The 5.4 trailer showcases the need for new vanilla models over new races.

[Ineluki]

No I'm sorry but a distinction needs to be made and players need to get this through their thick skulls: claiming something is a "need" when it isn't is a surefire way to make sure Blizzard digs in their heels and ignores feedback. You are only doing yourself and others a disservice by devaluing potential constructive feedback in such a way. It boggles my mind that people still can't grasp this even nearly 9 years later.

I dont think you get it, Im actually quite happy with both my Belf and Undead. They are both completely armored and you cant see the models anyway. I do feel that for Blizzard to be competitive from a business stand point they need to have models that arent terrible like the vanilla/bc models. Someone coming from one of those other games is going to log in for the first time and be confronted with these really ugly models, and you know what they say about first impressions...

[xanzul]

You dont have to dethrone WoW to be competition, with the large number of MMOs on the market, and many of them being decent, that means WoW does have a lot of competition to think about. 400K players playing another MMO is potentially 400K not playing WoW(potentially meaning some could be playing both). You dont stay at the top by ignoring the competition just because they dont destroy your business.

Edit: In an MMORPG your character is a major part of the game, when everyone else has better looking characters that your game you dont just ignore it because "you are number 1 and dominate the genre" you update them to be competitive so you dont lose the dominating position.

No mmo has yet to actually compete on the same level as Wow. They have tried, failed spectacularly and gone free to play. Swtor is a prime example of this. The only mmo that has come close is Rift.

[The Stormbringer]

No I'm sorry but a distinction needs to be made and players need to get this through their thick skulls: claiming something is a "need" when it isn't is a surefire way to make sure Blizzard digs in their heels and ignores feedback. You are only doing yourself and others a disservice by devaluing potential constructive feedback in such a way. It boggles my mind that people still can't grasp this even nearly 9 years later.

It won't be a selling point. Updated models are likely to come with 6.0 and the expansion but it won't require purchase of the expansion. Please do keep in mind that prior to Mop's release Blizzard stated from that point on, all races will be available to all players regardless of account level. Why on earth would new models be any different?

Keep in mind that things they introduce in new expansions that are available to everyone are selling points. Not for the expansion, but for people who are simply going to renew their subscriptions. I doubt there are all too many people who don't get the new expansions when they come out, but that's the sort of thing that will help convince people to keep playing.

[xanzul]

Nice try, but no.



Nothing in a video game is inherently NEEDED. The need for things in a game is bred by a "want"/desire. Therefore, players need the models just as much as they need new raids. In other words: they need neither. They want both.



The "want, not need" argument is really damn incorrect when it comes to something we don't need in the first place.

There is still an important distinction between want and need and using the correct words can only help convince Blizzard to make changes. Sorry but that is a fact.

[Yarathir]

There is still an important distinction between want and need and using the correct words can only help convince Blizzard to make changes. Sorry but that is a fact.

Well, explain that distinction for me, please. Maybe I could understand it then.

[xanzul]

Yes because obviously Blizzard had to strain their budget and every resource for at least two years now, and they will just barely manage to update the models in time for the next expansion marketing to begin.

No way they could also squeeze in one or two more races in time. We should be thankful to have a game at all.

Oh give it a fucking a rest. No one from Blizzard has ever implied there are budget issues. What they have said however is they felt other changes in the game warranted a certain allocation of resources over that of updated character models. Again the Azeroth revamp in Cata is a good example of this. Not that it matters anymore since for well over a year now Blizzard's language on the matter has changed significantly from a "eventually" to a "yes we are working on it right now and hiring new artists to get it done". Stop with the intellectual dishonesty already. We get it. People don't like how Blizzard has developed this game. Great. You don't need to lie, manipulate, use hyperbole or anything else to give your opinion more merit.

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No. Your argument just falls to shambles entirely.



Games are a form of entertainment. Entertainment is not a necessity, but a desire, a quality of life improvement.


MMOs are that way too, by extension.


Raids are also NOT a necessity.



See how you can break -anything- WoW down to "not required" if you start using that argument? So please don't. A large group wanting something is WoW's version of "needing" it. :P

And yet more intellectual dishonesty. When people bring up the difference between want and need, it is in the context of the game ONLY. Stop trying to side step this, you are failing miserably at it.

