Thread: Prot pala 4 set

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  1. #1

    Prot pala 4 set

    I'm sure this question has been asked/answered b4 in another post but i have'nt come across it yet.
    I am currently 540 item level with normal tier healm & shoulders (hc ones just won't drop) and hc tier gloves and legs. I recently got the durumu haste legs and i am very tempted to use them (breaking my 4set though). It feels an upgrade to me but when i look around at other paly tanks in high end guilds they all seem to be using the 4 set. My question is should i keep my 4 set (currently progressing DA hc with a 14% wipe) or go with the legs? I feel very comfortable with my survival atm (fully haste gemmed btw) apart from towards the end of DA when i have the 2 massives on me and have died a few times.
    I also have the hc haste/crit twins boots sat in my bags atm, should i be using those instead of fully upgraded crafted ones?

  2. #2
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    Are you 10 or 25man? That makes quite a difference. 25man tanks tend to go for it, 10mans don't and will go for the Ret tier chest, Durumu legs, Primordius gloves, DA hat and Tortos shoulders for maximum haste.

    You can use the 4pc in 10man but you'll get so little effect out of it compared to 25s, that it's probably not worth the haste loss.

  3. #3
    I'm 10 man sry, but thx for clarifying what i was already thinking

  4. #4
    In 10 man you will get anywhere from 30 to 80 holy power(fight dependent) most of them are 30-45ish only a few will you get 80. Just depends how much haste you can get over the 4set. I know on my 543 pally I only gain 1k haste dropping 4 set atm but then again im at 19k haste with 4 set on. so i personally just keep it on


  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Jellospally View Post
    In 10 man you will get anywhere from 30 to 80 holy power(fight dependent) most of them are 30-45ish only a few will you get 80. Just depends how much haste you can get over the 4set. I know on my 543 pally I only gain 1k haste dropping 4 set atm but then again im at 19k haste with 4 set on. so i personally just keep it on
    You're my hero. I've only seen one other paladin use 4p for 10s, now I've seen two... and both of them back my claim that the 4p is worth it!



  6. #6
    Combined with DP and using divine prot at the right times I can get a lot of extra HP. Also I solo tank Council, Tortos, Meg, Jikun(kitting druid HoW tanks for like 15 sec while i get feather), Durumu, Animus, Qon, Twins so I get more use from 4 set on those than people who don't solo tank.


  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by promdate View Post
    You're my hero. I've only seen one other paladin use 4p for 10s, now I've seen two... and both of them back my claim that the 4p is worth it!
    I am fairly certain that the 4p is worth it in 10H aswell, especially if you are the "main" tank, think it is probably a bit more arguable in 10N, but for 10H I think it can be benefitial (though, undeniably it is even better in 25M).

    The reason I dont use it is that it does not fit my playstyle well. I am very passive with all my CDs, including DProt, so having a bonus that scales with using them frequently makes no sense for my myself, but see no issue with others using it.

    I am not gonna alter my playstyle after a set bonus that wont even be used in a few weeks when the new tier is out.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    I am very passive with all my CDs, including DProt, so having a bonus that scales with using them frequently makes no sense for my myself, but see no issue with others using it.

    I am not gonna alter my playstyle after a set bonus that wont even be used in a few weeks when the new tier is out.
    I too am quite passive with my cd's so i think i'm gonna give non 4 set a go.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    I am fairly certain that the 4p is worth it in 10H aswell, especially if you are the "main" tank, think it is probably a bit more arguable in 10N, but for 10H I think it can be benefitial (though, undeniably it is even better in 25M).
    Wat? You've preached against any tier items all of ToT!

    I am not gonna alter my playstyle after a set bonus that wont even be used in a few weeks when the new tier is out.
    While I can understand the bonus not fitting the playstyle, I just want to toss out there that 4t15 is mapping out to be ahead of using tier from SoO purely because of the insane value of the 4pc with the amount of damage in next tier. I don't think it'd be accurate to say that it won't be used. Especially when we can easily hit our haste, hit and exp caps while still wearing it.


