How would you feel about Lor'themar Theron as Warchief?

[tinyninja]

Exactly. Like I said, Lor'themar and Sylvanas could deal with the Kor'kron in Undercity and then move on to support the Kalimdor rebels. But, by joining the Alliance, he would even left his true ally, the Forsaken, alone.

This is exactly what they do in game, but until 5.3 there was NO rebellion. Lor'themar and Sylvanas aren't sending their people for "winds of rebellion". If they went at the time you wanted them to they would have shown up and what, meet up with the rebel forces that don't exist yet?

[Stuntzii]

Exactly. Like I said, Lor'themar and Sylvanas could deal with the Kor'kron in Undercity and then move on to support the Kalimdor rebels. But, by joining the Alliance, he would even left his true ally, the Forsaken, alone.

Were there actually any rebels at that time though? By moving against the Kor'kron in UC it would have been an open act of rebellion that would have left the Forsaken and Blood Elves potentially vulnerable with no allies. Vol'jins forces were being held captive by the Kor'kron in their own town etc.

To me it just felt like the air of rebellion was growing the whole time, but they were moving slowly. The whole quest chain to me felt like they were biding their time. Maybe I'm reading more into it bu that's how it came off to me.

[Grubjuice]

Exactly. Like I said, Lor'themar and Sylvanas could deal with the Kor'kron in Undercity and then move on to support the Kalimdor rebels. But, by joining the Alliance, he would even left his true ally, the Forsaken, alone.

also if he left the horde to join the alliance, he would have a very pissed Foresaken cutting him off from his new allies.

Yeah the relationship between the BElfs and the Foresaken are strained but not insoluable. The fact is they have more in common with each other than any other pairing of horde races could be said to have.

[Deleted]

The relations between forsaken and blood elven leadership is strained to say the least, he chose a path that would ensure the minimum amount of casualties among his people, he tried several times to reign Garrosh in, but that ultimately failed and left him little choice but to consider old allegiances.

Which is why I can't see someone that quickly throws his allies under the bus that fast as Warchief. They would become enemies if the Purge didn't happened.

[razorfire]

No they really haven't. In fact most of your counter points have been blasted out of the water time and time again, and most of your points apply to any potential candiate.



Yeah cause Vo'jin never had thoughts of ditching the horde.



Which is the fault of the devs. Just like Rexxar was supposed to be scene in the Barrens patch, he got cut. Don't blame the character for what the devs can squeeze in, or not. Sylvanas has been mostly absent this xp, that's not her fault, that's the fault of the devs.

As for the 'too scared' comment, you want to make points, make factual points. If you can't make a point without bashing him, you already lost.



Lor'themar has been leading the Blood Elves since TBC. He may not have been in the spot light until now, but he's been leading them.

Where in the game is it said she only uses it because she was pushed by Garrosh? And sure anyone could tell her not to, it's a matter of who she'll listen to. Again, fail argument because it applies to ANYONE. This argument doesn't state why Lor'themar SPECIFICALLY is not fit to lead.



Capitalization, punctuation and breaking points into more appropriate paragraphs makes my eyes bleed less and as such able to have a discussion with you easier.

Again, you're hold a real world problem (how and when the devs decide to put him into the spotlight) against who the character is. Thrall was untested and he did fine... at least until he made Garrosh warchief. So again your argument fails. The only other warchief we've had was a compeltely untested pup who at the end of his career put the worst possible person in charge of the Horde. Lor'themar couldn't do much worse than that.



I fail to see the point here. Vol'jin has never been a fan of the alliance (in fact his original ptr text had him speaking down to the alliance during the barrens stuff). You also assume he saw going to the alliance as an option. Who's to say that if in the past his trolls and the alliance had been allies, he wouldn't have thought about it? He thought about leaving the horde and I argue he only didn't go to the alliance because he doesn't like them and knew they'd just as soon kill his people as allow them into the alliance. You're making comparisons where they don't exist because your argument assumes both men had the same options available, they didn't. The elves were once part of the alliance, the trolls never were.



