Page 6 of 10 FirstFirst ...
4
5
6
7
8
... LastLast
  1. #101
    The world and the classes themselves have been boiled down to stats and ability buttons and cast bars. There's no wonder or excitement. You don't see your character as a character in the world anymore, you see it as their ability buttons, their rotation, their stats, etc.

  2. #102
    Quote Originally Posted by Wazooty View Post
    The world and the classes themselves have been boiled down to stats and ability buttons and cast bars. There's no wonder or excitement. You don't see your character as a character in the world anymore, you see it as their ability buttons, their rotation, their stats, etc.
    Everything you just said there could've been said about vanilla WoW when comparing it to previous games.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    Bits of flavor in context of whole MMORPG scene, as most of the games simply ignore all of those. And not even once those pillars were enough to keep the games afloat or interesting with the exception of Eve. That's the main thing and why Blizzard is ignoring those bits: none of those is interesting for the masses.
    And what the 'masses' want is important why? I'm not suddenly going to think that the McCheeseBurger is the best food in the world because it's the most ordered food around the globe.

    Some MMOs are highly enjoyed with communities that are very active and engaged even with only 500 subscribers, with the developers being just happy enough with that number of players.

    What the masses want is really not important to me. Especially not in an anti-social MMO as WoW where you have almost absolutely no reason at all to interact with other people.

    EverQuest Next is a next-gen MMO which seems to wanting to focus on roleplay and player created content, and apparently the most anticipated MMO at the moment, so even big mainstream MMOs might end up focussing on some of the things which you claim are "uninteresting" to the masses. Tbh, the 'masses' are often very inexperienced and ignorant about all the things that are out there and all the things they -could- be experiencing and wether or not they'd enjoy it, until it gets shoved in their faces.

    Most of those 300 million online gamers (where did you pull that number from anyway?) play Farmville and casino games without giving a fuck about MMORPGs.
    300 million online worldwide PC gamers was the last estimated number I've read, not including browser-games such as farmville etc.
    Last edited by Anarch the Subduer; 2013-08-19 at 10:34 PM.
    ♦ Scepticist ♦ Critic ♦ INTJ

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I was just thinking about this the other day, and I reflected on why WoW lacks excitement currently. Its not because the downtime between patch cycles, but it stems from a much greater problem than that.

    WoW has become a bucket list. Now hear me out on this. The game is essentially played by creating a bucket list and following that list.

    1) Login.

    Goal: Cap valor asap and continue to do so on other characters

    2) Daily Heroic Scenario
    3) Daily Heroic Dungeon
    4) Battlefield Barrens weekly
    5) An LFR or two
    6) Rinse and repeat.

    Notice the only thing getting the player out in the world is the barrens weekly quest. Everything else is queued for. Its just not exciting. And after one week of the barrens quest, it gets old, especially when its done on other characters.

    Where is the excitement of logging in, and then figuring out in game what you wanted to do for the day? There are no more goals that are actually worthy of time and effort other than heroic raiding, and even that becomes dull because you essentially fought the same boss with some ability bloat to create difficulty.

    Now contrast that to an epic quest chain like the Onyxia quest line (for Alliance). There were several steps, and accomplishing each step just to gain access to that raid boss felt like you were gaining ground. You got gear along the way inevitably as you went through BRD and other dungeons. The player felt like a part of the quest. Or the quest chain that gave access to the Black Temple. Each step in the quest felt amazing because you saw how your accomplishments opened new parts of the game for you to explore. Now, the legendary quest chain is just another bucket list type quest chain. Its too carved out in stone, and feels generic.

    TL;DR

    WoW lacks excitement because the developers made the decision to create such a simple bucket list type system, with generic quests, and overly simple dungeon / raid design.

    In other words, the game is great in the gameplay department, but lags behind in the excitement factor.
    Your sig is so ironic i didn't even read your post..

