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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by madrox View Post
    Getting the most value from your time while farming is the hard part.
    Pfft... 99% players check it out from some website (like MMOC) which farming gives the best value for time spent, and the other 1% can figure it out for themselves. Googling "fastest wow valor" or something like that is not exactly hard, or time consuming, just pointless housekeeping which is being pruned out from the game.
    Never going to log into this garbage forum again as long as calling obvious troll obvious troll is the easiest way to get banned.
    Trolling should be.

  2. #102
    Immortal Sigma's Avatar
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    Yes Casual's ruined wow, and I will tell you how.
    Our being in the game has caused the elitist jerks to scream and shout and cry so much about everything that we casuals enjoy, that it spoils the enjoyment of the game of everyone else. so you could say that we have ruined it by proxy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Acelius View Post
    Sigma : Super Intelligent Giant Moldy Anchovy

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by vesseblah View Post
    Pfft... 99% players check it out from some website (like MMOC) which farming gives the best value for time spent, and the other 1% can figure it out for themselves. Googling "fastest wow valor" or something like that is not exactly hard, or time consuming, just pointless housekeeping which is being pruned out from the game.
    Now? Yes, that's the case, hence my use of the word "linger" when speaking of this effect on modern WoW. But the original comment was speaking of the older WoW where time management was more prevalent. It just stands to reason; something which takes X amount of time asks more of people than something equivalent which takes X-Y time to achieve and thus, in relation in it's own terms, is harder.

  4. #104
    Legendary! Anarch Son of Gods's Avatar
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    Casuals don't have the 'power' to ruin the game.

    People who are of the opinion that casuals ruined the game need to accept the fact instead that it was completely only Blizzard's choice to try and appeal to as broad of an audience as possible. Blizzard could've easily just said: "No, we want -this- and -that- to be the design philosophy of our game and if that isn't appealing to a big part of the potential customers then that is fine and they can play other games."

    Has Blizzard catered to casuals? Yes and no. They did in my opinion half-assed attempts at trying to give casual gamers the experience they might be looking for, but they're still pretty far off the mark of offering a game that can engage casual players. At the same time they also half-assedly alienated the hardcore playerbase. It seems to be one of those trying to please everyone, but really pleasing nobody adequately kinda things.
    ♦ "It is easy to take insolence from those who are below you." ♦

  5. #105
    IMO the game turn a lot worse after the homogenization and unified 10/25 man lockouts.

    Well, this video say most of what needs to be said:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFWh9aY4pas&noredirect=1

    I used to not care about LFR, but nowadays I think it is a bad thing. A lot of people simply get to max level, gear until they are ready for LFR, kill the final boss and thing that is it about the game. There isn't really enough reward difference from LFR and Normal or Heroic for a new player.

    Also, what is the purpose of it? Seeing the last boss? Most people see it on youtube few days after the world first. Teaching people to play? If that's the reason, well, they need to improve a lot, there is no teaching of mechanics, no grade on how well you went, no tips in the end for you to improve your dps or reduce your overheal.

    For me LFR ended up a little like the communism production problem, a lot of player doesn't care about their dps, positioning, overheal, mana management, simply because they don't need to. Also, they have lost incentive to actually raid.

  6. #106
    This is a silly question. Casuals couldn't have possibly ruined WoW. Only blizzard has the power to do that.


    Edit: All the things that made vanilla fun ARE the things that made vanilla suck. Everytime I thought about the game back then I wondered... Everything sucked. Why was it that it was so much fun. Now I realize it was the fact we were stuck dealing with poor design that it was so much fun. If they took away dungeon finder, they took away flying, made travel obnoxious again then the game would be awful. Now that we have this kind of stuff we can't go back and have fun the way it was. I really believe that. But the ways we tried to circumvent these things, the baddies we carried through dungeons, the memories we made when the community was stronger was what made vanilla fun.

    Now that those times are gone we just need to move forward. And blizzard needs to find a way to make the game fun without relying on poor design. Their inability to keep us around and having fun is what's ruining the game. Dailies were never fun. Not in TBC and not now. The only difference was that TBC they were new and somewhat interesting. Scenarios could have been fun if you were rewarded for doing it and it didn't feel like faceroll busy work. Ukrainian Jobs are more involved and immersive then scenarios. I've never thought to myself "Wow thrall must REALLY hate this Garrosh guy", I thought "Okay there's a 1/30 chance of getting a blue that will replace my bracers" the day I hit 90. When I finally got those bracers my heart didn't flutter like the time I stole Fel Striker from a rogue. The magic was just gone.
    Last edited by Xenryusho; 2013-09-03 at 11:04 PM.
    Brooding.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by xXzCoDProxXz View Post
    No the elitists ruined WoW with their demands..
    Nothing was hard just time-consuming. Lots of free time=you can have and IQ of 10 and still clear any content you want. BLizz like any other business saw the time constraint so they had to lower the difficulty along with the length of raids/took prebuffing out of the picture(like resistance buffing yourself, fire prot potions so forth) and introduced easier mechanics
    So the elitists ruined wow with their demands, yet you've only stated things Blizzard has done for the casuals.... GG logic.

  8. #108
    Mechagnome Sarthan's Avatar
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    LFR and LFD killed the community and in turn killed this game. Sure you get a group faster but you no longer have to uphold a name on your server and that is what truly killed this game.

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Xenryusho View Post
    This is a silly question. Casuals couldn't have possibly ruined WoW. Only blizzard has the power to do that.
    Agreed. Blizzard destroyed it's baby for the sake of casuals.

  10. #110
    Immortal KrazyK923's Avatar
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    Surely this topic is unique and will enlighten us all.
    Men, you've trained for this. You're among the elite. You are Skyfire men! This is the ship that took down Deathwing. You think some raggedy little Horde outpost stands a chance against the pride of the Alliance fleet? NO! Those green dirtbags down there plagued your homes in Southshore, laid siege to your children in Redridge, and massacred every man, woman and child in Theramore. It. Is. PAYBACK TIME!
    Sky Admiral Rogers for High Queen. Remember Theramore!

  11. #111
    Scarab Lord
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    No specific type of player ruined WoW. Blizzard just fucked it up somehow.
    Something, Something, Something, Dark Side.

  12. #112
    Elemental Lord Arbs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iseeyou View Post
    Blizzard did ruin wow , not the players nor the community.
    Blizzard only listen to players that whined & the decline started after Cata H Dungeons were nerfed.

  13. #113
    I laugh at the people who call casuals "entitled" because of content they want/pay to see, and yet somehow they're not blaming themselves for wanting to be "entitled" to exclusive content they pay for due to their own personal sacrifices they made IRL in favor of playing a game.
    "Tell them only that the Lich King is dead... and that World of Warcraft... died with him..."

    Quote Originally Posted by BenBos View Post
    That's the ONLY reason you would post 9600 posts over 3 years: a mission of hate.

  14. #114
    Scarab Lord
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arbsbear View Post
    Blizzard only listen to players that whined & the decline started after Cata H Dungeons were nerfed.
    I'd argue the "decline" started with the release of TotC and subsequent year of ICC personally.

    Even if Cata HC's stayed hard it still would have been an utter failure of an expansion at max level

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Archangel Tyrael View Post
    If something takes more time, it is by definition, harder.
    No, it's not. Carrying 20 bottles at once is harder than carrying 5 bottles 4 times. There is no direct relation between difficulty and time investment.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    I'd argue the "decline" started with the release of TotC and subsequent year of ICC personally.
    Isn't that when Ghostcrawler started at Blizzard?

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by madrox View Post
    Now? Yes, that's the case, hence my use of the word "linger" when speaking of this effect on modern WoW. But the original comment was speaking of the older WoW where time management was more prevalent. It just stands to reason; something which takes X amount of time asks more of people than something equivalent which takes X-Y time to achieve and thus, in relation in it's own terms, is harder.
    No offense, but there's a reason nobody is agreeing with you. Time required and difficulty aren't the same thing. If my objective requires me to log in and one shot a critter mob once a day a hundred times, it isn't hard to do. It simply takes a long time.

  18. #118
    Bloodsail Admiral Tsundere Pejo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wych View Post
    I'd argue the "decline" started with the release of TotC and subsequent year of ICC personally.
    I'd argue that WoW has always been losing players so the decline has always been there. By the peak of WoW Subscribers (in WOTLK), over 25 million players had played WoW so it had < 50% retention rate. So that means that WoW had previously lost 4 million players a year, but luckily over that time, it was also bringing people in. It was also stated then, years ago, that Blizzard thought the majority of people who was going to play WoW had already played it at one time. So even before the subs started dropping, Blizzard had stated that less people were coming in. AND OMG, it did exactly what they stated? This is amazing and should be in the headlines!@!!

    There are some decisions that Blizzard made that improved the game drastically and definitely some that are controversial. The game changes and it has changed a lot over the last 9 years; however, there is one thing that never changed - this game was targeted towards Casuals. Everything about this game has been casual and it has just evolved over the years.

    TLDR: No one seems to remember that they've lost over 50% of their players, even at their peak. A 9 year old game doesn't have the same draw as it did at 1-5 years old, especially in this market?? MINDBLOWN!

  19. #119
    IMO casuals didn't ruin WoW. I would point that at Blizzard's constant change of direction especially during Cata where the 'end game' got turned 180 degrees and almost back 180 degrees in just a few patches

  20. #120
    Blademaster IAmBizMarkie's Avatar
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    Money is the motivator. He who has more money has more claim. Blizzard opted to take the more financially beneficial route. I prefer the more difficult time of WoW and having to run to dungeons etc, but I don't fault Blizzard for the route they chose.

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