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  1. #421
    Here's a compilation of polls for those who like to argue about popularity. I was curious what polls in general had to say on this topic in these forums.

    No I don't think this is proof of anything, just interesting.

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults


    and here's some from before Pandaria.

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...expansion+poll

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    http://www.mmo-champion.com/poll.php...do=showresults

    I'm sure there's more, but it's too tedious to compile and none of this is scientific enough to improve from the rigor. From these though, it's interesting to see that BC was on top till Pandaria was released, and afterward WotLK is the new leader. So if we ignore Cataclysm, since everyone seems to hate it, it really does look like the expansion before the current one is the most popular. I'd like to see if this holds true after "Dawn of the Beavermen" or whatever is released.

  2. #422
    Dreadlord
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    You forget to take into consideration that wotlk was the most played xpack

  3. #423
    Quote Originally Posted by blizzardnonentertainment View Post
    The majority of people who played since tbc or earlier agree that TBC was the golden era of WoW.
    Source...?

    Let me guess. No source. Uninformed guess at best.

    If you go by the numbers though, Wrath was the golden era of wow. Highest number of subs, highest sub growth, most activity across all servers, etc. These are things you can actually check on out on your own if you wish to. Then do we classify Wrath as the "golden age"?

    I've played in during both BC and Wrath, and the game right now is better than it was during both those expansions. What you have is nostalgia and rose-colored glasses. You need to lose both and see the game for what it was then and it what it is now, which is a significantly improved version of what it was in the past.

  4. #424
    Wow is at its best shape, best features, best design. If game were rerolled to TBC, everyone would quit except the die hard tbc nostalgiaglasses, and even they probably would quit later.

  5. #425
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Wow is at its best shape, best features, best design. If game were rerolled to TBC, everyone would quit except the die hard tbc nostalgiaglasses, and even they probably would quit later.
    ^ What he said.

    Contribute when posting, please
    Last edited by Darsithis; 2013-08-19 at 03:22 PM.

  6. #426
    Quote Originally Posted by john duo View Post
    this is for all those who say that MOP is the best xpac:
    Let me help you out here. If someone says mop is the best expansion, all it means is that they've enjoyed it more than the previous expansions. It's not a statement of absolute fact. There's no need to write a tome telling people why they're wrong, because they aren't wrong. No more than you would be wrong if you think some other expansion was the best one.
    Stating an opinion as fact does not make it fact. Opinions are not fact. So don't be stupid and make a fool of yourself by trying to pass off your opinion as fact.

  7. #427
    High Overlord Axylum's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Wow is at its best shape, best features, best design. If game were rerolled to TBC, everyone would quit except the die hard tbc nostalgiaglasses, and even they probably would quit later.
    totally agree

  8. #428
    Quote Originally Posted by hrugner View Post
    I'd like to see if this holds true after "Dawn of the Beavermen" or whatever is released.
    Dawn of the Beavermen sounds like an episode of Dr. Who.
    Stating an opinion as fact does not make it fact. Opinions are not fact. So don't be stupid and make a fool of yourself by trying to pass off your opinion as fact.

  9. #429
    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Wow is at its best shape, best features, best design. If game were rerolled to TBC, everyone would quit except the die hard tbc nostalgiaglasses, and even they probably would quit later.
    Haha, fanboyism how does it work?

    So would you argue pvp is in it's best shape, have you read about baseline resilience of nearing 80%? Best! Pve in it's best shape with soon 3 different lockouts again.

  10. #430
    Stood in the Fire caelius's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cle View Post
    Wow is at its best shape, best features, best design. If game were rerolled to TBC, everyone would quit except the die hard tbc nostalgiaglasses, and even they probably would quit later.
    ^ this. I played WoW since day one and raided during Vanilla and TBC. It was fun, yes - but so much worse than what we have nowadays.

  11. #431
    Quote Originally Posted by Farora View Post

    So would you argue pvp is in it's best shape, have you read about baseline resilience of nearing 80%? Best!
    Because PvP in Classic, BC, Wrath and Cata was perfect and skill-based right?

