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  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Arganis View Post
    Not sure. Either way you don't just go back to being a green orc ten minutes later, that's for sure. The green skin orcs have now is over generations and even they can't shed the corruption completely.
    Interesting thought.

    Now im not the brightest star in the sky but since the Frostwolves never touched Mannoroths blood, how come Thrall is green yet Garrosh stays the native brown?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neow View Post
    Blackhand and his sons Rend and Maim also.
    The whole Warsong clan in its entirety.
    Many other clan chiefs and members did.
    Someone above said only the Frostwolf clan touched it mate.

  2. #42
    Herald of the Titans Arganis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tart View Post
    Interesting thought.

    Now im not the brightest star in the sky but since the Frostwolves never touched Mannoroths blood, how come Thrall is green yet Garrosh stays the native brown?
    Because Garrosh is part of one of the very few clans that didn't take part in the original corruption and, correct me if I'm wrong, was conceived before the demonic corruption of his father's clan.

    As some people have said it wasn't the first time orcs drank of Mannoroth's blood and technically all green orcs are in some way or another related to those who drank, that's why they're green.

    Also, you should know that Grom didn't just turn back green. When he drinks he becomes a red orc like every other orcs who drinks of the demons blood and you essentially have to kill him (in WCIII) and use a special soulstone just to turn him back enough for him to have his 'free will' again.
    Last edited by Arganis; 2013-08-19 at 06:02 PM.

  3. #43
    Using all the strength he had left, Hellscream made a devastating blow against the pit lord, shattering his plate and spear by driving his axe deep into the demons body. In an explosion of demonic energy Mannoroth the Destructor was no more, but the effects of this left Hellscream mortally wounded. As he lay on the ground, the crimson haze lifted from the eyes of Grommash Hellscream and his clan mates; the blood curse which had damned his race for generations was finally over and thus the orcs were free from their enslavement by the Legion forever.

    One does not simply survive the explosion of a blood pact.

    He got badly wounded by the explosion and it really is convenient for the whole story that he died, doing one final heroic thing for his race. The orcish racial Blood Rage is the thing they kept from all of this. Even though they got cleansed from the corruption that tiny little bit still exists in them.

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Tart View Post
    Interesting thought.

    Now im not the brightest star in the sky but since the Frostwolves never touched Mannoroths blood, how come Thrall is green yet Garrosh stays the native brown?

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    Someone above said only the Frostwolf clan touched it mate.
    Garrosh isn't green because he was born before the demons came to Outlands. If you remember questing in Nagrand, he was also deathly sick and unable to really fight or do much of anything. And thus never forced to drink the blood.

    Thrall...I cannot remember. His parents refused to drink the blood, and forbid the entire Frostwolf clan from doing so. A piece of lore is missing in my brain.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Arganis View Post
    Because Garrosh is part of one of the very few clans that didn't take part in the original corruption and, correct me if I'm wrong, was conceived before the demonic corruption of his father's clan.

    As some people have said it wasn't the first time orcs drank of Mannoroth's blood and technically all green orcs are in some way or another related to those who drank, that's why they're green.

    Also you should know that From didn't just turn back green. When he drinks he becomes a red orc like every other orcs who drinks of the demons blood and you essentially have to kill him and use a special soulstone just to turn him back enough for him to be sane.
    Surely Garrosh was in his father clan who was the first to take the plunge marra? Its been so long since i read lord of the clans i cant remember if Duraton lost his color from just mingling with them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Retributed View Post
    Garrosh isn't green because he was born before the demons came to Outlands. If you remember questing in Nagrand, he was also deathly sick and unable to really fight or do much of anything. And thus never forced to drink the blood.

    Thrall...I cannot remember. His parents refused to drink the blood, and forbid the entire Frostwolf clan from doing so. A piece of lore is missing in my brain.
    Yes i remember that mate, after a bit of chin rubbing and head scratching i cant see how Thrall would also be green though. As you say the Frostwolves never took part so how can they be affected by the green skin? Also it cant be because Garrosh was isolated away because im sure someone came to try and recruit him but he was to ill and "pathetic" to help the Horde.

    Indeed, a bit of lore is missing.....

  6. #46
    Someone needs to ask this at the next BlizzCon. Preferably red shirt guy once more.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Tart View Post
    Yes i remember that mate, after a bit of chin rubbing and head scratching i cant see how Thrall would also be green though. As you say the Frostwolves never took part so how can they be affected by the green skin? Also it cant be because Garrosh was isolated away because im sure someone came to try and recruit him but he was to ill and "pathetic" to help the Horde.