So this automatically means he's a better potential leader than Lor'themar who has connections with um... the alliance. I'd take a guy who can peace-talk with the alliance over some hybrid who has had very little to no character growth in this entire game.

If you want to use Lor'themars lack of spotlight moments as a point against him, don't use knowing Rexxar as a point in favor of anyone. Lor'themar has had more time in the spotlight than Rexxar, so again another failed argument.



Yes and as I already stated, was a nobody until he was made someone by leading the horde, and he also made the single largest mistake in the history of the Azerothian horde.



But Saur is still an orc, and his people were never actually part OF the alliance. Dying beside them against the orcs.

I don't argue it has to be Lor'themar simply based on race. If you go back and look at my posts, I've listed specific reason why he should and the only time his race has come up as a factor is simply because his people were once part of the alliance.

Simply stating he should/shouldn't for no other reason than his race is personal preference and nothing more. It's like saying Obama never should have been elected or should have been elected because he has african heritage. It's about who the man is, not what genes make him up.

So again, most of your 'good reasons why he shouldn't' have been countered multiple times.

Looking forward to your next post where you argue the same points that could apply to any of the potential leaders and still fail to argue:

WHY LOR'THEMAR SPECIFICALLY SHOULD NOT BE WARCHIEF

Because so far, you've failed at doing that.

you simply ignoring or denying every point that isn't saying your favorite character isn't the perfect decision you're pushing for him to be is not the same as not having given valid points. and most of the counterpoints haven't been "blown out of the water" they've been met with what equates to "well..hey look at this other thing that I think makes him look good!" vol'jin may have had thoughts of leaving, but unlike lor'themar he never acted on them. if not for the dalaran purge he WOULD have left to join the alliance without even having looked to the rest of the horde for aid. on the "blame the devs" they've had plenty of time to show him and when they finally did THAT'S when all of the love for him spontaneously came into being. you don't think he was "scared to act" go look at his leader short story, even going to northrend is a decision that's made for him by sylvanas.

lor'themar has had a dedicated council helping him manage things around silvermoon consisting mostly of the decision making and support of romath and halduron, he has otherwise, from what's shown, been simply following whatever sylvanas or garrosh say. and I never said sylvanas would ONLY use it because of garrosh forcing her into fights, I'm saying she wouldn't use it AS MUCH. gilneas was a fight she was forced into by garrosh, that is the largest use of plague we actually see in game aside from the unexplained circumstances of southshore, and she uses it there because garrosh managed to screw up the initial assault so badly she had to in order to keep an advantage. also if you're going to make a comment based on my punctuation and way of typing in an attempt to discredit me, let me help you out. ?!@$!@%$@!%!@^!^$#^.

so...you're saying no to vol'jin because your speculation on what ifs...and you're saying that unless someone is the bestest of friends with the alliance there can't be peace... right.. you then try to discredit baine who has about as much good leadership of his people as lor'themar has shown for the same reason you say I can't shoot down lor'themar. read lord of the clans then look into the amount of time between when thrall started leading all the orcs of the new horde and when he actually gained the support and friendship of the trolls and tauren..unlike lor'themar he didn't get from competent leader to leader of an entire major faction instantly like people want. and your dismissal of saurfang is yet again just saying "he's not bestest friends with the alliance, somehow that means he can't get peace with the alliance without having been a member of the alliance"


saying a race was or was not part of the alliance shouldn't impact their ability to not declare war like idiotic children, that's simply personal decisions and goals. and yes I agree with you no leader should be chosen or denied based on race, but that's part of my annoyance with this sudden "lor'themar for warchief" push. people seem to be pushing lor'themar more simply because he is a member of the most "alliance like" of the horde races (and no I don't say that meaning he should be in the alliance, they have good reasons not to be in the alliance), claims that the bloodelves should come to the forefront are almost all backed up by saying the horde needs to advance or "we have enough orcs vs humans".

