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  1. #161
    Quote Originally Posted by Laurcus View Post
    Why? Because you said so?
    If you are not a world first raider chances are improving your rotation while on the move (for example) will get you a MUCH bigger increase than swapping worgen for troll.

  2. #162
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    If you are not a world first raider chances are improving your rotation while on the move (for example) will get you a MUCH bigger increase than swapping worgen for troll.
    Again, why can't you do both?
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  3. #163
    Oh my God, TOP 100 WoW guilds are forced to play Horde! Quick, to the Batmobile!

    Seriously, nobody cares about racials except a miniscule percentage of players called TOP 100 progress raiders and/or TOP 100 arena PvPers.

  4. #164
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    If you are not a world first raider chances are improving your rotation while on the move (for example) will get you a MUCH bigger increase than swapping worgen for troll.
    Such a huge false assumption that only world first raiders care about maximizing their potential and utilizing whatever advantage you can to get there. Who wouldn't want a FREE DPS increase?

    Oh yeah, faction transfer isn't an option because (1) Not everyone wants to play cows, green men or an effete version of an elf and (2) Transfer is stupidly expensive if you want to take your alts.

    Give EVERY race a version of EMfH and a second racial just for color but NOT a power benefit.

  5. #165
    Quote Originally Posted by Kashii View Post
    Such a huge false assumption that only world first raiders care about maximizing their potential and utilizing whatever advantage you can to get there. Who wouldn't want a FREE DPS increase?
    That's not what i said.

    I said that if you can't kill a boss 3-4 weeks before world first raiders did the problem is not "i'm alliance and they are horde", is that they play better than you, simple as that. Therefore "race changes are forced for pve" argument is stupid at best.

  6. #166
    High Overlord Puuhis's Avatar
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    Although I only raid very casually, it still frustrates me that I'm missing DPS simply because I want my character to be a gnome. I don't see ANY reason to not balance the racials that affect your dps, whether it's a passive 1% crit, haste, hit, double food buff, active damage/haste etc.
    edit: You don't have to be in a top guild to want to maximize your characters potential.
    Last edited by Puuhis; 2013-08-28 at 01:11 PM.

  7. #167
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    That's not what i said.

    I said that if you can't kill a boss 3-4 weeks before world first raiders did the problem is not "i'm alliance and they are horde", is that they play better than you, simple as that. Therefore "race changes are forced for pve" argument is stupid at best.
    People underestimate what world first guilds do. We did the first six bosses with the same or lower item level than Method, because we didn't do multiple altruns to funnel gear into our mains, even though our jikun kill happened two to three weeks after theirs. If you don't believe me go check wowprogress. I'd argue that having the racials helps more guilds than just the few competing for world first.
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  8. #168
    I've been playing Undead Mage since Febuary 2005 and never cried like a little bitch because life is so unfair, whether in PvP or PvE.

    Your fellow Troll outdps'ed you by a tiny margin? Life goes on. And you knew it would probably happen.
    The ennemy in PvE Zone-Silenced you or broke out of CC? Lifes goes on. And you knew it would probably happen.

    You're complaining about such tiny detail? Reroll. Pay. Quit. 20$ is roughly 3 beers in a pub.

    For the N amount of times you're complaining about the ennemy racial that outplayed you, there's a equal N amount of times you made an ennemy mad.

    Race to world first PvE = yes, it's significant to pay and change (I think). Anything else: another thing to cry on, so focus more on enjoying the game with your WoW buddies than finding excuses for your lack of achievement in PvE.
    Race to world best PvP = yes, it's significant to pay and change (I think). Anything else: enjoy a battleground with your friends and went, have fun, make great strategies, kamikaze ones, win or lose it doesn't matter if you know why and improve on it.

    My two cents.

  9. #169
    We should homogenize everything, racials, classes, NOTHING should be different or deviate from a specific set of numbers EVER.

  10. #170
    Horde were the underdogs in PvE long enough. Now their racials are a little bit better. No big deal.
    What are YOU talking about? When were the Horde ever underdogs of pve?

    I mean, granted, I have never once watched or kept up with "top tier raiding guilds" because I am not a giant tool, so perhaps there were/are more high-end top rated Alliance raiders, but back in Vanilla, Horde won pve hands down because of Blood Lust being the most powerful buff in the entire game.

  11. #171
    Scarab Lord Mokoshne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orion Antares View Post
    We should homogenize everything, racials, classes, NOTHING should be different or deviate from a specific set of numbers EVER.
    just have 1 class that can heal, dps and tank at the same time. no differentiation at all.
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  12. #172
    Quote Originally Posted by Tharkkun View Post
    The advantage those racials give can be made up in many other ways such as perfecting your rotation. I switched from BE to Troll for ToT and the only difference that was noticeable was the lack of my AOE silence.
    Now, switch back to troll after "perfecting your rotation" what do you get?