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by MoanaLisa View Post
    "Discovery" really only happens when a new expansion comes along or when some new zone/dungeon/scenario/raid/patch is launched. That lasts for a while but you can only make so many circles around an island before you've seen what there is to see.

    My bucket list is about two dozen items long, is continually updated and is more like goals: get my gear to some level, finish up an achievement, farm up something for a profession, it really goes on and on and I keep it by my keyboard for when I play. I don't worry about capping valor every week, I don't worry about doing dailies every day and my self-determined goals/tasks/quests keep me busy and moving around in the world, either on my main or on an alt.

    People need to find some creativity and not follow the herd that's always saying that this or that needs to be done. It helps to play other games as well.

    Summing up: MoP has been nothing like the post at the top of the thread for me which is probably why I've enjoyed it so much. You make your own experience. Doing what others say is a dead end.
    Every single piece of content is designed for EVERYONE to do. There's no creating your own experience. You are doing the same thing as everyone else. Even raids are just easier/harder versions of what everyone else is doing. When the new scenarios come out everyone is shuffled to the new spot to do the exact same thing as everyone else. When the new raid opens up everyone is shuffled to the same new dailies. Unless you think choosing to do a heroic scen instead of a heroic dungeon for that last handful of valor is what makes you "creative".

    In vanilla there weren't things pointing you everywhere, and everything wasn't deemed "necesaary". You often found things by accident or by exploration and it felt awesome.

    Now, everything is designed for everyone. Having quests and stuff that people aren't made aware of the moment they're implemented is "wasted design time".

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    Everything you just said there could've been said about vanilla WoW when comparing it to previous games.
    We're not talking about previous games.

    In vanilla things were raw and needed to be figured out. Quests werent designed for everyone to see. There weren't people in every major city making sure you did every bit of content in the game, you found it or heard about it through exploration or through other players. Nowadays any content that literally every player in the game isn't doing is a waste of design time.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Karvak View Post
    I still get excited when I get a new piece of gear/upgrade, or if I get a new transmog worthy item from doing older content.
    this is my opinion aswell

    My MaL http://myanimelist.net/animelist/Draknalor For The Glory Of Ecchi

  7. #107

    Are you serious?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sinndra View Post
    choosing to ignore other features does not equal the game doesnt have any. choosing not to go looking for rares, choosing not to go looking for random BoA weapons scattered around, choosing not to work on professions, choosing not to go to the gear vendors (which btw, are not in the cities either) does not mean there isnt any other stuff in the game for people.

    i think you feel that way after a few months of any patch. they can gate you if you like.. but really people dont want to be gated anymore. just realize at some point you are going to be waiting for that next patch so you can have "more stuff" to do.
    Every single thing you mention was most likely done more than 6 months ago by most characters. How many times can you kill the same rares, I assume by looking for random BoA weapons i can only assume you mean Relic Hunter items.. also done months ago by most people, most pertinent professions are maxed, umm going to gear vendors? what ever do you mean by THAT? and how does doing any of those things add "excitement"

    MoP is filled with tedious after tedious activities week in week out. Farming for food .. repeating world bosses on as many toons as possible for mounts which have a ridiculously low drop rate, WoW is filled with monotonous repetitive activity, and by its nature this game and most MMOs are repetitive with long term "grinding goals/achievements" in mind.

    I love WoW but have become convinced that this love of WoW is left over from when it was still new and exciting to me. For me I started in BÇ and by now the bloom is off the rose on these repetitive activities. But that is me. The only reason i even bother to respond is the bizarre collections of reasons you chose to be considered as exciting in some way. it baffles me.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    And what the 'masses' want is important why? What the masses want is really not important to me.
    Masses pay the bills. Game development is not exactly cheap.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    Some MMOs are highly enjoyed with communities that are very active and engaged even with only 500 subscribers, with the developers being just happy enough with that number of players.
    And that is one gigantic pile of bullshit. Wanna point me towards any MMORPG that has less than 10000 subs and/or paying F2P customers released in last ten years? Or even less than 100K? The magic number seems to be around 100-200k today where publishers are pulling the plug and games are no longer profitable to maintain.

    And no, private servers of UO does not count because those run on volunteer work, not by paid staff.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    Especially not in an anti-social MMO as WoW where you have almost absolutely no reason at all to interact with other people.
    If you choose to be antisocial it's your problem. I've had some great RP experiences in WoW but not many, and not recently. RP realms are there for a reason, because you might actually find some RP there... Especially if you're actively following the realm forums and attend to events.

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    EverQuest Next is a next-gen MMO which seems to wanting to focus on roleplay and player created content, and apparently the most anticipated MMO at the moment, so even big mainstream MMOs might end up focussing on some of the things which you claim are "uninteresting" to the masses.
    EQN is doing something different for the sake of being different from WoW like GW2 did last year (and failed) and what TESO is trying this year (and probably will fail for the same reason as GW2). Lack of "holy trinity" simply will not work in MMORPGs because people will lose the last bit of distinction between classes, and WoW is blamed for homogenization when GW2 has one class that does dpstankheal.

    Time will tell if the UGC works or not, but it did nothing for any of the previous attempts (STO, CO, Rift, Neverwinter etc). It's most anticipated MMO at the moment by EQ fanboys that got burned by EQ2 fiasco, but I personally have seen nothing yet that would hold interest of somebody like me who likes raids (unlike Wildstar which tops my list of most anticipated upcoming MMO).

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    300 million online worldwide PC gamers was the last estimated number I've read, not including browser-games such as farmville etc.
    Not even close to anything I've seen... Got links?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wazooty View Post
    In vanilla things were raw and needed to be figured out. Quests werent designed for everyone to see. There weren't people in every major city making sure you did every bit of content in the game, you found it or heard about it through exploration or through other players. Nowadays any content that literally every player in the game isn't doing is a waste of design time.
    And none of that relates to buttons, classes, skills or any of the shit you talked about in your previous post.
    Last edited by vesseblah; 2013-08-19 at 11:04 PM.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    And that is one gigantic pile of bullshit. Wanna point me towards any MMORPG that has less than 10000 subs and/or paying F2P customers released in last ten years? Or even less than 100K? The magic number seems to be around 100-200k today where publishers are pulling the plug and games are no longer profitable to maintain.
    Ah. It's very obvious how ... inexperienced you are with the MMO genre.

    The smallest mainstream example from the top of my head would be a Tale in the Desert, an MMO without any combat, but with a focus on architecture, art, building, crafting, politics and economy. It always had somewhere between 500 to 1500 subscribers and the next chapter is supposed to start early 2014. Honestly, it's but one of a large number of small MMOs like that with very tightknit communities. Funny thing is that those games often even feel more active alive and busy than the average WoW realm.
    Last edited by Anarch the Subduer; 2013-08-19 at 11:21 PM.
    ♦ Scepticist ♦ Critic ♦ INTJ

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    Ah. It's very obvious how ... inexperienced you are with the MMO genre.
    It's very obvious how you're grasping at straws...

    Quote Originally Posted by Anarchor View Post
    The smallest mainstream example from the top of my head would be a Tale in the Desert, an MMO without any combat, but with a focus on architecture, art, building, crafting, politics and economy. It always had somewhere between 500 to 1500 subscribers and the next chapter is supposed to start early 2014. Honestly, it's but one of a large number of small MMOs like that with very tightknit communities.
    Little reality check for you... With $14 monthly subscription fee and 500 subs that would mean $7000 per month gross profit and the web page has two names listed with a Ph.D title. After taxes and expenses there's no way in hell that game is financially self-sustaining operation, instead it's making huge losses and/or operating purely on donations/goodwill. It looks more like some classroom project or retirement hobby instead of serious business.

