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  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
    2% roll out of 100% is still going to be a 2% roll out of 100% regardless of how many chars or coin rolls you use
    your maths is wrong.

    Using your 2% drop rate and no coin rolls:

    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 1 toon per week = 2%

    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 2 toons per week = 3.96%

    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 3 toons per week = 5.88%

  2. #22
    I see no real point to the BMAH other than to promote gold selling.
    My point exactly. I see people constantly saying that BMAH is the same RNG as farming that said mount or item... they could not be more wrong. And the most annoying part is, people who actualy got it from the boss (there saying that the mount dropped from that boss in the FoS) get the same FoS as one bought from the BMAH... its just... sad.

    But, again, the threat have derailed, its not a BMAH QQ , i talked about it to prove point out one particular point.

    The bottom line is, the drop chance is too low, and yes, even with a 1% or 2% drop chance i might not get it, but the chances of at least seeing it and wanting it even more increase.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Vilnar View Post
    That's REALLY unlucky Sarithus... Trust me, i fell you're pain. I have saw the Main-hand glaive drop 3 times so far, and not a single off hand have dropped...

    But, not to diminish you're pain in that mather, its a "statistical group "situation. You see a LOT of Thunderfury's and Warglaives, even when people still struglle to get their. You see them, even with the low drop chance they have (yes, 3-4% drop chance for somthing you can only do once per week is low, but acceptable). Another different thing is something that you can do one a week in every single char you have (because they are account bound), and still, if you see a player in one, its like a mirage, and most people don+t even know where they drop from. It's like seeing a Atiesh, or something equaly inacessible.
    Well, people had had close to 8 years to get THunderfury, and the Glaives have been out for more than 5. That's a lot of times and runs for people to do for them. It's more than the mounts because not everyone does those bosses anymore, not to mention they haven't even been out for a year yet. Thunderfury and the Warglaives were pretty much nonexistent at this point in their lifetime as well.

    Give it time. You'll see more.

  4. #24
    Legendary! Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilnar View Post
    The bottom line is, the drop chance is too low, and yes, even with a 1% or 2% drop chance i might not get it, but the chances of at least seeing it and wanting it even more increase.
    What did you expect? The droprate is so low because people can go in with however many chars they have.
    Since the mount is account wide and not character specific, Blizzard had no choice or you would see them on every person.

    You can't compare it with a normal/HC raid boss where people have 1, maybe 2 chars equipped enough to do them.

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  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by sleepy67 View Post
    your maths is wrong.

    Using your 2% drop rate and no coin rolls:

    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 1 toon per week = 2%

    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 2 toons per week = 3.96%

    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 3 toons per week = 5.88%
    No, he's still right. Just because you have 3 toons and I have one (just an example), doesn't mean you have almost 4% higher chance to get the mount than I do. All of your toons have the same chance to get the mount, you just have more chances than I do (I.E. I have 1 2% chance, you have 3. Your % chance doesn't go up because you have more rolls).

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by sleepy67 View Post
    your maths is wrong.
    Using your 2% drop rate and no coin rolls:
    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 1 toon per week = 2%
    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 2 toons per week = 3.96%
    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 3 toons per week = 5.88%
    Lol no, its just mathematic theory, which doesn't even near describe how rng works.
    You can farm the bosses you need with 11 chars every week, but it is still 2% chance for you to drop the mount. By increasing the number of characters involved you add rolls per week, but they don't increase every 2% chance you have per roll. It is still 2% per roll.
    What is the worst thing is that all that stuff like being farming with 11 chars easily can be meaningless, since it's fucking rng. You can kill a boss ten million times and still not get your drop, while some Donald herpyderpy dude always gets rare drops from first kill. RNG sucks.