    Personally, I'm still running with 2pc for 10H simply because:
    1) I've STILL not see ONE GODDAMN CONQ CHEST
    2) I'm not sure what the best setup for tier tokens going into t16 is going to be
    and 3) I'm lazy, we clear in 1 night, IDGAF about rankings/uptimes, and I CBA to swap all my gear around.

    As 5.4 draws closer, I'll probably finally cash in my tokens from the bank and get my 4 (hopefully 5!) pieces of tier15 to play with in t16.
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
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    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Nairobi View Post
    Wat? You've preached against any tier items all of ToT!
    Well, both yes and no. I preached against it from my perspective with how I use my cooldowns, so I guess I have been very biased. If I look objectively at it, I can see how it can be great for some people, but just does not fit well for me.

    I also still do not believe that it is worth picking it up over anyone else, I think you should pass tier to anyone else first, this is one of the main reason I have preached against it as I believe it is more benefit to give tiers to others, and if you are in a 10 man, getting 4p last in the raid group, well, yeah, that is gonna take time. If you actually manage to get your hands on it, great.

    Like you said, you still need the conq chest, after how many weeks?
    That is one reason I feel like it is wrong to really preach hard for 4p in 10 man, as getting it is rather hard unless you screw your raid over and grab them over more needing people.

    To add on that I think that it is still not great in most 10N fights, it is first in the 10H fights that it becomes very useful. Still, would use it on a fight by fight basis, i.e. would not use it on jin'rokh for example in 10 man, unless solo tanking.

    I dont think the T15 4p will be that awesome in T16 as the T16 4p is not that bad either coupled with DP. I know you say you dont like to use WoG rotationally, but the T15 4p kinda forces you to use DP rotationally, I rather use WoG than DP rotationally.
    Last edited by Firefly33; 2013-08-07 at 12:50 PM.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  11. #11
    Right, I wouldn't take the tier away from a DPS (or healer) who needed it, but it's certainly worth a coin roll opportunity. Esp when you look at bosses like Animus (helm), JiKun (feather), and IQ (weapon or gloves) that drop tier AND a nice item anyway. Granted, even this late in the tier with like 15+ HC DA kills, our raid has STILL never seen one HC Conq chest, and only had once successful coin roll (last week!) for its 3-5 conq users...so sometimes it's just not in the cards

    Not to derail too much, but it is quite easy to cheese the 4pc in pretty much any fight, if you know where to look.

    JinRohk, for example, you can pop in the storm phase and stand in bolts/balls. His hitbox is large enough that you can even run around "collecting" them and smacking him with ShotRs still. Or, you can leave DP unglyphed and just use it during the times you're tanking; sure it doesn't really add any mitigation from the spell, but you'd get easily 3-5 HoPo per cast, even in 10H.

    Is it ideal? Nah, not really. But (as stated before) I'm pretty lazy WRT carrying extra sets of gear for the same spec and/or swapping+reforging between bosses.
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    I am very passive with all my CDs, including DProt.
    I can see being passive about GoAK or AD... but Divine Protection? That shit has a sub 40s cooldown, 30 flat next patch.



  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by promdate View Post
    I can see being passive about GoAK or AD... but Divine Protection? That shit has a sub 40s cooldown, 30 flat next patch.
    Dunno really, just how I play. I dont use defensive cds unless needed, something feels wrong about using them for throughput.

    If I died from something that could have been saved by a divine protection because I used it 20 seconds earlier to get a few holy power I would shoot myself.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Firefly33 View Post
    Dunno really, just how I play. I dont use defensive cds unless needed, something feels wrong about using them for throughput.

    If I died from something that could have been saved by a divine protection because I used it 20 seconds earlier to get a few holy power I would shoot myself.
    But, how could that logistically happen? Dying to something because you didn't have DivProt, I mean. There are 2 options:
    1) You have a big, telegraphed nuke coming in 20 sec, so you hold off on DivProt to use it for/around that
    2) You use DivProt blindly on CD to try and max HoPo, ergo ShotR uptime, regardless of damage profile.