yes I get that you think I'm arguing the same points and that you think none of them have any negative effect towards lor'themar, I understand that. but. JUST BECAUSE YOU LIKE A CHARACTER DOES NOT MEAN YOU SHOULD IGNORE THE NEGATIVE PARTS OF THEIR STORY! IGNORING THAT LOR'THEMAR ACTIVELY PLANNED TO ABANDON THE HORDE, THAT HE, MUCH LIKE GARROSH, WOULD BE PUSHED TO LEADERSHIP DIRECTLY AFTER A LONGSTANDING LACK OF CONFIDENCE, AND THAT HE DIDN'T EVEN WANT HIS OWN OFFICE BUT IS SUPPOSEDLY MEANT TO ACCEPT BEING WARCHIEF IS IDIOTIC.

but don't worry, I suspect somehow you will continue to ignore all points against him as ineffective but swear up and down your own arguments in his favor make him the best candidate ever.

[tinyninja]

you simply ignoring or denying every point that isn't saying your favorite character isn't the perfect decision you're pushing for him to be is not the same as not having given valid points. and most of the counterpoints haven't been "blown out of the water" they've been met with what equates to "well..hey look at this other thing that I think makes him look good!" vol'jin may have had thoughts of leaving, but unlike lor'themar he never acted on them. if not for the dalaran purge he WOULD have left to join the alliance without even having looked to the rest of the horde for aid. on the "blame the devs" they've had plenty of time to show him and when they finally did THAT'S when all of the love for him spontaneously came into being. you don't think he was "scared to act" go look at his leader short story, even going to northrend is a decision that's made for him by sylvanas.

lor'themar has had a dedicated council helping him manage things around silvermoon consisting mostly of the decision making and support of romath and halduron, he has otherwise, from what's shown, been simply following whatever sylvanas or garrosh say. and I never said sylvanas would ONLY use it because of garrosh forcing her into fights, I'm saying she wouldn't use it AS MUCH. gilneas was a fight she was forced into by garrosh, that is the largest use of plague we actually see in game aside from the unexplained circumstances of southshore, and she uses it there because garrosh managed to screw up the initial assault so badly she had to in order to keep an advantage. also if you're going to make a comment based on my punctuation and way of typing in an attempt to discredit me, let me help you out. ?!@$!@%$@!%!@^!^$#^.

so...you're saying no to vol'jin because your speculation on what ifs...and you're saying that unless someone is the bestest of friends with the alliance there can't be peace... right.. you then try to discredit baine who has about as much good leadership of his people as lor'themar has shown for the same reason you say I can't shoot down lor'themar. read lord of the clans then look into the amount of time between when thrall started leading all the orcs of the new horde and when he actually gained the support and friendship of the trolls and tauren..unlike lor'themar he didn't get from competent leader to leader of an entire major faction instantly like people want. and your dismissal of saurfang is yet again just saying "he's not bestest friends with the alliance, somehow that means he can't get peace with the alliance without having been a member of the alliance"


saying a race was or was not part of the alliance shouldn't impact their ability to not declare war like idiotic children, that's simply personal decisions and goals. and yes I agree with you no leader should be chosen or denied based on race, but that's part of my annoyance with this sudden "lor'themar for warchief" push. people seem to be pushing lor'themar more simply because he is a member of the most "alliance like" of the horde races (and no I don't say that meaning he should be in the alliance, they have good reasons not to be in the alliance), claims that the bloodelves should come to the forefront are almost all backed up by saying the horde needs to advance or "we have enough orcs vs humans".

