Page 3 of 69 FirstFirst
1
2
3
4
5
13
53
... LastLast
  1. #41
    The Lightbringer
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Silvermoon City
    Posts
    3,631
    Quote Originally Posted by mmowin View Post
    My question is how exactly did the casual "ruin" WoW?
    They didn't. Some people are just upset about the fact that the casual players can now have access to the same content (albeit on a different difficulty level) than the hardcore players. They want to keep a "feudal" model where 90%+ of peasants feed subscription money to finance development of raids that less than 10% of "nobles" will see.

    BC/LK raider ('07-'10)

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Lightwysh View Post
    Hardcores destroyed wow with their pre-cata crying.

    Three significant things caused mass uproar in the true majority of players.

    1. The clusterfuck that was the early cata heroics. After wow's peak in wotlk with easy mode heroics the absurd jump to the cata difficulty pit a lot of people off.

    2. The changes to healing, though needed drove off a lot of people who loved that aspect of the game.

    3. The gating of vp gear in MoP, I personally know quite a few people who quit or refused to resub due this.

    Extra credit answer: the game is aging, the player base is aging, there are not a lot of new young players buying and sticking with wow.
    This is VERY accurate. I also have to point out that 95% of the people who think casuals ruined the game aren't even hardcore players. Raid heroic modes (which is ONLY for hardcore players) and let me know just how dumbed down things are. Just because we don't have to waste our time flying to dungeons or can gear up mains and alts quicker running LFR doesn't mean its dumbed down. It means that casual can do things and somehow that pisses off hard core players. It also begs the question of what is a "casual" player. I play daily, have 3 90s and raid in a 25 man 7/13 heroic guild. Am I a casual?

  3. #43
    Here's the problem.

    There is a very easy to define limit to how hard any element of the game should be made. There is none when it comes to how easy it should be made, and most forum requests reflect that. As the game gets made easier, folks continually want MORE of the same exact sort of thing to happen, and you wind up in a pattern of constantly attempting to placate a playerbase who is never content with how much more convenient the game became.
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion

  4. #44
    Legendary! muto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Inside a Bubble
    Posts
    6,033
    So how was WoW ruined to begin with?, because last I checked, it still has more subscribers than any other mmorpg.

    I don't get it either.

    1. Many people assume WoW has been ruined, which it hasn't been; you can find this out just by looking at how many subscribers it has
    2. Many people assume "casual" means "baddie", which it does not. A "casual" is someone that plays the game casually.

  5. #45
    The only thing "destroying" WoW is time.

    As time goes on:
    -There is less and less to add to the game.
    -The experience is less "fresh" and more "stale" for everyone playing it
    -The engine and graphics fall farther and farther behind their potential
    -There's less lore that hasn't already been added to the game causing more "out of their ass" lore to be added to the game
    -Players who've been playing for a long time have higher and higher standards about how good everyone should be which leads to:
    -New players fall farther behind growing more and more intimidated to even interact with anyone else for fear of being trashed for being a "noob"
    -Aging player base (WoW isn't as exciting for someone 14 years old today as it was 9 years ago for reasons already listed and more). As player base ages a growing percentage of the players get full time jobs, families, or just grow out of gaming.

    Time is the reason WoW's subs are declining, above and beyond anything else and there is absolutely nothing Blizz can do to stop it. They can slow it down a little maybe if they make the right decisions, but nothing will change the fact that this game is old and we've already done the Illidan and Arthas storylines that were so popular back in the day.

  6. #46
    Bottom line: No one plays WoW forever, and the number of people in the world who will ever want to play WoW is not infinite.

  7. #47
    Mechagnome
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Paradise
    Posts
    640
    Did casuals ruin WoW and if so how?
    WoW is NOT in ruins yet. The player base and Blizzard would not be a fault, if something did happen. It would take a real life apocalyptic event to stop the designing, developing and playing of WoW. What I'm trying to get at is time is changing. That is the real problem with what's going on. WoW is dated, but not dead yet.

  8. #48
    This entire argument is such bs everytime I read it. Back in vanilla and bc I only raided 2 nights a week and we had no trouble clearing anything - so by definition I was a casual raider but because our guild cleared most content quite fast people labelled us "hardcore". Casuals had nothing to do with ruining WoW - not that it's ruined ;/

    Like many have said the only thing destroying WoW right now is time and the way Blizzard works - which is very slow.
    Last edited by Frakchaw; 2013-09-04 at 07:20 AM.

  9. #49
    Brewmaster Ceethemage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Texarkana, Texas
    Posts
    1,327
    Casual's didn't kill WoW what killed WoW was their own choice in turning the game and focusing more on the casuals and not the raids/pvp

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Ceethemage View Post
    Casual's didn't kill WoW what killed WoW was their own choice in turning the game and focusing more on the casuals and not the raids/pvp
    how is wow dead? a 9 year old game that still has over 7 million subs is just fucking ridiculous. its time killing wow not the game itself.

  11. #51
    Why do people think players ruined the game, Blizzard are the only ones directly capable of ruining it.