    #1 is like timing/delaying ShotR, #2 is like macro'ing it to CS. I don't think anyone is lobbying for #2. #1 is something you should already be doing, given that DivProt is off GCD and essentially free damage redux. The only way you could die, esp in 10m (self-admittedly) is poor play/timing, right? So I just don't see how that situation would ever occur....unless you're doing #2.

    As PD said - holding GoAK and AD, sure...DivProt is more of a "use it or lose it" button already, so 4p is just icing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  15. #15
    You dont like using WoG rotationally, I dont like using DP rotationally Some things cant be explained logically.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Jellospally View Post
    In 10 man you will get anywhere from 30 to 80 holy power(fight dependent) most of them are 30-45ish only a few will you get 80. Just depends how much haste you can get over the 4set. I know on my 543 pally I only gain 1k haste dropping 4 set atm but then again im at 19k haste with 4 set on. so i personally just keep it on
    That's a pretty bold claim that you're at 19k with 4pc, considering Slootbag is at like 17,2xx in 4pc >_>

    Sitting on 450iLvl myself and I'm at 18,918 not using any prot tier. That's being nearly a 2k difference, and considering his base iLvl is much higher, giving him more haste elsewhere. Hmm I'm sure if I dropped for 4pc, I'd loose a good 3k haste, which would be coming out to about 7% haste. Essentially 7% less HoPo. From a damage standpoint as well, sure it's nice to get the extra SotRs out from the DP procs, but how much would you loose out on missing those extra hits of CS, Judge and GC procs (lololol changing soon anyway).

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Maleia View Post
    GC procs (lololol changing soon anyway).
    You still get shorter GCD with haste which means that GC procs still scales great with haste. I would dare say that GC scales better with haste now than before considering how many fights you can get more than 1 target on you.

    Also, 19k with 4p is not unimaginable, I am sitting on almost 20k haste and I got lower item level than him, 19k with 4p seems quite reasonable to be honest.

    Not counting the 4p, sloot got 5 items without haste natively on them, 6 if you count the trinket. That is the reason his haste is so "low" at his gear level.
    Volun-told - A supposedly optional event, award, assignment, or activity in which a person (or persons) are required to attend either by persons-in-charge nominating them or their peers expecting them to be there. The individual often has no say in the matter, and non-attendance in frowned upon.

    I am so tired of seeing terrible people, being admired, for being terrible people.

  18. #18
    Jellos is just shy of 18k with 4pc on, according to his armory, and that's at 544 ilvl.

    Not sure why Sloot is only at 17k+, since he is at 550 using most of the same (or better) gear. A few haste/stam gems instead of straight haste, and Jellos has HTF Durumu Haste bracers (lucky SOB!).
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    We'll all be appropriately shocked/amazed when Nairobi actually gets an avatar, but until then, let's try to not derail the thread heckling him about it.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    If it was that easy don't you think we would have figured that out? (Source)
    20k and counting...

  19. #19
    I use haste elixirs so its 18800 (stam flask is worthless in 10 man outside solo tanking meg)

    Gg coining them bracers!

    My pallys guild should be pushing animus/leishen in the next week or 2 so i can probably push 19500 haste if i get the right drops with elixirs and 4 set

    also just raped Jikun last night 325k dps lollol prot deeps
    Last edited by Jellospally; 2013-08-07 at 03:01 PM.


  20. #20
    Over a 7m fight, you will have 135.1 cs and 101.15 judges. Sloot will have 132.86 cs and 99.75 judges, a difference of 2.24 cs and 1.4 judgement.

    Using a Durumu kill log from last week, I did average of 193,170.6 for SotR, 186,578.3 for J and 55,823.4 for CS. 2.24 cs + 1.4 J = 386,254.036. I gained 38 hopo from the 4p, which gave me an additional 12.66~ SotR. 12 additional sotr is 36 seconds of uptime, and another 2.3m damage. That's almost 6x the amount of damage gained from the 4p. Sure I didn't add in the difference in melee swings or the amount of SoI procs, but do you think it will cover that gap?

    You can argue that the GC procs would go down because of the 2% haste difference. While true it won't make a difference next patch.



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