    Indeed, a bit of lore is missing.....
    Frostwolves dabbled into Warlock magic as well, they just stopped after Ner'zhul warned them to drink the blood.
    Too often, we are mistaken for druidic types. perhaps that's true for some shaman, but do not let yourself be plagued by the ignorant belief that we are always peaceful.
    Nothing about what I do is harmonious. I command the elements to my will. There is nothing offered in return. I would have it no other way.


    Never assume an ogre's stupid, that's when they'll get you.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Tart View Post
    Surely Garrosh was in his father clan who was the first to take the plunge marra? Its been so long since i read lord of the clans i cant remember if Duraton lost his color from just mingling with them.

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    Yes i remember that mate, after a bit of chin rubbing and head scratching i cant see how Thrall would also be green though. As you say the Frostwolves never took part so how can they be affected by the green skin? Also it cant be because Garrosh was isolated away because im sure someone came to try and recruit him but he was to ill and "pathetic" to help the Horde.

    Indeed, a bit of lore is missing.....
    This subject was extensively covered in Rise of the Horde.

    Basically it wasn't the demon blood that turned the Orc's green, that actually happened before they all drank demon blood. Rather it was extensive exposure to Warlock magic that turned the Orcs skin green. Actual Warlocks and those in clans where warlock magic was practiced widely turned green much faster then people like Thrall's parents, but there was enough fel magic getting thrown around on the battlefield that unless someone literally stayed away from all battles (which was only the case with the Mag'har), they'd turn green eventually.
    Roleplaying, hardcore Raiding, running LFR on the occasional weekend, PvPing, rolling alts, achievement hunting, pet battling, or just enacting an endless series of whims, I don't care how you play WoW. Just as long as you have fun doing it.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by McNeil View Post
    I heard him say ''the demons fire burned out my veins''
    He says "burnt out IN my veins" - this means that the demon's fire has faded away.

    Quote Originally Posted by IIBloodXLustII View Post
    The only Orcs that did not drink the blood were the Frostwolves (Thrall's clan) and Orgrim Doomhammer.
    I'm pretty positive the only Orcs who actually drank the blood were the Chieftains themselves and barely a handful of others - literally about a dozen Orcs in total. The general population did not drink it (imagine how much blood they'd need if every single Orc in existence had drank, I don't think Mannoroth even had that much blood in him).
    Last edited by Netherspark; 2013-08-19 at 06:34 PM.

  10. #50
    The major demons in Warcraft 3 (basically Mannoroth and Archimonde) explodes in huuuge balls of fire when they die. Standing close to a huge ball of fire is generally a bad idea, and it's likely you'll die when you stand a few metres away. Thrall was further away, so he survived.

    Case closed.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Falrinn View Post
    This subject was extensively covered in Rise of the Horde.

    Basically it wasn't the demon blood that turned the Orc's green, that actually happened before they all drank demon blood. Rather it was extensive exposure to Warlock magic that turned the Orcs skin green. Actual Warlocks and those in clans where warlock magic was practiced widely turned green much faster then people like Thrall's parents, but there was enough fel magic getting thrown around on the battlefield that unless someone literally stayed away from all battles (which was only the case with the Mag'har), they'd turn green eventually.
    Yes without reading wiki i kinda recollect that correct mate. As i say its been a while since i read LOTC ^^

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    Quote Originally Posted by Noorri View Post
    The major demons in Warcraft 3 (basically Mannoroth and Archimonde) explodes in huuuge balls of fire when they die. Standing close to a huge ball of fire is generally a bad idea, and it's likely you'll die when you stand a few metres away. Thrall was further away, so he survived.

    Case closed.
    Hmm, i concur. Its just he seemed to take the fire like it was a strong gust of wind. I know thrall seemed pretty injured when he came to Grom but why didnt Magtheridon burst into a deathly explosion or any other demon in Outland?

    As for Archie, in the Elf ending he did burst into a nasty inferno but look at the catostorphic damage it caused. Surely Thrall would have felt the brunt of that. Yes Mannoroth wasnt as head honcho like him but still...

  12. #52
    Epic! Duncanîdaho's Avatar
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    Seems to make sense to me that high ranking demon lords would sort of have a self destruct for when they die. So that whatever kills them dies with them as well. Totally fits there character.

