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  1. #101
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    It was the first time he met them and he discussed it with them. We don't have the story of when the two races first met. We don't know if there was a warning or not.

    A warning might not even change anything, Kil'jaeden didn't show up and go, "hey guys, I'm a demon," by the time demons actually showed up the orcs didn't trust the draenei at all so why would they even believe a warning at that point?
    Like I said, a warning to the Orcs isn't something you leave out of a story, especially in the case of "Rise of the Horde"

    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    why would they even believe a warning at that point?
    I see you can't even manage to convince yourself of your own argument.

    The Orcs didn't trust the Draenei at all by the time the demons showed up, that is the only thing you're right about. However, in addition to the other things you've failed at, you've even managed to get the definition of warning wrong, let me help you with that

    noun
    a statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation


    A warning about the Eredar and the Burning Legion wouldn't have done much good by the time KJ showed up, because at that point it wouldn't be a warning, it would just be a statement.

  2. #102
    Pandaren Monk GreenFuse's Avatar
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    Meh. Horde got the cooler sister. Has there been any interactions between the siblings since Sylvanas got undead? I wouldn't mind seeing a sister fight. Veressa comes to storm Silvermoon and Sylvanas is like, "Oh no you didn't! Are those my earrings? Is that my bow!?"

    Do it, Blizz. Make it happen.

  3. #103
    Pandaren Monk Zogarth's Avatar
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    Just get a Monkey King Bar, and Windrunners dodge is no problem at all. You can also just stun her during the windrun.

  4. #104
    I see you can't even manage to convince yourself of your own argument.

    The Orcs didn't trust the Draenei at all by the time the demons showed up, that is the only thing you're right about. However, in addition to the other things you've failed at, you've even managed to get the definition of warning wrong, let me help you with that

    noun
    a statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation

    A warning about the Eredar and the Burning Legion wouldn't have done much good by the time KJ showed up, because at that point it wouldn't be a warning, it would just be a statement.
    Ok, if the draenei warn the orcs 200 years ago when the first land the orcs have an oral history and things tend to get lost, especially abstract concepts with no concrete evidence. Assuming that it actually managed to get passed down then the orcs would still have fallen for Kil'jaeden's tricks. By the time an actual demon shows up they don't trust the draenei at all so any past warning would be disregarded anyway.

    Whether a warning was made or not it likely would have made no difference in the end.

  5. #105
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    Ok, if the draenei warn the orcs 200 years ago when the first land the orcs have an oral history and things tend to get lost, especially abstract concepts with no concrete evidence. Assuming that it actually managed to get passed down then the orcs would still have fallen for Kil'jaeden's tricks. By the time an actual demon shows up they don't trust the draenei at all so any past warning would be disregarded anyway.

    Whether a warning was made or not it likely would have made no difference in the end.
    Who are you trying to convince right now? Me or yourself? Seriously, just give it up and admit you're wrong, it's pathetic, the more you keep this up, the worse you look. You've been refuted by multiple posters here, you picked an argument you can't win, and yet you won't admit it, I would say stop while you're ahead, but that's not even applicable here, since you never were.

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    Who are you trying to convince right now? Me or yourself? Seriously, just give it up and admit you're wrong, it's pathetic, the more you keep this up, the worse you look. You've been refuted by multiple posters here, you picked an argument you can't win, and yet you won't admit it, I would say stop while you're ahead, but that's not even applicable here, since you never were.
    It's an argument with no answer because the lore never says there was a warning or not. It doesn't really matter in the end since the same outcome was likely to happen anyway. I didn't pick the argument either.

  7. #107
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    It's an argument with no answer because the lore never says there wasn't a warning. I didn't pick the argument either.
    The lore also, and more importantly, I might add, never said there was. You assuming that there was is just you going and injecting something you feel should be in Blizzard's story. Sorry, but try again.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    The lore also, and more importantly, I might add, never said there was. You assuming that there was is just you going and injecting something you feel should be in Blizzard's story. Sorry, but try again.
    There is no answer in the lore.

  9. #109
    I am Murloc! Wildberry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyrt View Post
    There is no answer in the lore.
    I'm pretty sure if the lore doesn't specifically state an event happened, it didn't happen. Otherwise, I could make the claim that, let's say:

    Some time during the Trial of the Champion, Garrosh Hellscream told Varian Wrynn that he was pleased with the outcome of the First War, and if given the Chance, would burn Stormwind to the ground again.

    Now, any reasonable person would say "No, you're making that up.", however if I'm operating under your reasoning, then I could simply say "Well the Lore never said that it didn't happen."

    Do you see how ridiculous that is? Because if not, Velen is actually an alcoholic, it turns out that he really enjoys Dwarven Ale.

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Wildberry View Post
    I'm pretty sure if the lore doesn't specifically state an event happened, it didn't happen. Otherwise, I could make the claim that, let's say:

    Some time during the Trial of the Champion, Garrosh Hellscream told Varian Wrynn that he was pleased with the outcome of the First War, and if given the Chance, would burn Stormwind to the ground again.

    Now, any reasonable person would say "No, you're making that up.", however if I'm operating under your reasoning, then I could simply say "Well the Lore never said that it didn't happen."

    Do you see how ridiculous that is? Because if not, Velen is actually an alcoholic, it turns out that he really enjoys Dwarven Ale.
    There is no lore for the first meeting of orcs and draenei, does that mean it never happened? I mean, they obviously had to meet at some point, but since it's not in the lore it didn't happen right?