[Yarathir]

Oh give it a fucking a rest. No one from Blizzard has ever implied there are budget issues. What they have said however is they felt other changes in the game warranted a certain allocation of resources over that of updated character models. Again the Azeroth revamp in Cata is a good example of this. Not that it matters anymore since for well over a year now Blizzard's language on the matter has changed significantly from a "eventually" to a "yes we are working on it right now and hiring new artists to get it done". Stop with the intellectual dishonesty already. We get it. People don't like how Blizzard has developed this game. Great. You don't need to lie, manipulate, use hyperbole or anything else to give your opinion more merit.

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And yet more intellectual dishonesty. When people bring up the difference between want and need, it is in the context of the game ONLY. Stop trying to side step this, you are failing miserably at it.

You keep mentioning these words, but can you add reason to that? Or will you just keep attacking me instead of my argument?

[Reinaerd]

Imo, Adding updated player models as part of an expansion, or use the function to hype it.
Would be an insult to their player base, not to mention it would give the impression that we evolved from "valued" customers to Electronic Arts Milk cows ( aka cod players ).

They should add the update during SoO, we waited for it long enough.

[xanzul]

if they can do both, and do them well, not half ass one or the other, sure. But their rhetoric when asked about anything has been "what are you willing to sacrifice?" and this poll makes the answer clear, at least from the users here. We are willing to sacrifice a new class and/or two new races to have the old ones updated and brought to a standard ahead of what Pandaren and Worgen/Goblin are at.

You are full of shit and the only rhetoric I see is coming from you. Blizzard has never ever said any such thing in regards to character models as they understand (unlike the armchair developers) that different people work on different things. Development of new classes has NOTHING to do with graphics. NONE. Zip. Zilch. Nada. Quote me where Blizzard has said this or just shut your trap already. The only time Blizzard has brought up this scenario has been in terms of actual content like raids vs dungeons.

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That has nothing to do with what I was talking about. Please try and reread what I said and comprehend it. Its all about the business of selling your game...

It is the height of arrogance to tell someone they didn't read your post when they disagree with it. If anyone needs to read here it is you.

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Well if they give us new models they need to update goblins and worgens too, and i think blizz can do new models and new classes

Goblins and worgen are fine. There is no need to update them. They aren't even remotely that old.

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And so do I. And nothing in a game, nor the game itself is NEEDED. Making a game caters to the wants of people who seek entertainment in itself.

Needs exist within the context of a game. No one is stating otherwise but you. Not one single person has compared in game needs with real life needs.

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You obviously dont get it, its the whole package that makes a game. If you want to stay the best of the best you have the WHOLE package not just bits and pieces. Every little bit that a competitor does better than you is a little bit you lose. When it comes to characters in the an MMORPG it does matter, just look at the number of people that are worried about the new models because they dont want to lose the character they have built up over the years. To be number one you have to look at ALL the details, big or small.

It's funny how only Wow is required to have the "whole package" yet any old shit mmo that gets released is a-ok because it isn't Wow.

[Deleted]

I would take new Dwarf and Human models over any new race or class! Looking forward to that soo much!

[Worgoblin]

Yeah, except there's 8 new models to make. Also we're probably going to get things like sub-races, new expressions, tattoos, and other stuff.

Sub-races would be amazing. I'm not counting on it though.

[xanzul]

New models are long overdue.

I haven't played the game in over 3 years. And I haven't seriously played it in over 4.

If they do a good job on the new models I will come back.

Unless you quit the game over old models I'm not sure how new ones will resolve any of your issues with the game. I think this is the trap a lot of the people who claim new models are "needed". They think for whatever reason new models means a brand new game with none of the issues that existed prior.

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While character models are not the core of a game you see them 100% of your game time even when you are not directly watching them. Let me explain why. How much time do you spend looking at your back, your own bottom or your own feet (IRL)? Probably not much. Close to zero. But if they were ugly, disgusting, you would feel bad about it. Its enough to see something once and it will virtually exist in your head. Even if you don't look at your character face or blocky fingers all day, you know how bad they look and while playing with it, it gives a feeling for your game. Some players spend money on payed character modification. Why is that? They recolor their hair even under a helmet! They like 3D belts while it cannot be seen from behind (I like them too). It matter becuse your looks are actually not for your own. It exists to show off to others. Like in the real world, we want others to look at us and think about us as beautiful, cute, badass or whatever you like. The same needs manifest in a game. For most of us playing a badass character feels better than playing with a stick figure. Rough examples, but the same is true for less improvements. As a 3D model feels better than a stick figure, a good 3D model feels even better.