    Remember 1-shot macros and pve-heroes rolling people in pvp in classic? CCs with no DR and rogues with minimal gear and skill destroying everything?

    Remember resto druids, warriors, rogues and locks in BC? How long did that go on for? The entire damn expansion...

    Remember how "skillful" the game got with Wrath with the return of the "skillful" 1-shotters?

    Remember mages and rogues in Cata? Remember first pvp season of Cata? How "skillful" was that?

    It's like you never played during those expansions or chose to forget them. Either way you sound like you have zero idea what you're talking about.

  12. #432
    Epic! Ysilla's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farora View Post
    Have fun in different places, good one. LFR is basically a training dummy with a different skin applied. Back in the day you had threads on realm forums where people would post their progress. Even if that progress was far behind others, you had people posting about their boss kills with a sense of pride.

    And good for you, you are too cool to care, but in the raiding community there was a lot of competition among realms for first kills. That's gone now aswell. Like it or not, but the raiding community in Wow got gutted in favour of people like yourself that 'have fun' in LFR. And I'd argue that the people wiping in Karazhan had more fun than the people collecting epics in LFR while being on /follow.
    This has nothing to do with "being too cool to care", just about finding pride pointless, especially in a game (unless you only play to be "cooler than others" and show off ? Which I also don't get at all, I'm here to play a game, not to witness/participate in an e-peen contest). Also never said I had fun in LFR, only that casual people could at least see more content than they used to, also leaving more time for outside raid content, which is very very very much more developed than in BC years.

    Raiding community had a lot of competition, yes. But how many players were really into this "raiding community" ? 2-3% ? Only players I know from classic/BC that really raided (ie: gone further than KZ) would currently fall into the "first month hc" population of mop if they still played that much, which seems to be about the same size.

    I'm not sure at all that the fact that progress posting or this kind of things disappeared is really mostly a consequence of expansions. Looks way more a consequence of the evolution of players and of the world (real one) : now guides are everywhere, even before bosses are released on live servers, every single class and spec has incredibly in-depth guide of how to play/gear/spec that can be found in 5s with google. People are getting way more information now than they used to, and way more quickly, I don't believe this is caused by game design, but by current internet design. Same for progress, tracking is now fully automated, no more need to post about it, it already gets updated almost automatically on a few different websites.

    Many guilds don't even have a website now for the same reasons, posting progress ? It's already all over the web. Recruitment ? Forums everywhere for this now, and mostly in game as it was already before (which instead of redirecting to forum application, gets sent directly to teamspeak). Sharing information on classes/raids ? No more need, already everywhere. Casual talk between members ? Happens all day on teamspeak (which many guilds did not / could not even use in BC days). The game did not change all this, or very little, evolution of internet did.

    Most people didn't go far in raiding because it was hard to get enough information to really get in it, and even into the game (many people even had no idea how to gear/spec correctly)

  13. #433
    Quote Originally Posted by Farora View Post
    Haha, fanboyism how does it work?
    Haha, haterism how does it work?
    Stating an opinion as fact does not make it fact. Opinions are not fact. So don't be stupid and make a fool of yourself by trying to pass off your opinion as fact.

  14. #434
    Quote Originally Posted by Pancaspe View Post
    Since MOP was their best expansion yet, I would say chances are high.
    BC was fantastic.
    Wrath was fantastic.
    Cataclysm was good (early raiding was excellent)
    MoP has been good

    I have yet to see an expansion that wasn't at least good.

  15. #435
    Pandaren Monk Zogarth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vivek View Post
    Because PvP in Classic, BC, Wrath and Cata was perfect and skill-based right?

    Remember 1-shot macros and pve-heroes rolling people in pvp in classic? CCs with no DR and rogues with minimal gear and skill destroying everything?

    Remember resto druids, warriors, rogues and locks in BC? How long did that go on for? The entire damn expansion...

    Remember how "skillful" the game got with Wrath with the return of the "skillful" 1-shotters?

    Remember mages and rogues in Cata? Remember first pvp season of Cata? How "skillful" was that?