yes I get that you think I'm arguing the same points and that you think none of them have any negative effect towards lor'themar, I understand that. but. JUST BECAUSE YOU LIKE A CHARACTER DOES NOT MEAN YOU SHOULD IGNORE THE NEGATIVE PARTS OF THEIR STORY! IGNORING THAT LOR'THEMAR ACTIVELY PLANNED TO ABANDON THE HORDE, THAT HE, MUCH LIKE GARROSH, WOULD BE PUSHED TO LEADERSHIP DIRECTLY AFTER A LONGSTANDING LACK OF CONFIDENCE, AND THAT HE DIDN'T EVEN WANT HIS OWN OFFICE BUT IS SUPPOSEDLY MEANT TO ACCEPT BEING WARCHIEF IS IDIOTIC.

but don't worry, I suspect somehow you will continue to ignore all points against him as ineffective but swear up and down your own arguments in his favor make him the best candidate ever.

There is no way in hell I or anyone else should go through the effort of reading through that wall of text if you can't be bothered to put in some effort yourself and use some damn capitilization. I know you don't care because you think it's not important but it is, because your posts are literally eyesores. Not that you're talking about anything new that we haven't already refuted about four pages back.

[Vokal]

Best choice ever, its about time the Horde had a pretty War Chief.

[Sal the Shieldhog]

you simply ignoring or denying every point that isn't saying your favorite character isn't the perfect decision you're pushing for him to be is not the same as not having given valid points. and most of the counterpoints haven't been "blown out of the water" they've been met with what equates to "well..hey look at this other thing that I think makes him look good!" vol'jin may have had thoughts of leaving, but unlike lor'themar he never acted on them. if not for the dalaran purge he WOULD have left to join the alliance without even having looked to the rest of the horde for aid. on the "blame the devs" they've had plenty of time to show him and when they finally did THAT'S when all of the love for him spontaneously came into being. you don't think he was "scared to act" go look at his leader short story, even going to northrend is a decision that's made for him by sylvanas.

lor'themar has had a dedicated council helping him manage things around silvermoon consisting mostly of the decision making and support of romath and halduron, he has otherwise, from what's shown, been simply following whatever sylvanas or garrosh say. and I never said sylvanas would ONLY use it because of garrosh forcing her into fights, I'm saying she wouldn't use it AS MUCH. gilneas was a fight she was forced into by garrosh, that is the largest use of plague we actually see in game aside from the unexplained circumstances of southshore, and she uses it there because garrosh managed to screw up the initial assault so badly she had to in order to keep an advantage. also if you're going to make a comment based on my punctuation and way of typing in an attempt to discredit me, let me help you out. ?!@$!@%$@!%!@^!^$#^.

so...you're saying no to vol'jin because your speculation on what ifs...and you're saying that unless someone is the bestest of friends with the alliance there can't be peace... right.. you then try to discredit baine who has about as much good leadership of his people as lor'themar has shown for the same reason you say I can't shoot down lor'themar. read lord of the clans then look into the amount of time between when thrall started leading all the orcs of the new horde and when he actually gained the support and friendship of the trolls and tauren..unlike lor'themar he didn't get from competent leader to leader of an entire major faction instantly like people want. and your dismissal of saurfang is yet again just saying "he's not bestest friends with the alliance, somehow that means he can't get peace with the alliance without having been a member of the alliance"


saying a race was or was not part of the alliance shouldn't impact their ability to not declare war like idiotic children, that's simply personal decisions and goals. and yes I agree with you no leader should be chosen or denied based on race, but that's part of my annoyance with this sudden "lor'themar for warchief" push. people seem to be pushing lor'themar more simply because he is a member of the most "alliance like" of the horde races (and no I don't say that meaning he should be in the alliance, they have good reasons not to be in the alliance), claims that the bloodelves should come to the forefront are almost all backed up by saying the horde needs to advance or "we have enough orcs vs humans".

