

All in all, its comes down to how is your bot partner playing, if he is going poke style and you play def you will lose and the other way around. So try and adjust your play to what sup/adc is doing and you should be ok. Ofc nothign can be done if the person you are playing with bot is just plain bad, but thats another problem.

[Farolok]

Once you learn about bot lane match ups you'll know when it's right to be farming under turret or pushing lane. If you're in a pairing that can easily win a trade 2v2 and your support is warding, sure, go ahead and push the lane. If you're in a lane you know you can't win a straight up fight in, farm under turret.

[Deleted]

You don't need to push the lane. Your #1 goal is to farm and get ahead in CS. Your support should never steal creep kills from you.
Depending on the matchup you might be forced to farm under tower. Tho this makes it harder for you to farm it makes it easier for your jungler or mid to gank. Missing some CS is nothing compared to getting killed.

[StNimrod]

In some match ups it's actually good to push under the enemy turret so that enemy ADC has harder time farming and falls behind because of that.

[Hraklea]

Thanks for all the answers, guys.

[Deleted]

Worth noting that at low levels, very few people seem to support, and even those with support characters seem to like cs'ing and pushing - i got yelled at so much when i created a new account on a different region and went support at low levels because people said I wasn't doing anything / was useless when they saw my score. So I wouldn't expect too much if you're levelling an account.

[Isotope]

You don't need to push the lane. Your #1 goal is to farm and get ahead in CS. Your support should never steal creep kills from you.
Depending on the matchup you might be forced to farm under tower. Tho this makes it harder for you to farm it makes it easier for your jungler or mid to gank. Missing some CS is nothing compared to getting killed.

While the goal is to farm, it is also to try and deny the other ADC as much CS as possible. This can come from freezing him out by harassment from a good support or making him farm under turret.

As for the OP, it's a bit of both. You want to get as much farm as you can and if you're winning your lane you really want to pressure the turret. This will force the enemy jungler to have to come down to deal with you which will ease the strain on other lanes. Giving them a better chance to win their lane.

[Isrozzis]

It is ok, and even encouraged, to push the lane in certain situations. If you have good ward coverage, so there is very little chance that the enemy jungler will get to you without walking through a ward first, then you can try to shove the wave under their turret in an attempt to deny them some cs to the turret.

However, if your support is not warding then it is inadvisable to do so. You leave yourself wide open to a gank. On another note, if your support is not warding at all, buy some yourself and put them where they should go. You should always encourage your support to buy more wards if they aren't buying enough, but sometimes you have to just buy them yourself. As you get into higher elos, this becomes less of a problem.

Ideally you want the lane to freeze just out of your tower range, so you can CS without the tower interfering and it is risky for the other side to run that far down bot lane and get the CS. It is rather hard to freeze the lane in that spot though, so the lane usually ends up somewhere in the middle.

[Hraklea]

You should always encourage your support to buy more wards if they aren't buying enough, but sometimes you have to just buy them yourself.

This leads to another question: I have been reading a few "how to ward guides", and it seems really hard to have gold to ward every spot that should be warded. Is the support player supposed to pick the best spots or the other players should be helping too, in a smaller scale?

[Duilliath]

Both, really.

[Isrozzis]

This leads to another question: I have been reading a few "how to ward guides", and it seems really hard to have gold to ward every spot that should be warded. Is the support player supposed to pick the best spots or the other players should be helping too, in a smaller scale?

More or less. Sightstone makes it much more gold efficient to keep multiple spots warded, so your support should always have one. It's generally a good idea to get a ward or two when you back just in general. They are good for warding bushes that you might otherwise facecheck, or for dropping in a bush as you chase someone so you don't lose vision. I would not recommend a sightstone on an AD carry, but getting a few wards is a good habit to get into to. If your support is warding well, you can just save them 'till when you need them. And believe me, there is never a time when wards aren't needed.

[Shiny212]

The support should seldom touch the minions, they're yours, and unless you're playing something very aggressive or have a good chance to do some turret damage without getting killed by the jungler, you wanna last hit only, and not push the lane.

[Isotope]

This leads to another question: I have been reading a few "how to ward guides", and it seems really hard to have gold to ward every spot that should be warded. Is the support player supposed to pick the best spots or the other players should be helping too, in a smaller scale?

You have to take into context that those warding guides aren't a "You must have a ward here 24/7 guide. If you know you're team is going to make a play on dragon or dragon is about to come up. It's a good idea to ward dragon.

A good rule of thumb is this. Don't pink ward dragon if you or the other team just killed it. It's a waste as by the time the other team puts another ward there it will be about 4min later and your ward will be gone. If you see their jungle top and their mid mid, don't worry about warding just yet. It will save you around 35-45sec on a ward which can be huge. Late game if you know you're going to pushing top ward top side jungle, same with bot. If you're team is the one being pushed ward your jungle.

[Tsuna]

In the competitive scene high pressure lanes do tend to perform well. In the american LCS in particular team Cloud 9 HyperX often commands the game by putting extreme pressure on their duo'd lane by sending their Jungler to push down the first turret as early as possible to establish an early global gold + vision advantage.

[Isotope]

In the competitive scene high pressure lanes do tend to perform well. In the american LCS in particular team Cloud 9 HyperX often commands the game by putting extreme pressure on their duo'd lane by sending their Jungler to push down the first turret as early as possible to establish an early global gold + vision advantage.

You can't really do that much anymore with the 3.10 patch changes. Also, almost all the teams did that in the spring split and they moved away from that in the summer split. It will be interesting to see when the LCS moves to the 3.10 patch how C9 will adapt to what the other teams have been doing for a few months now.

[vep]

Is it right or wrong to try to stay under your turret, protecting yourself from ganks, as much as possible in the lane phase as ADC? Should I, as ADC, push the lane?

It's right to hug the turret if the enemy bot lane is doing a lot better than you and pokes you too much for your support to be able to handle.
It's wrong to hug the turret in nearly every other situation.
You shouldn't really push your lane in the early game. For like 10 minutes you should strive to freezing the lane, merely last hitting minions and following your support into trades.


You should really make the most of your support. For instance, I usually play Nami as support and I build a lot of mana regeneration so I can poke and heal with my W. I try and focus on denying the enemy AD carry from farming by poking with W and Q. I expect my ad carry to follow up on poking when he sees my Q go off. Although most people I meet are too slow but doesn't matter.
And don't rage at your support.... Yesterday I was playing a game with me on Nami with a Draven ad carry and I've gotten a couple of kills in the lane instead of my carry. Everyone was raging at me but they failed to realize that I had secured the kills when my adc wasn't able to. And there was one time when we were pushing the turret and Soraka was guarding it. I decided to go for a kill while the carry decided to go for the turret. So I use everything I've got and kill her while the carry didn't attack her even once. Needless to say, I got blamed for kill stealing...

And also, there is no kill stealing. KS stands for kill secured. Learn to play by that rule and you will have a much easier time.