  11. #111
    High Overlord Kalodrei's Avatar
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    vereesa windrunner guilty of being awesome and my favorite of the 3 sisters

  12. #112
    Bloodsail Admiral Asheriah's Avatar
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    But I like both !

    The only one I don't like is Alleria.

    We don't believe in your Horde or your Alliance. We only believe in undeath.

  13. #113
    Over 9000! Snowraven's Avatar
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    NO! Veressa is the kind of grey character the Alliance needs so that the Alliance doesn't look so great and honorable.

    Veressa should stay.


    Now, back to Veressa's actions. She and the living high elves survived the battle with the Scourge. They fought as hard as any high elf against the Scourge... yet the high elves, as in the elves that didn't agree to suck fel magic to live on, were kicked out of Quel'thalas by their bretheren, the blood elves. So, after fighting as much as anyone, they were kicked out of their homes. Then the blood elves's leader, Kael'thas, allied with demons. And at start the blood elves were fine. Only when he turned on them were they "not fine" anymore. Later on, they started participating in Horde raids on the former allies of them, the humans, dwarves, gnomes, and even their bretheren, the high elves, while the forsaken leader, a former high elf herself, directed attacks at the high elves sitting in strongholds dominated by the Scourge because they were kicked out of their homes.
    And later on, when Varian had almost convinced the blood elves to rejoin the Alliance... they use Dalaran to steal the Divine Bell... so it was all a trick and in Veressa's mind this shows clearly that all those that became blood elves were despicable creatures. Yet... they were given a chance to escape still from Dalaran. But some chose to stay. Very well, those were imprisoned... but some chose to fight too? So what, they thought the rouse and using Dalaran in favor of the Horde was ok? This cannot stand. And so Veressa ordered them dead. I see it as a fair point.

    Plus, she's much better then her sister, Sylvannas, the one from whose order the Blight was devloped, she used the blight on civilians, unsuspecting women and children, she attacked neutral organizations and bullied even the blood elves into submission while ordering attacks on the living.

  14. #114
    Sylvanus dies in the next expansion. For real this time, sorry.

  15. #115
    Scarab Lord Moon Blade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arrashi View Post
    "Outliving" anything is pretty touchy subject for undead you know ?

    Also what is this "wrath of alliance" ? Drowning us in tears ?
    The wrath of the alliance is a glorious bloodbath and slaughter of every horde race to near extinction that cdev won't let us do because "we're the good guys" -.-
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  16. #116
    Pandaren Monk Of-the-horde's Avatar
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    Why not kill all 3 and get rid of them entirely?

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Talthun View Post
    Vereesa and Jaina are guilty of taking vengeance on the Horde for their repeated foul play and betrayal. An understandable stance at this point. Take out your own trash (Garrosh, Sylvanas, many blood elves, and honestly most of the forsaken) before getting all whiny about other characters. Honestly their only crime is standing up to the Horde. A grave sin in the holy bible of horde fanboyism.
    Apparently when the Horde characters kill Alliance, they're heroes, but when the Alliance characters kill Horde, they're insane. They wrote Vereesa this expansion the way they write most Horde characters, but somehow it's wrong because she's killing Horde apparently... all Alliance are supposed to be weak, right?

  18. #118
    Scarab Lord Moon Blade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daveon View Post
    Apparently when the Horde characters kill Alliance, they're heroes, but when the Alliance characters kill Horde, they're insane
    pretty much sums it all up entirely. And devs want Alliance players to feel this way too which is the biggest problem of all. As Alliance we should not only be comfortable with slaughtering the Horde when they get out of line, but encourage and revel in it as Horde seems to revel in attacking us.
    If it's not an elf, leave it on the shelf.
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  19. #119
    Over 9000! Snowraven's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Blade View Post
    pretty much sums it all up entirely. And devs want Alliance players to feel this way too which is the biggest problem of all. As Alliance we should not only be comfortable with slaughtering the Horde when they get out of line, but encourage and revel in it as Horde seems to revel in attacking us.
    Indeed, fully agreed with this. We've had chars that wanted to payback the Horde... and for what, they were turned insane by Blizzard just because.

    Let's take Fandral for example. Despite the last moment "oh, but he was always enthralled by the Old Gods" the ideas was only that he didn't want peace with the Horde and he wanted to kill the Horde because his nephew was killed by the Horde. Same deal for Leyara, her son had been killed by the Horde and she wanted revenge, Malfurion wouldn't let either have theirs, so they had to turn to someone else.
    Now Maiev wants the Horde to die... and she's been turned into a bad guy.

    When I did the Swamp of Sorrows Alliance quests I was thrilled, I was thinking "finally, we get some mayhem on the Horde" and then at the end that dumb commander goes and says "oh, we're not animals like the Horde to kill them all, burn their village and dance in their ashes" well no shit, maybe I wanted to do that, in the end, that's what they wanted to do to us and that's what they deserved. And you know what? Doing exactly that in the Shatterspear Village with my night elf felt way better then having some commander tell me "well, run along, we're not killing those guys who want to wipe us out, we're better then that".

  20. #120
    Legendary! Arrashi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moon Blade View Post
    The wrath of the alliance is a glorious bloodbath and slaughter of every horde race to near extinction that cdev won't let us do because "we're the good guys" -.-
    That's cute. And after it is done, you guys wake up ?

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