yes I get that you think I'm arguing the same points and that you think none of them have any negative effect towards lor'themar, I understand that. but. JUST BECAUSE YOU LIKE A CHARACTER DOES NOT MEAN YOU SHOULD IGNORE THE NEGATIVE PARTS OF THEIR STORY! IGNORING THAT LOR'THEMAR ACTIVELY PLANNED TO ABANDON THE HORDE, THAT HE, MUCH LIKE GARROSH, WOULD BE PUSHED TO LEADERSHIP DIRECTLY AFTER A LONGSTANDING LACK OF CONFIDENCE, AND THAT HE DIDN'T EVEN WANT HIS OWN OFFICE BUT IS SUPPOSEDLY MEANT TO ACCEPT BEING WARCHIEF IS IDIOTIC.

but don't worry, I suspect somehow you will continue to ignore all points against him as ineffective but swear up and down your own arguments in his favor make him the best candidate ever.

A good leader does what is best for his people. As of that time, Lor'themar's people were the Sin'dorei. He took the oath yes, the same oath all the other leaders did - to protect and guard each other. But where was Vol'jin when the blood elves were being thrown to the wolves by Garrosh? Some family, eh?

Furthermore, there is a small part in Tides of War where Garrosh summons Lor'themar to Orgrimmar:

Garrosh later summons Lor'themar for a private audience, thanking him for his loyalty. When prompted to discuss the nature of said loyalty, Lor'themar makes it clear that he is loyal to the Horde, though Garrosh reminds him that he is the Horde. Lor'themar corrects him, stating that he is merely its leader. As Garrosh observes the sin'dorei retinue leave Orgrimmar, he uneasily concludes that Theron in particular is worth watching.

This makes me think that Garrosh tried to get Lor'themar to leave, putting the stealing of the Divine Bell and the Purge of Dalaran in a whole new light. Perhaps getting Lor'themar to the breaking point was Garrosh's plan all along, to get the Blood Elves out of the Horde and get the others to turn on them.

As for the lack of wanting an office, the best leaders are those who do not actively pursue power. THe best leaders are those who are pushed into the role - and they generally come to terms, and accept and excel at the role they are given. It happened with Thrall, it happened with Vol'jin - hell, it happened with George Washington (he didn't want to lead the military, much less become President of the nation).

I don't care that Lor'themar is the most "Alliance-like" of the Horde - because the Blood Elves aren't. It doesn't matter anyways, because Lor'themar is, by and large, one of the most qualified people we have for the job. I'm saying to to Vol'jin because he, much like Cairne, actively went against Thrall's wishes (the same Thrall who Vol'jin says what the Horde should be). And yes, yes Thrall did. He was pushed into the role of Warchief when Doomhammer died his untimely death.

On to the Vol'jin/Cairne stuff: Before Thrall left, he asked Cairne, Etrigg, and Vol'jin to help Garrosh out, to guide him into the role of Warchief and stand by him. THis was to keep the peace, reign Garrosh in, and keep the Horde in Thrall's ideals. We saw how well that went over. Cairne immediately told Thrall that is was a bad idea and challenged (and died, due to Magatha's interference) Garrosh for the Warchief's throne. Vol'jin immediately upped-and-outed from Orgrimmar. SO Vol'jin, the same Vol'jin who claims to be upholding Thrall's ideals of a better Horde, went against Thrall in the first place. Had he and Cairne not, we might very well not be here arguing this right now.

As for Lor'themar's credentials: He spent a good few years as Ranger-General (after Sylvanas died; he was her second-in-command, if memory serves), leading the Farstriders and defense of the kingdom from the remnants of the Scourge. After that, he was thrown into the regency. He, as per Kael'thas' request, was guided and helped, shaped into the leader he is today. He was built upon, in the same way Garrosh ought to have been by Cairne and Vol'jin. And what do we see? He is a really good person and leader, which is why I advocate him for becoming Warchief (and King of Quel'thalas, but that's a different matter entirely).

So yes, the beginnings of Lor'themar's and Garrosh's insertion to leadership roles are much the same. The difference is Lor'themar's aides helped him as they were asked, while those who were asked by THrall to help Garrosh told Thrall and Garrosh to fuck off. That's why Lor'themar should be Warchief and Vol'jin shouldn't be.

- - - Updated - - -

There is no way in hell I or anyone else should go through the effort of reading through that wall of text if you can't be bothered to put in some effort yourself and use some damn capitilization. I know you don't care because you think it's not important but it is, because your posts are literally eyesores. Not that you're talking about anything new that we haven't already refuted about four pages back.

Eh, I took the effort to. Hope he doesn't just go "LOL LOR'THEMAR SUCKS" on me, since I'm just joining the argument.

- - - Updated - - -

As well, read this. It's from his journal:

I cannot remember the last time I told anyone such a bald-faced lie, even since I was forced into politics. But I did lie to Aethas, and he knows it, and I know it, and anyone who heard me say it knows it. My will means very little, in fact. I can pretend my power is real, but in the end, it is all an act, and none of it is honest. I can wash my hands of it, play martyr, be victimized, and accomplish nothing, or I can fight and victimize others in my turn and thus become the essence of all I have battled. If I have ever rationalized my choices using any other logic, I was certainly lying to myself. Hawkspear was right: I deal with the devil indeed, but the Sunwell may never have been restored had we not sunk to those levels. He and Aurora can sleep soundly, knowing they have never compromised their ethics, but if they deny that they prosper in the wake of those who have, then they delude themselves as much as I.

Here I find myself so close to believing that the ends justify the means. But the ruins of the Magisters' Terrace will haunt me forever, reminding me of the fate I tempt with that thought. This is the line I walk, finally knowing that the actions I take in necessity are nonetheless indefensible. Those truths can never be reconciled, but sometimes I can hold them both side by side and almost understand. I might call this revelation profound if I were ignorant enough not to realize that I am only learning what Kael'thas, and Anasterian before him, had also learned in their turns. All we can do is walk the road we are given with such dignity as we can muster, each to our own glory or demise, and pray that there yet remains something of our own hearts when all is said and done. By the Sunwell, I hope that there will remain something of mine.

I loved the ending of that so much I made it my Senior Quote for my graduating yearbook. You can't tell me that he wouldn't make a fantastic Warchief. If you'd like the context, it's from his short story on the WoW website.

EDIT: Do note that that entry is from just before the release of Wrath, lorewise. Since then, he's obviously thrown off Sylvanas' bindings, as the Sunwell and the recently-acquired Blood Golems (as well as the possible, hopefully shown if they ever re-do the starting zones, reversed corruption of the Ghostlands), combined with the Lich King's death (meaning less Scourge), means that they no longer need to rely on Sylvanas' Forsaken to defend their borders.

And no, I don't foresee an Alliance assault somehow surviving a Sin'dorei controlled Dark Animus for long.

EDIT: This too:

Lor'themar has become a ruler balancing a fierce love for his country together with the weight of his peoples' burdens, though his responsibilities were not always so heavy. Years before his regency, Lor'themar was a patriotic and passionate ranger, with a talent for both battle and strategy. Lor'themar took pride in his role as a Farstrider and a warden of the Sunwell, which the great traitor Dar'Khan Drathir exploited for his own gain. Lor'themar holds guilt for his inability to see through Dar'Khan's betrayal, and further remorse for the exile he imposed on the quel'dorei who opposed Rommath's teachings; Lor'themar reasoned that he could not lead a nation divided. Theron was hit hard by the betrayal of Prince Kael'thas, with the future of the country falling into his lap alone.

As the regent lord of Quel'Thalas, Lor'themar has become highly versed in the world of politics, able to quickly deduce hidden meanings and often see through the masks of those within (and out of) his sphere of influence. Though authoritative (and not afraid to exert that authority), Lor'themar values the opinions of his advisors, in matters of state and beyond. The life of a politician is not something Lor'themar ever craved, however; ever the ranger at heart, Lor'themar enjoys a good fight.

Lor'themar places the safety of Quel'Thalas and its people high above all else. Lor'themar's loyalty is clear in this regard: he will not suffer allies who would harm his people, and will not shy from negotiating with his enemies or plotting rebellion to secure his people a future.

Though the burdens of leadership have weighed heavily on Lor'themar's shoulders in the wake of Prince Kael'thas' betrayal, under his leadership Quel'Thalas has survived many of its darkest days. He has resolved to see his people overcome their struggles, and lead them into a prosperous future.

[Deleted]

I'd be cool with him as warchief..But I can't imagine Sylvanas obeying him, I prefer someone else. Like Vol'jin(but that's so obvious that they might not even do it)or Sylvanas. But i don't think everyone agrees with her methods of rulling.

[Deleted]

It would be interesting if anything. He gets my vote.

[Maxilian]

I'd be cool with him as warchief..But I can't imagine Sylvanas obeying him, I prefer someone else. Like Vol'jin(but that's so obvious that they might not even do it)or Sylvanas. But i don't think everyone agrees with her methods of rulling.

I don't agree... why? 2 reasons:

first, Sylvanas can't be the warchief because she's not trusted by the rest of the horde

second, Sylvanas would prefer Lorthemar than any other as the leader of the Horde, because she still see the BE as her people, remenber that she was the one who talked to Trall to let the Blood Elf into the Horde....

[Vokal]

I hope its not Vol'jin. He looks like someone shoved a couple of broken bicycle handlebars into his mouth and bashed his head bad, Not to mention the freakiest gross feet. Trolls are fucking weird.

[lupii]

second, Sylvanas would prefer Lorthemar than any other as the leader of the Horde, because she still see the BE as her people, remenber that she was the one who talked to Trall to let the Blood Elf into the Horde....

This actually might give weight for Lor'themar to be warchief, because it will keep Sylvanas in line better than Garrosh ever could.

[Daws001]

I voted neutral but after reading some of the comments, I'm convinced. Let's put Lor'themar in charge.

Maybe we can finally use flying mounts in the greater Silvermoon City metropolitan area.

[Maxilian]

This actually might give weight for Lor'themar to be warchief, because it will keep Sylvanas in line better than Garrosh ever could.

Yeah, also... Lorthemar could easily get her to vote for him, if they have to chose a new warchief

[lupii]

Yeah, also... Lorthemar could easily get her to vote for him, if they have to chose a new warchief

Pretty much. But I also question Sylvanas in general, its not completely clear where Blizz wants her to end up as. She isn't the character that she was at the beginning of WoW and she seems to have actually deteriorated when Arthas died.

...Might wanna call it Maiev Syndrome.

[Maxilian]

Pretty much. But I also question Sylvanas in general, its not completely clear where Blizz wants her to end up as. She isn't the character that she was at the beginning of WoW and she seems to have actually deteriorated when Arthas died.

...Might wanna call it Maiev Syndrome.

Naaa, she hasn't gone as far as Maiev :P

[lupii]

Naaa, she hasn't gone as far as Maiev :P

Yet... /10chars

[Maxilian]

Yet... /10chars

True, i hope she doesn't, reasons:

1- I love Sylvanas, she's my favorite character... and not these's not FAVORITISM! ... :P

2- Cause that means we will have to kill her... and we have kill her once (End time), saw her die 3 times (Warcraft 3 when arthas killed her, When was betrayed and shooted in the head and in Garrosh vision) and read how she died once (in her short story where she commits suicide)

[Combatbutler]

True, i hope she doesn't, reasons:

1- I love Sylvanas, she's my favorite character... and not these's not FAVORITISM! ... :P

2- Cause that means we will have to kill her... and we have kill her once (End time), saw her die 3 times (Warcraft 3 when arthas killed her, When was betrayed and shooted in the head and in Garrosh vision) and read how she died once (in her short story where she commits suicide)

I am somewhat baffled, that she didn't start to train in order to become a lich, given her track record.