    Sure you can make anything for niches of five people if you want to pay for it out of your own pocket and be happy about it, but it's not business anymore at that point. Blaming Blizzard for not catering to such niche groups like you did would be sane only in Narnia or some other make-believe world you're living in.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  11. #111
    I am Murloc! rhorle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    5,588
    Quote Originally Posted by Wazooty View Post
    Now, everything is designed for everyone. Having quests and stuff that people aren't made aware of the moment they're implemented is "wasted design time".
    Except that Vanilla content was designed to be done by everyone and no one was creative by doing any of Vanilla content. The only thing that made Vanilla special was less accessible raids which excluded a majority of the player base. When new stuff was added in Vanilla people flocked to it. You seem to be expressing a distaste for new content and applying it only to Mists of Pandaria.

    Every time something new comes out people will flock to it. Look at the Brawlers guild at release and look at it now. People were paying 50k+ gold for blood soaked invitations on the BMAH and now they sit there and don't go above their 1k minimum bid. Besides not every single piece of content is designed for everyone to do as the Warlock Green fire quest is only designed for Warlocks and they are far from the most popular class and according to recent developer comments have not seen a large increase in popularity from the redesign.

    I also fail to see why you think content being accessible to anyone that plays is a bad thing. New raids, quests, items, scenarios, dungeons etc should all be something that anyone can do. Why would you want a new raid, quest, or other content to be restricted to X group? And who gets to define who are the elites of WoW? You? Your friends?
    "Man is his own star. His acts are his angels, good or ill, While his fatal shadows walk silently beside him."-Rhyme of the Primeval Paradine AFC 54
    You know a community is bad when moderators lock a thread because "...this isnt the place to talk about it either seeing as it will get trolled..."

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Hansworst View Post
    In TBC it was:

    -get attuned
    - do raids
    - get exalted

    What exactly changed?

    Too many factions to grind from dalies, tying JP/Valor gear and rep together was a failure. Basically a time sink put in place by Blizz to make up for lack of dungeons and content.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I was just thinking about this the other day, and I reflected on why WoW lacks excitement currently. Its not because the downtime between patch cycles, but it stems from a much greater problem than that.

    WoW has become a bucket list. Now hear me out on this. The game is essentially played by creating a bucket list and following that list.

    1) Login.

    Goal: Cap valor asap and continue to do so on other characters

    2) Daily Heroic Scenario
    3) Daily Heroic Dungeon
    4) Battlefield Barrens weekly
    5) An LFR or two
    6) Rinse and repeat.

    Notice the only thing getting the player out in the world is the barrens weekly quest. Everything else is queued for. Its just not exciting. And after one week of the barrens quest, it gets old, especially when its done on other characters.

    Where is the excitement of logging in, and then figuring out in game what you wanted to do for the day? There are no more goals that are actually worthy of time and effort other than heroic raiding, and even that becomes dull because you essentially fought the same boss with some ability bloat to create difficulty.

    Now contrast that to an epic quest chain like the Onyxia quest line (for Alliance). There were several steps, and accomplishing each step just to gain access to that raid boss felt like you were gaining ground. You got gear along the way inevitably as you went through BRD and other dungeons. The player felt like a part of the quest. Or the quest chain that gave access to the Black Temple. Each step in the quest felt amazing because you saw how your accomplishments opened new parts of the game for you to explore. Now, the legendary quest chain is just another bucket list type quest chain. Its too carved out in stone, and feels generic.

    TL;DR

    WoW lacks excitement because the developers made the decision to create such a simple bucket list type system, with generic quests, and overly simple dungeon / raid design.

    In other words, the game is great in the gameplay department, but lags behind in the excitement factor.
    Sure everyone that plays WoW has their own "bucket list" of activities they feel are important to progress their character(s). You can always change it to include other things so it doesn't seem so grindy by doing the same routine. If the fact is that you are just unhappy playing then stop for a bit or altogether. Nothing wrong with that. 600-700k people every quarterly report seem to feel that way.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Skutch View Post
    Too many factions to grind from dalies, tying JP/Valor gear and rep together was a failure. Basically a time sink put in place by Blizz to make up for lack of dungeons and content.
    Yeah it's filler to keep you doing something besides raid or pvp until the next content patch is ready. People complain they have nothing to do so Blizzard adds more dailies to get you exalted in MoP.