    It's like you never played during those expansions or chose to forget them. Either way you sound like you have zero idea what you're talking about.
    WoW pvp has always been sub-par, but in MoP it has just gotten worse than ever before...

    Quote Originally Posted by FrankLampard View Post
    BC was fantastic.
    Wrath was fantastic.
    Cataclysm was good (early raiding was excellent)
    MoP has been good

    I have yet to see an expansion that wasn't good.
    BC was indeed fantastic

    Wrath had the most disappointing starting tier for release for any expansion. My guild could not clear Sunwell back then, and yet we beat every single raidboss in Wrath 3 weeks after the game released. After this, i took a pause from WoW for the first time since Vanilla.

    Cataclysm was good at launch, but that was the only good raid in the expansion. I got into PvP at the end of Cata for real (I had always played it casually), and i had some fun doing RBG and arena.

    MoP had so broken PvP that i quit 1½ month into launch. I had gotten into PvP and it was so broken it was not even fun. Heck i even played a holy-pala so i was one of the OP ones.

    So yeah, 1 good expansion, and 2 mediocre, and one complete failure imo.
    Last edited by Zogarth; 2013-08-19 at 12:01 PM.

  16. #436
    Dreadlord vmagik's Avatar
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    Look...

    Sure, this is my opinion but people will generally state that the first expansion they had the pleasure to take full-part in (play from the start or see "end game content") was the "Golden Age".

    I personally think Classic (vanilla, pre-tbc w/e) was the best time - it obviously wasn't but that's what my nostalgic brain tells me. A lot of people started playing from the beginning of TBC or very end of Classic and so, to them that was the best point within the game because it was new/exciting/full of wonder.

    The game is infinitely better now, sure it has some LFR-shaped kinks to iron out (which I truly believe will be fixed by flex) but the sheer amount of fun content, lore, exceptional raids means that this IS one of, if not THE best (WOTLK might be better simply due to atmosphere IMO) expansions they have ever made.

    So, yes... The Dark Below will be a good expansion.
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  17. #437
    One of the things I think about, as a reason of having a good xpac is the catch up for new players.
    So, the leveling isnot rewarding and has become something to go through for the game to begin and the end-game is where new players want to get as quick as possible.
    Maybe they are joining to play with their friends who are on cap-level or something?

    With every xpac the distance between level 1 and cap-level becomes bigger and bigger!
    Yeah sure, players who have a cap-level char will have heirlooms and stuff to shorten the journey but new players will not have those.

    So I really think something of a catch-up should be in place. For players 1 -90 something that doesn't take much time, they know, new players don't.

  18. #438
    Moderator Gehco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farora View Post
    Haha, fanboyism how does it work?

    So would you argue pvp is in it's best shape, have you read about baseline resilience of nearing 80%? Best! Pve in it's best shape with soon 3 different lockouts again.
    Uhm... Please tell me when PvP was good?

    For me, I felt like I dominated as a frost mage in TBC. Really wiped the floor with people. In Wrath, Prot Paladins tell you that you're dead, then you're dead.. Or Ret paladins double-tagging with Divine Storm and high hits in burst. Cataclysm.. was just an odd moment for a lot.

    (again, my experiences). And I love the new to be PvE system, already enjoy ToT 25HC. I don't mind multiple lockouts, better than 1 for everything.
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  19. #439
    Quote Originally Posted by Ysilla View Post
    This has nothing to do with "being too cool to care", just about finding pride pointless, especially in a game (unless you only play to be "cooler than others" and show off ? Which I also don't get at all, I'm here to play a game, not to witness/participate in an e-peen contest)
    It's impossible for some people around here to understand that there are people, such as myself, who just don't care about these kinds of things. The only pride I ever got from the game is when we beat a raid boss for the first time or when we finally cleared a raid. And that was only personal pride. I never felt the need to let everyone know about it.
    Stating an opinion as fact does not make it fact. Opinions are not fact. So don't be stupid and make a fool of yourself by trying to pass off your opinion as fact.

  20. #440
    Stood in the Fire FAILoZOFF's Avatar
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    The real question is: can PvP be even worse?

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