    Wielding fel magic is alot like trying to harness pure chaos I'd imagine. I'd guess when your really powerful like Mannoroth, it erupts out when they die since there is nothing to control that fel energy anymore and it has to go somewhere. To this day we still have not killed a demon as tough as Mannoroth so we really have nothing to compare to.
    The generalist looks outward; he looks for living principles, knowing full well that such principles change, that they develop. It is to the characteristics of change itself that the mentat-generalist must look. There can be no permanent catalogue of such change, no handbook or manual. You must look at it with as few preconceptions as possible, asking yourself, "Now what is this thing doing?" -Children of Dune

  13. #53
    I think that his closeness to the dying Pit Lord (who's fel blood reignited their demonic fury) made Grom's blood literally boil from the purge of the demonic influence - the other fel orcs probably suffered a better fate due to their distance from the dying Pit Lord.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Duncanîdaho View Post
    Seems to make sense to me that high ranking demon lords would sort of have a self destruct for when they die. So that whatever kills them dies with them as well. Totally fits there character.

    Wielding fel magic is alot like trying to harness pure chaos I'd imagine. I'd guess when your really powerful like Mannoroth, it erupts out when they die since there is nothing to control that fel energy anymore and it has to go somewhere. To this day we still have not killed a demon as tough as Mannoroth so we really have nothing to compare to.
    Magtheridon was like Mannoroth surely?

    I like your idea of the fel explosion mind, gives a whole new outlook for me.

  15. #55
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    It would appear from the linked vid, that Thrall was KTFO off to the side and Grom took Mannoroth's exploding like a champ.

  16. #56
    Epic! Duncanîdaho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Netherspark View Post
    He says "burnt out IN my veins" - this means that the demon's fire has faded away.



    I'm pretty positive the only Orcs who actually drank the blood were the Chieftains themselves and barely a handful of others - literally about a dozen Orcs in total. The general population did not drink it (imagine how much blood they'd need if every single Orc in existence had drank, I don't think Mannoroth even had that much blood in him).
    The chieftains then dispersed it to there clans. Why else would there be fel(red) orcs everywhere in outland(and WC3) as well as Mannoroth pretty much saying he owns all the Orcs? IF it was just the chieftains...the entire race would not have been enslaved for Grom to free. All it takes is one drop of Mannoroths blood in an entire pool or lake to corrupt it all.
    The generalist looks outward; he looks for living principles, knowing full well that such principles change, that they develop. It is to the characteristics of change itself that the mentat-generalist must look. There can be no permanent catalogue of such change, no handbook or manual. You must look at it with as few preconceptions as possible, asking yourself, "Now what is this thing doing?" -Children of Dune

  17. #57
    So no conspiracy theories hes alive lol?

  18. #58
    Epic! Duncanîdaho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tart View Post
    Magtheridon was like Mannoroth surely?

    I like your idea of the fel explosion mind, gives a whole new outlook for me.
    Nah Magtheridon had nothing on Mannoroth. Mannoroth is like the #1 pitlord we know of. Like how Archimonde and Kil'jaden are way more powerful then other Eredar. The legion sent Magtheridon to a planet that was already dead as clean up duty. I doubt he's really all that powerful if hes getting those assignments. Meanwhile Mannoroth was fighting on the frontline and manipulating entire civilizations.
    The generalist looks outward; he looks for living principles, knowing full well that such principles change, that they develop. It is to the characteristics of change itself that the mentat-generalist must look. There can be no permanent catalogue of such change, no handbook or manual. You must look at it with as few preconceptions as possible, asking yourself, "Now what is this thing doing?" -Children of Dune

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Tart View Post
    Hmm, i concur. Its just he seemed to take the fire like it was a strong gust of wind. I know thrall seemed pretty injured when he came to Grom but why didnt Magtheridon burst into a deathly explosion or any other demon in Outland?

    As for Archie, in the Elf ending he did burst into a nasty inferno but look at the catostorphic damage it caused. Surely Thrall would have felt the brunt of that. Yes Mannoroth wasnt as head honcho like him but still...
    I think it's part that both Mannoroth and Archimonde died in cinematics while Mag'theridon dies in-game (twice even,it's easier to make a big fireball when you are drawing for a cinematic then it is to animate one in-game), and part that Blizzard retconned the "big demon fireball death" thing because it became hard to kill any of them off without having the killer and allies die at the same time. The concept of fireball death became a burden to storytelling, so they stopped it without explaining anything about why. It creates logical inconsistencies but it's the kind of thing where they either forgot about their own work or simply said "fuck it" and hoped noone would notice.

    I think what a lot of people in this thread is confusing is what killed Grom and why Grom was killed. The fireball from Mannoroths death killed Grom, but Grom was killed to make the storyline dramatic and an effective way of starting to paint the orcs in a more favorable view by blaming their violent asshole tendency on demon blood corruption.
    Last edited by Noorri; 2013-08-19 at 07:07 PM. Reason: I hate grammar, logic and similar names

  20. #60
    He pulled a Padme and lost the will to live.
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    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

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