  13. #173
    So would you prefer, everyone gets the same thing, and make all Races, clones of one another, and be boring and dull? There all different species, of course, theres gonna be differences

  14. #174
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluorescent0 View Post
    People underestimate what world first guilds do. We did the first six bosses with the same or lower item level than Method, because we didn't do multiple altruns to funnel gear into our mains, even though our jikun kill happened two to three weeks after theirs. If you don't believe me go check wowprogress. I'd argue that having the racials helps more guilds than just the few competing for world first.
    I do not underestimate what they do, you fail to understand what "world first" means.

    If Paragon kills heroic garrosh on 13/9 (something not that far-fetched) and you kill him on late october-early november you are NOT a world first guild. Sure, you might be the best of your server but your biggest issue is player skill, and not racials.

    EDIT: Just checked out your guild, as you suggested.

    From H:Jin to H:Horridon Method took a grand total of 39 minutes. That includes clearing trash. You took 2 days.
    From H:horridon to H:council 4 hours for Method, almost 2 WEEKS for you.

    And the list goes on, ending with 6 days from animus to leishen for method and a full month for you.

    Sorry to burst your bubble, but that's not "racials", that's flawed playing (not much, as you did way better than most, but worse than the best)
    Last edited by Inthislzon; 2013-08-28 at 04:40 PM.

  15. #175
    http://www.wowprogress.com/simdps/

    Every single one of them is Troll on the First page. I didn't look how far back it goes.

    Also, Berserking = 20% Haste for 10 secs every 180 secs = 1.111111111111% Passive Haste = 36.43 Haste Rating That's a HUGE deal.

  16. #176
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    I do not underestimate what they do, you fail to understand what "world first" means.

    If Paragon kills heroic garrosh on 13/9 (something not that far-fetched) and you kill him on late october-early november you are NOT a world first guild. Sure, you might be the best of your server but your biggest issue is player skill, and not racials.
    Your reasoning is sound for the part regarding the caliber of the guild, it isn't however for the usefulness of racials.
    Haven't looked at PTR, but imagine a scenario where, say, the 4th boss is a huge DPS check on heroic. Whatever world first guild will have plenty of gear due to running multiple alt runs and funneling gear into their mains. When we get to that boss, we might have the same or less gear than they had at a time. If they barely beat the enrage timer, how is it supposed to be easier for us? Do remember that time takes a part in strategies being leaked, of course, but the gear advantage they have because of the multiple runs is being underestimated, because that's about the gear a guild doing one run gets in two/three full weeks of clearing.

    And if you're wondering, we didn't get Council on week one/two because we couldn't reliably get Sul down on time. The third week, we three shot council due to gear upgrades alone.
    Last edited by Fluorescent0; 2013-08-28 at 04:49 PM.
    Fluorescent - Fluo - currently retired, playing other stuff

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  17. #177
    Why are hordes racial stronger? i tell you why, because blizzard does not, give a damn about alliance, look at MoP. Look how everytime there is a now alliance town, they get the super geneic, Keep + tavern + habor look at Borean Tundra.
    (i am 20 and dyslexic so yes i suck at spelling)

  18. #178
    I personally love my Worgen's racial's from a PvE standpoint. But a 'perks' system in which you can pick two random abilities (from two tiers at to not be OP) would be nice (and locked from character creation onwards...hell Blizzard could even charge a fee to change them).

  19. #179
    Quote Originally Posted by Fluorescent0 View Post
    Your reasoning is sound for the part regarding the caliber of the guild, it isn't however for the usefulness of racials.
    Haven't looked at PTR, but imagine a scenario where, say, the 4th boss is a huge DPS check on heroic. Whatever world first guild will have plenty of gear due to running multiple alt runs and funneling gear into their mains. When we get to that boss, we might have the same or less gear than they had at a time. If they barely beat the enrage timer, how is it supposed to be easier for us? Do remember that time takes a part in strategies being leaked, of course, but the gear advantage they have because of the multiple runs is being underestimated, because that's about the gear a guild doing one run gets in two/three full weeks of clearing.
    Then the problem is not racials, but gear funneling. Another different story.

  20. #180
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    Then the problem is not racials, but gear funneling. Another different story.
    Not sure how you got to that. What I meant was: if world first guilds need racials, and they often do the early bosses with more gear than say, the top 50 guilds, why doesn't this last category need them?
    Fluorescent - Fluo - currently retired, playing other stuff

    i5-4670k @ 4.5 / Thermalright Silver Arrow Extreme / Gigabyte Z87X-D3H / 8GB DDR3-1600 RAM / Gigabyte GTX 760

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