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I was just thinking about this the other day, and I reflected on why WoW lacks excitement currently. Its not because the downtime between patch cycles, but it stems from a much greater problem than that.

    WoW has become a bucket list. Now hear me out on this. The game is essentially played by creating a bucket list and following that list.

    1) Login.

    Goal: Cap valor asap and continue to do so on other characters

    2) Daily Heroic Scenario
    3) Daily Heroic Dungeon
    4) Battlefield Barrens weekly
    5) An LFR or two
    6) Rinse and repeat.

    Notice the only thing getting the player out in the world is the barrens weekly quest. Everything else is queued for. Its just not exciting. And after one week of the barrens quest, it gets old, especially when its done on other characters.

    Where is the excitement of logging in, and then figuring out in game what you wanted to do for the day? There are no more goals that are actually worthy of time and effort other than heroic raiding, and even that becomes dull because you essentially fought the same boss with some ability bloat to create difficulty.

    Now contrast that to an epic quest chain like the Onyxia quest line (for Alliance). There were several steps, and accomplishing each step just to gain access to that raid boss felt like you were gaining ground. You got gear along the way inevitably as you went through BRD and other dungeons. The player felt like a part of the quest. Or the quest chain that gave access to the Black Temple. Each step in the quest felt amazing because you saw how your accomplishments opened new parts of the game for you to explore. Now, the legendary quest chain is just another bucket list type quest chain. Its too carved out in stone, and feels generic.

    TL;DR

    WoW lacks excitement because the developers made the decision to create such a simple bucket list type system, with generic quests, and overly simple dungeon / raid design.

    In other words, the game is great in the gameplay department, but lags behind in the excitement factor.
    Forgot about farming mats or dueling. The world bosses for loot. Their are even items that drop boas as well as rare that drop vanity items if you choose to not do those things it your fault.
    You're right except for 2 things.

    1. My name is spelt "God" not "Loucious-sama".
    2. I'm not a man, because man is inherently flawed. I am in fact a being so far beyond your comprehension that archaic constraints like flesh, blood, time and consequently, gender, have no meaning to me.

  15. #115
    Dreadlord Morbownz's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Cheshire, UK
    Posts
    772
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    TL;DR

    WoW lacks excitement because the developers made the decision to create such a simple bucket list type system, with generic quests, and overly simple dungeon / raid design.

    In other words, the game is great in the gameplay department, but lags behind in the excitement factor.

    I totally agree, I've played on "one of those realms we dont like to talk about on this forum" and its a completely different story, the problem is I have too much to do, do I work on proffesions? do I work on Rep? do I run dungeons? I've noticed that I spend very little time in Major cities because I am either farming mats for gold or professions or I am waiting to fill a group for a dungeon whilst gathering or questing... everything takes time and effort and the rewards are feel great.
    Lets all go to the Blizz-store, Lets all go to the Blizz-store, Lets all go to the Blizz-store to buy ourselves some treats. Delicious things for geeks, the Pixels can't be beat. The Achievement points are just dandy, them sparkling mounts are quite handy. So Lets all go to the Blizz-store and buy ourselves a treat.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    I was just thinking about this the other day, and I reflected on why WoW lacks excitement currently. Its not because the downtime between patch cycles, but it stems from a much greater problem than that.

    WoW has become a bucket list. Now hear me out on this. The game is essentially played by creating a bucket list and following that list.

    1) Login.

    Goal: Cap valor asap and continue to do so on other characters

    2) Daily Heroic Scenario
    3) Daily Heroic Dungeon
    4) Battlefield Barrens weekly
    5) An LFR or two
    6) Rinse and repeat.

    Notice the only thing getting the player out in the world is the barrens weekly quest. Everything else is queued for. Its just not exciting. And after one week of the barrens quest, it gets old, especially when its done on other characters.