  12. #52
    Well first of all casuals have been around since the beginning of the game. No it's not their fault the game is at the lowest point it's been since the Burning Crusade. You'll never get Activision to admit they are at fault but as a customer you are left to the obvious facts (quarterly reports) that it is. The simple truth is it's Activision's fault that the game is declining because they've changed Blizzard's development plan to match Activision's marketing plan. Make the game easier, sell to a wider customer base. While that's a nice influx of revenue for the first year, it's not good for the long term (keeping players longer than the standard 3 months). It doesn't encourage customers to return either, because they either beat the game or moved on to a more in-depth game.

    This plan may have been a good idea at the time (cataclysm) but it's obviously failing to keep it going now, because threads like this keep popping up every day on the official forums (more than the usual) and the stockholder quarterly reports support the complaints. If Blizzard changes their development plan to increase the game's difficulty (not just in raids) and keep their marketing plan the same as it is now then yes the game will recover slowly. This is a proven fact as supported by the quarterly reports from Wotlk. When Blizzard changed their plan to make the game easier in Cataclysm moving into MoP you can see the game's subscribers falling a million or more every quarter up to now. We're now at 7.7 million subscribers. Wotlk after 1 year was at 12 million subscribers .......................................................................................... .......................................... Ima just stop before I get all Bill O'Reilly up in this thread ok.

    TLDR: If you make the game so easy it's a single player game, it will be treated like a single player game. Played, beaten, dropped.

  13. #53
    The Lightbringer bergmann620's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Stow, Ohio
    Posts
    3,569
    qq'ers come closer to ruining WoW than anything else.
    Life: bergmannity.com/ | Gaming: indignantgoat.com/
    XBL: Indignant Goat | BattleTag: IndiGoat#1288 | SteamID: Indignant Goat

  14. #54
    The Lightbringer
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Silvermoon City
    Posts
    3,631
    Quote Originally Posted by Superchief View Post
    It doesn't encourage customers to return either, because they either beat the game or moved on to a more in-depth game.
    Yeah, in-depth games like DOTA or LOL. Oh wait...

    Quote Originally Posted by Superchief View Post
    This plan may have been a good idea at the time (cataclysm) but it's obviously failing to keep it going now
    That's because they made the beginning of Cataclysm too steep, not too easy. Surprise, when you make a game too hard after LK, people quit! Who could have guessed that? O_o

    Quote Originally Posted by Superchief View Post
    When Blizzard changed their plan to make the game easier in Cataclysm moving into MoP you can see the game's subscribers falling a million or more every quarter up to now
    Aaaand... wrong again. Early MOP was too time-consuming for a casual player to handle. Hence, it is not surprising that casual players were not interested in it, according to Blizzard itself.

    The above illustrate your absolute lack of knowledge of the VG sector, congratulations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Superchief View Post
    TLDR: If you make the game so easy it's a single player game, it will be treated like a single player game. Played, beaten, dropped.
    And if you make a game too time-consuming for an average player with a job, a family etc... he will maybe level a toon, play around, and quit.
    And if you don't have a massive inflow of new players to keep up (like in BC and Vanilla), you're screwed. MMO market is saturated, you can no longer afford churn.

    BC/LK raider ('07-'10)

  15. #55
    Goldilocks, playing WoW:

    'this content's too hard'
    'this content is too time consuming!'
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion

  16. #56
    Yes. They cried that they can't put some effort and raid in 25 man setup, but want to be hardcore no matter what. So Blizzard decided to bring 10 man on the same table as 25 man. This marked the end of hardcore fun raiding, where bringing people together actually mattered something. Now, those casuals can raid just fine, but they are still leaving, so Blizzard have to add some stupid elements to the game, which entertains casuals for short time interval and becomes boring again, so they leave again. This is actually a closed circle: you can't feed casuals, because they can't master even single aspect of the game and rush to the next. They play a bit and become bored.

    "That is in their nature" (c)
    Last edited by Ethas; 2013-09-03 at 08:50 PM.
    The Mists of Pandaria coming on September 25

  17. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel Tyrael View Post
    If something takes more time, it is by definition, harder.

    Also, I take it you never actually tried 4 horsemen back in Vanilla, or KT, or M'uru, etc etc.
    Taking more time does not automatically make something harder. There is a very big difference between something taking a long time because it is hard and something taking a long time that is easy but tedious.

  18. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Ceethemage View Post
    Casual's didn't kill WoW what killed WoW was their own choice in turning the game and focusing more on the casuals and not the raids/pvp
    ToT and SoO would disagree with you
    Quote Originally Posted by lakers01 View Post
    Those damn liberal colleges! Can you believe they brainwash people into thinking murder is wrong! And don't get me started with all that critical thinking bullshit!
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells
    You don't get to troll, lie, and treat government like a game for your own purposes and then expect to be treated like a statesmen. Fuck that.

  19. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Siaer View Post
    Taking more time does not automatically make something harder. There is a very big difference between something taking a long time because it is hard and something taking a long time that is easy but tedious.
    Not really, there isn't. Time spent can certainly be an element of difficulty.
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion

  20. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel Tyrael View Post
    If something takes more time, it is by definition, harder.
    No...it is by definition longer. Not necessarily harder.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elrandir View Post
    My starfall brings all the mobs to the yard.
    Laurellen - Druid Laurellin - Deathknight

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •