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  1. #1

    LFR: "If you don't like it, don't do it"

    I keep seeing this excuse over and over as people try to defend this disastrous feature that should have never been implemented.

    Yes, you can obviously progress through normals and heroics without setting foot in LFR, but that doesn't change the fact (let me say that again...fact) that it is still in the best interest of many raiders to do LFR. As a result, this is what happens: new content becomes stale entirely too quickly, people get burnt out because they repeatedly consume said content too fast on faceroll mode, and they ultimately either unsub out of boredom for good or maybe until a new patch. I've seen it happen to all of my friends, and the same thing goes for me. If anyone truly believes LFR has had a more positive than negative impact on the game, they are 100% delusional. WoW was more successful in Vanilla - WotLK not because it was newer, but because there was no such thing as LFR.

    Then there's this one, "well, more support it than are against it." This is the most ignorant excuse of them all. Was there some survey conducted to get this information? If so, neither I nor anyone I know were asked for our opinions on the matter. So that's a rather bold and invalid claim to make without stating where the information is coming from. Maybe it should be more like this "well, more players on the forums support it than are against it." Which is obvious considering these players are the ones that provided the endless whining resulting in LFR in the first place, of course they are going to defend it to the death. I also find it ironic that these are mostly the same players who lead such busy and important lives that they can't possibly be bothered with a raiding guild, yet they somehow have hours on end to police the forums and flame any and every anti-LFR thread as soon as it comes to light.

    My question is this: how about the millions of loyal players lost due to this obnoxious catering to forum whiners and a "casual" play style? You really think the majority of these players supported LFR? nope. So instead of staying true to the actual mmo crowd, Blizzard shifted their focus by trying (and failing) to implement a one-size-fits-all band aid to cater to those that will be whining on forums no matter what, until they are practically mailed epics with the highest ilvl in the game. Well guess what, that doesn't work and subscription numbers show it. I can't speak for everyone but I know my guild and I didn't quit because the game is old. We quit because the overall experience of the game is no where near what it used to be. A game where the worst player imaginable can defeat all of the bosses while being afk and come back to possibly find epic rewards in their bags. If that kind of playstyle is anyone's idea of a fun, I feel embarrassed for them. Journey? gone. Incentive? gone. End of story. Kind of a pathetic way to end the life cycle of what was once such a magical and epic mmo.

    With flex raiding coming in 5.4, I can only hope that the devs and community get their heads out of the gutter and overhaul or abolish this poor excuse of a "raid" style. If not, then they deserve their failure.

  2. #2
    Pit Lord Packers01's Avatar
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    LFR: "If you don't like it, don't do it"

  3. #3
    Scarab Lord Moon Blade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alerzhul View Post
    Yes, you can obviously progress through normals and heroics without setting foot in LFR, but that doesn't change the fact (let me say that again...fact) that it is still in the best interest of many raiders to do LFR.
    No it's not. When I was doing hardmodes I never set foot in LFR for anything, didn't need to, never wanted to. I still don't cause I dislike it immensely. If your raid leader or GM is forcing you to do LFR because of a powertrip masked in delusional "necessity" I suggest you find a guild that isn't run by complete retards. LFR gear is pewp, the strategies don't apply to normal or hardmodes, valor is irrelevant and other than the legendary questline being completed faster, which isn't necessity, you don't have to ever do it. Enough with this ridiculous garbage posting.
    If it's not an elf, leave it on the shelf.
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  4. #4
    Herald of the Titans Abstieg's Avatar
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    Can people stop complaining about LFR? It works perfectly fine as it is. If you're a hardcore raider up to date on content, you have no reason to step into LFR.

  5. #5
    MixMaxGuilds: "If you don't like it, don't do it"

  6. #6
    It is the want a be hard core raiders that seem to bitch about LFR.

    Honestly though do we really have to have one more thread bitching about it.

    I like LFR I can do it at my leisure and don't have to schedule my life around a game.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Alerzhul View Post
    Yes, you can obviously progress through normals and heroics without setting foot in LFR, but that doesn't change the fact (let me say that again...fact) that it is still in the best interest of many raiders to do LFR.
    The problem with your post is you claim this all as fact. The fact is there is absolutely nothing in game that requires you to do LFR. You can skip LFR and never do it and still be alright. You can do LFR if you want to have a shot at more gear, but the fact is you still don't need to.

    So it goes right back to the point of "Don't like it, then don't do it" there is plenty of other content and means out there for you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Alerzhul View Post
    WoW was more successful in Vanilla - WotLK not because it was newer, but because there was no such thing as LFR.
    This, imo, is rather funny. LFR didn't exist in Cata till DS and guess what the first two raids weren't that popular either. Vanilla - WotLK being successful because of no LFR isn't a fact or anything. It's your opinion. There are many reasons why it peaked around that time. Even if we were to have Vanilla - WotLK at this very moment exactly like it was there is no way you can guarantee subs will go up. They'll probably stay the same and then we'll get some reason on why it's not successful now.

  8. #8
    Brewmaster Cherrypowdah's Avatar
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    Lfr actually fills its purpose as a gearing path for later returning players. you get to semi-see the fights and get some gear to help you get into normals, while it is arguable wether it is good to run the same difficulty multiple times, blizzard games usually tend to this niche at some point, trying to create more to do from something that you already have.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Abstieg View Post
    Can people stop complaining about LFR? It works perfectly fine as it is. If you're a hardcore raider up to date on content, you have no reason to step into LFR.
    Except that it doesn't work perfectly fine. It is part of gearing up for any type of raider and that should not be. At least not with the game's newest raid. LFR being a tier behind would be much more acceptable.

  10. #10
    Scarab Lord Moon Blade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alerzhul View Post
    Except that it doesn't work perfectly fine. It is part of gearing up for any type of raider and that should not be. At least not with the game's newest raid. LFR being a tier behind would be much more acceptable.
    No it's not, stop spewing rubbish.
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  11. #11
    Fluffy Kitten Callei's Avatar
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    If you feel forced into a portion of the game you find unenjoyable enough to come to the forums and rage about it, demanding it be changed to suit the needs of a hardcore minority when it's aimed at the other end of the spectrum, I would reassess either the expectations placed on you by your guild or yourself, or accept that the hardcore min-max playstyle involves doing things you don't like for the smallest theoretical edge in progression content.

    Awesome sig by Elyaan is awesome.

  12. #12
    The Unstoppable Force N-aix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alerzhul View Post
    Except that it doesn't work perfectly fine. It is part of gearing up for any type of raider and that should not be. At least not with the game's newest raid. LFR being a tier behind would be much more acceptable.
    Did you honestly make an account here JUST to do a LFR thread? -.- We've had enough of those already

  13. #13
    [QUOTE=Alerzhul;22311462]I keep seeing this excuse over and over as people try to defend this disastrous feature that should have never been implemented.

    Yes, you can obviously progress through normals and heroics without setting foot in LFR, but that doesn't change the fact (let me say that again...fact) that it is still in the best interest of many raiders to do LFR. As a result, this is what happens: new content becomes stale entirely too quickly, people get burnt out because they repeatedly consume said content too fast on faceroll mode, and they ultimately either unsub out of boredom for good or maybe until a new patch. [\QUOTE]

    Not this again. It is your choice to do LFR. If you are serious about raiding, you would do anything the game has to offer to maximise your chance to progress with gear acquisition. This is what happened with ICC. 10 and 25 had different lockouts. Progression focus guilds were running both everyweek to increase their chances of getting gear. Now, it is LFR instead separate lockouts. If Blizzard gave you a long boring daily to do but will reward you with gear for your effort, you will do it.

    So stop complaining about LFR. It has nothing to do with LFR. It is simply because you and your fellow raiders wants to have the best chance of getting gear to help your progression.

  14. #14
    Scarab Lord Rixis's Avatar
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    Isn't half the reason it's on a delayed release schedule so that it's not even needed by badass raiders for gear?

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucetia View Post
    You can skip LFR and never do it and still be alright.
    I can still be alright. Once again, OBVIOUSLY. But it is still in my best interest to do LFR if I want to raid normals and I am not caught up on gear. Fact. I state that as a fact because it is a fact. And this is the problem with it.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Rixis View Post
    Isn't half the reason it's on a delayed release schedule so that it's not even needed by badass raiders for gear?
    'badass' raiders will be needing to run flex. LFR is a bit low ilvl for that, so maybe its just to try spread it out. /shrug

  17. #17
    Listen, this might blow your mind a little bit but I'm going to let you in on a secret.

    Blizzard already caved into "hardcore" demands about LFR several times in a row. Overtuning them. Making them having "can't actually nerf this all the way" mechanics left in. Healer checks. Tank checks. Raid-wiping trash.

    That's not all, though. What else did they do? They made the Throne of Thunder LFR have a lower ilvl than the previous tier's heroic mode. That's pretty standard. Oh, but what's different you might be asking? (You should be.) They made the new Normal mode give gear over 20 ilvls higher and the heroic mode 33 ilvls higher than LFR. Do you know what that means? Anyone who ever stepped foot into heroics more than a couple weeks had outgeared LFR so much that even "gap filling" was pointlessly low.

  18. #18
    If you don't like it, don't do it. It's a game, not a job.

    If your guild attempts to force/guilt you into doing it, join a different guild because yours is abusing you.

  19. #19
    That argument gets used for many other things, beyond just LFR.

    Look at D3, when people talk about how terrible the AH is for the game some jackwagon will inevitably respond "Hey, just don't use it"

    The very existence of features within a game dramatically alter the gameplay for everyone, including people who choose not to use said features.

    1. The developers will design the game knowing those features exist and that people are using them.
    2. In a social game many other people will use those features, and that effects you.

    But despite this, people will continue to the same tired and disproven "hey just don't use it" argument.

  20. #20
    Scarab Lord Moon Blade's Avatar
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    Average normal raider should have ~530 ilvl from 522 gear, a few thunderforged pieces and valor upgrades. Average heroic raider should have ~540 ilvl from the same thing scaled to heroic gear. LFR t16 is 528, flex is 540. Normal raiders can run flex and normal SoO to get their ilvls up a bit, heroic raiders don't need to run any of it.

    If you think set bonuses and procs are going to mean the difference between success and failure on content when ilvls are roughly the same you are delusional. Gear isn't the issue at this point, it's the raiders.
    If it's not an elf, leave it on the shelf.
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