    Where is the excitement of logging in, and then figuring out in game what you wanted to do for the day? There are no more goals that are actually worthy of time and effort other than heroic raiding, and even that becomes dull because you essentially fought the same boss with some ability bloat to create difficulty.

    Now contrast that to an epic quest chain like the Onyxia quest line (for Alliance). There were several steps, and accomplishing each step just to gain access to that raid boss felt like you were gaining ground. You got gear along the way inevitably as you went through BRD and other dungeons. The player felt like a part of the quest. Or the quest chain that gave access to the Black Temple. Each step in the quest felt amazing because you saw how your accomplishments opened new parts of the game for you to explore. Now, the legendary quest chain is just another bucket list type quest chain. Its too carved out in stone, and feels generic.

    TL;DR

    WoW lacks excitement because the developers made the decision to create such a simple bucket list type system, with generic quests, and overly simple dungeon / raid design.

    In other words, the game is great in the gameplay department, but lags behind in the excitement factor.
    They dumbed down the game for casuals. And millions quit their easy, boring, repetitive game.

  17. #117
    Warchief
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Behind you
    Posts
    2,084
    WoW definitely is less exciting to a certain extent due to the long years we've kept playing which makes us less excited when you keep playing over and over again or its due to the theme of the expansion but idk its up to a person's opinion why it lacks excitement.

    On the other hand, I've seemed to realize your thread is more like: WoW has ran out of options to do and its just repetitive but this expansion has many things to do in them such as:

    Pet battles, arenas, scenarios, LFR, bg's, HC/Norm/Flex raids, Proving grounds, brawler's guild, and many more and yet you're finding nothing to do? Not our fault there are many things to do.

    As for your statement of onyxia. Although you're right on this point but it required another endless grind which most players didn't reach that's why it made you feel "special" but you've gotta agree the fact that blizz has made the game easier over time and it no longer caters the players whom they sit 12+ hours on the pc to farm something just to feel special in a virtual world.

    Or the quest chain that gave access to the Black Temple. Each step in the quest felt amazing because you saw how your accomplishments opened new parts of the game for you to explore. Now, the legendary quest chain is just another bucket list type quest chain. Its too carved out in stone, and feels generic.
    I rarely see anyone saying these days: "Ahh I miss attunements I wish they were back!" It left so many people left out that often some guilds were formed just for the sake of getting people attuned to a raid. And the legendary quest part has always been the same: Get "X" of an item then "Y" afterwards to witness a special event etc... etc... I really don't see much of a difference than its available to every class now.

    But then I remembered and saw... this is just another Jaylock thread.

  18. #118
    When you've played the game through plenty of times, or spend all your time doing max level content, EVERY game becomes a bucket list. Especially MMOs.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  19. #119
    Moderator MoanaLisa's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Pacific Northwest, USA
    Posts
    10,842
    Quote Originally Posted by Wazooty View Post
    Every single piece of content is designed for EVERYONE to do. There's no creating your own experience. You are doing the same thing as everyone else.
    People that just play PVP have a very different game experience than people who do their PVP through the auction house or pet battles. People that stay out of groups have a very different experience than those who raid. Of course you can create your own game experience by putting different pieces of the game together in ways that you prefer and not doing the things you don't like. There are hundreds of different ways to play WoW. Just because the content is there for anyone to access doesn't mean that everyone is doing the same as everyone else.
    If you have anything to contribute to a thread topic, please do so. Discussing moderation or calling out specific people is against the rules and makes a post liable for an infraction. Please report problem posts. If anyone is unclear about the rules please read our FAQ. Thanks.

    It's a magical world, Hobbes, ol' buddy...let's go exploring!

  20. #120
    Field Marshal Rathnor The Flesher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    The Eye of Terror
    Posts
    96
    <meme image snipped>

    Infracted: Please don't post meme images. It's a discussion board. Please discuss and thanks. [ML]
    Last edited by MoanaLisa; 2013-08-20 at 03:46 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •