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  1. #41
    The Insane Slowpoke is a Gamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trollfat View Post
    Yeah, nerf shamans dps when warlocks can healthstone, soulstone, summon portals to make certain encounters trivial, and immune certain mechanics. Makes total sense.
    I think Shaman could do with nerfs anyway for balance's sake.

    But yeah, the system shouldn't be totally upheaved to make sure subtlety is on top.
    Sometimes I think I should have rolled a Priest....


  2. #42
    I don't see why we are debating the issue. There is no should about it, pure DPS do more damage than hybrids right now. Now whether or not that is something that should be by whatever margin is another thing. Personally, I find it absurd to discuss a 5% hybrid tax over pures when they have a bad enough time achieving parity among the separate classes and specs that tossing in arbitrary value of distinction such as 5% or 10% is downright farcical.
    You wanna off heal in raids, roll a hybrid, because right now with a de facto hybrid tax already in place many hybrids are considering (if they havnt already) rerolling mages or warlocks.

  3. #43
    Titan Kangodo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Extrakt View Post
    The hybrid tax is from TBC and it should stay there.
    They never stopped with the hybrid-tax ideology.
    Quote Originally Posted by klaps_05 View Post
    up to wrath there used to be some difference. now theres none since they removed hybrid tax.
    1. The Hybrid-tax never left.
    2. Hybrid-tax is only a context, you will probably never notice this in game. It's a psychological thing to keep people with "pure-classes" happy.
    3. The difference in Classic/TBC had nothing to do with taxing, it had everything to do with bad balance.

    Let me tell you about Hybrid tax and what it does:
    Pure classes are happy because they are intended to top the meters.
    Hybrid classes are happy because they are actually topping the meters.
    Conclusion: Everyone is happy in the game.

  4. #44
    Scarab Lord Mokoshne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    It's a psychological thing to keep people with "pure-classes" happy.
    Given how far the game has gone and how much homogenised the pures are in terms of self healing and utility that they bring now, what difference does it make. Everyone is a hybrid now.

    Rogues - recup
    mage - evocate heal urself
    warlock - all their bs mechanics
    hunter - feign, deterence do a double backflip

    What makes a pure a pure has been gone for along time now.
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  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Mokoshne View Post
    Given how far the game has gone and how much homogenised the pures are in terms of self healing and utility that they bring now, what difference does it make. Everyone is a hybrid now.

    Rogues - recup
    mage - evocate heal urself
    warlock - all their bs mechanics
    hunter - feign, deterence do a double backflip

    What makes a pure a pure has been gone for along time now.
    Some people are deranged in their belief that I'm going to drop shadowform to off heal that fool warlock who can't mitigate his own damage. Hell, the few occasions that I have done some off healing don't deserve a 5% penalty. Vampiric Embrace is pretty nice, but it's about the only CD we have and I see it more along the lines of a utility CD than off healing to be off set with some sort of damage penalty.

  6. #46
    Personally I feel if they want to leave in the hybrid tax they need to strip healing from pure classes as well as some utility and give it back to the hybrids like it was in TBC. Since we're not likely to see that ever happen though they should just do away with the hybrid tax because frankly at this point the lines between hybrid and pure are far to blurred with all classes being able to heal or pure classes providing even more utility then some hybrids.

  7. #47
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wow View Post
    While making all pures hybrids probably will never happen they should make sure that pures make up for their lack of flexibility with more utility than hybrids.
    See, making the pures hybrids in today's age seems to be moving the game forward (class flexibility is pretty huge especially since not having it tends to make "required alts" more and more).

    On the flip side making a hybrid tax is just moving the game backwards.

  8. #48
    Lol no. If you ask me, there should be zero heals in posession of any spec beyond a healer one. Then, when all this shit removed, all non-healer specs should be given def cooldowns based not on raid healing but on mitigating incoming damage instead and/or dps increase cooldowns. Then, when this part is finished, damage of all dps specs should be made equal.
    Because:
    - Playing healer sucks nowadays since every random spec has a healing ability. We, healers, are perfectly capable of doing our job in raids and we need no "help" in pure healing.
    - We healers can't tank anything, can't help tanking anything, can't equally dps. Then why the hell should tanks and dps do our job?
    - It is a very much shit design if you can't reach #1 in charts just because you play wrong class. Until such class disparity exists, no words can be spoken about "balance".
    OR
    - Blizz should make classes that do less damage because of hybrid tax to posess some valueable abilities which no pure specs have. Because you can't make pure dps classes like warlock or warrior that bring a shitton of utility while owning meters, and in the same time some hybrids like SP bring miserable utility while doing miserable damage.
    Last edited by l33t; 2013-08-15 at 07:30 PM.

  9. #49
    Titan Kangodo's Avatar
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    Oooh, really?
    -I still prefer my healer to anything else, those minuscule self-heals don't impact my ability to top meters.
    That small heal that rogues (and other classes) have do not impact the fun I have when playing my healer.
    -DPS don't want to heal? They need a survival tool for solo'ing.
    -I have seen every class top the meters, most of the time it is skill and gear involved.

    Shadow Priests doing crappy damage has nothing to do with hybrid tax.

  10. #50
    If I had the final say in tweeking stats and abilities the DPS Chart would be topped by pure DPS with DPS/Tanks bouncing around in there. (Mage, Warlock, Warrior, Rogue, Hunter, Death Knight) Then Hybrids with the most inconsistent or complicated Offhealing. (Cat, Boomkin, Retribution, Windwalker) Then finishing up with the strongest offhealing DPS staying near or on the bottom. (Shadow Priests, Elemental and Enhancement)

    It really doesn't make any sense to see Enhancement Shaman and Retribution Paladins placing in the top at different gear levels throughout a patch when they bring so much raid utility. No Shaman, Druid, Paladin, Monk (If they continue with adding healing buffs to Windwalker's 5.4 toolset.) or Priest should ever be near the top DPS.

  11. #51
    I'll still out dps you /mage lol. Anyhow I am conflicted in this personally. I get that hybrids are dpsing and such may never have intent to heal or tank what have you. I just feel if things are going to be equal please give classes that bring little to the group besides damage should have something. Now a days it isn't about buffs its all about the raid cd's and as a mage I don't care (okay I do a bit) about my self survival its helpful on somethings but I don't feel like I'm helping my raid, the biggest help I do for my raid is I kill mobs fast, I don't do anything outside of that. When I'm on my warrior I feel beneficial to the group when I use rally or demo banner (usually both together) because I can sit there and be like "oh people dying let me help them out" (obviously in raids they're organized into groupings to be used). On my mage when people start dying I can't do anything to help them besides sit there and keep killing things...
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