It does not matter how much time you spent at watching something. The whole intro cinematic is for the show. Ppl spend like 20 minutes watching it over the lifespan of an expansion, but it is important. Helps to hook up players.

New content comes from a different source than new player models! (well, mostly different sources) Some keep telling they rather want new content than new player models. You know there are seperate teams for different jobs right? Its not like making new models will prevent writers making new stories or designers coming up with exciting boss mechanics. Even if some of the teams are shared, they don't work on new content 100% of their time anyway. And new character models are not just for you to play with. Those are the npc-s around the world too. They are there as bosses, trash, quest givers, guards in cities. Making new models automatically replaces thousands of npc-s too. They will appear in a new raid aswell. If you see trolls inn a raid, they will have new troll models too.

And if they don't have enough employe to work, get more. They must have enough money.

Nope. Sorry. NPCs use entirely different models than character models. Again Blizzard has stated this time and again.

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Heading off the anti-reuse faction?

Fallen protectors. re use
Norushen. re use
Sha of Pride. re use
General Nazgrim. re use
Spoils of Pandaria. re use
Paragons of the Klaxxi. re use

Not a huge improvement from DS.

Thank you for proving his point. How is the Sha of Pride a rehash of ANYTHING? You do understand Sha are new to the game right?

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If they don't have the models ready for preview by the time Blizzcon comes around then they haven't worked on them at all. That should be their big reveal to coincide with the next expansion trailer.

So how much is Blizzard paying you? I mean you must work there to know what updating the models entails right? The expansion is a minimum of 6 months off so what does or doesn't happen at Blizzcon has absolutely no bearing on these updated models being released with 6.0. I would be surprised if they aren't shown at Blizzcon but it wouldn't worry me in the slightest bit if they aren't.

[Mojo03]

It's been known for quite a while now... They've acknowledged it and have been working on it for a while... What more do you want?

[Xilurm]

I love all these armchair developers and artists in this thread. How do you know it doesn't require a lot of resources? The very fact that Blizzard openly stated they hired new artists specifically for the purpose of updating character models says otherwise.

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Again the fact that Blizzard hired new artists specifically to update character models speaks to the fact that it is a priority. While it may or may not be top priority it is way up there way higher than it has ever been before. Let's stop pretending otherwise.

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I love the arrogance of some people on these forums who actually think they are giving Blizzard any actual ideas at all when it is all the same tired old rehashed complaints. Blizzard isn't looking to "get away" with anything.

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NPC models aren't even remotely the same as character models and again Blizzard has stated this multiple times.

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Blizzard has never ever said this. In fact they have gone to great effort to explain to players that NPC models have nothing to do with character models and that we shouldn't expect a change in one to be made in the other.

Garrosh's is. I'm not talking about his reskin. I'm saying that his is a whole new model with a new skeleton. This is the NPC that has that. Not Jaina nor the the Trolls in ToT have this. Only Garrosh. And he also has new animations. Why the hell would they add /dance and /kiss to an NPC model that look way differently than the ones we have?

[GKLeatherCraft]

People often forget also they are not just updating models, they are updating the skeletons aswell to give them more flexibility

[chrisisvacant]

Let's not underestimate the laziness that Blizzard apparently seems to have... but yes, I expect Blizzcon to have the updated WoW race models.

What a dumb comment. Blizzard works their asses off to put out good products.

[Haytham]

I'm all in for new models over new races.

But only if they update the Blood Elves and Draenei also.

[Kioshi]

Because Garrosh is a raid boss and they were heading off the anti-reuse faction. If we were going to kill Baine or Lor'themar, they would have gotten their updates shown.

So I guess we going to kill Vol'jin right, because he did get his model updated. I'm still waiting to kill Thrall his model has been updated since CATA.

[Buu]

There is a good chance that the old player models are causing new players to not play WoW. Let's face it; Graphics are a huge part of people enjoying and playing games. When a game looks dated, it can be a turn off for younger players, or people who have never played WoW before. That trailer looked great, and it looked like it came from a modern game. However, those vanilla character models look like they came from 2004.

More like it's CERTAIN that graphics PLAY A ROLE in making not only new players, but people who already played and left, to not come to WoW.

[Xilurm]

So I guess we going to kill Vol'jin right, because he did get his model updated.

Nope, he got a reskin. Garrosh got his whole skeleton changed.