  7. #27
    I farmed all the Dungeons Mount bosses and all Raid Bosses combined thousands of times, with the Result of aquiring some Mounts and some not. That is the RNG we have to deal with. We 5Man Elegon on multiple chars each week currently and it might drop this week or never ever, for Example. I get that some people like this RNG and some don't, but whoever dislikes that does not have to deal with it at all.
    You don't have to kill Galleon for a 0.5% or so chance on the Mount if you dont like, you can do Brawler's Guild ranks as an alternative, or you can get the Mushan Mount(s) from Timeless Isle in next Patch.

    You don't have to farm Sha, Nalak or the 3rd WorldBoss for a Cloud Serpent, there are three other Factions with Cloud serpents, a Timeless Isle one, and even a Gladiator's Cloud Serpent for good PvP players that does not even require Cloud Serpent Riding. There are really few Mounts, that have a rare drop chance and no Alternative Reskinned Model to aquire elsewhere. The only one I can think of is Mimiron's Head.

    On the Topic of BM AH, I think it was necessary to create a Gold Dump for rich players. They are very engaged and have little to spend it on elsewise. There are TCG Lootcards now (and I still search for someone to sell me an Ogre Idol for a Million) but TCG is no longer produced so there is nothing to spend high Amounts of Gold on other than become crazy and heavily disrupt the Economy (which I am not too far from doing).

    However, in my Opinion there should be no PvP Gear on the BM AH at the start of a saason because PvP should be about which player plays better not which player has better gear, or more Gold.
    Capitalism, Ho!

  8. #28
    Well the problem I see with this kind of loot system is that you can only get 1 item(2 with coin) and tier/pvp is always higher chance so you are fighting not only with the 0,1% chance of the mount but with the chance of not obtaining any other item at the same time.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by det View Post
    Well - does every avid collector of whatever he or she collects ever get everything they covet? Something stays elusive. Otherwise you stop being a collector.
    Imagine how boring the Indiana Jones movies would be, if he'd found everything midway through the first movie?

    I really only farm the battle pets. A friends friend claims to "just go get one, if i need money" when it came to the Captured Firefly pet, while just about every toon I have has sat out there for hours to farm it for ex when of appropriate level. Since it's not always about the grind but just the having, I just bought it off the AH for 1500g and was done with it (but every future toon will still farm those stupid asshole mobs for a couple hours).

    I do understand your pain. My #1 annoyance is the Ansu mount. I got it on my DK when I meh, let me run H Sket real quick. Mount drop, i learned it and never mounted it. Not once. I feel it is a travesty that other classes and get the drop and use it. I go so far as to not heal someone that I see riding it. Why did I go in there on my DK? I really can't tell you. I'd run that place countless times on my Druid with no luck. Not that my druid would use it (travel form always, always, always) but... it's the principle of the thing.

    10 full clears of TK/SCC/Kara for battle pets, what did I get? Phoenix twice, Void Caller once, Tainted Core 9 times... the end. I don't feel bad having spent 7K for the rest of the pets for the achievement, since I feel like I've earned them. Or "earned" more than 3. Buying them for 5-600 each for most of them seems fair enough, but like you say OP, it sort of takes the edge out of farming them out of the equation. But again, a very small amount of battle pets are recage/tradeable and contrary to popular belief, they are not always the "best" pets.

  10. #30
    Immortal Sigma's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sleepy67 View Post
    your maths is wrong.
    Using your 2% drop rate and no coin rolls:
    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 1 toon per week = 2%
    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 2 toons per week = 3.96%
    Chance of you getting the mount doing the boss on 3 toons per week = 5.88%
    using this example, with enough characters I could guarantee that I would get the mount in a single week of rolls. That just does not happen.

    It doesnt matter how many characters you have, a 2% chance to drop is still a 2% chance chance to drop, regardless of how many chars you use. it does not increase each characters rolls are different from each other. Otherwise people would have all the mounts, loot they wanted rather quickly.
    all your doing by using additional characters is giving yourself another shot of of hitting the 2% chance.

    in reality though the drop rates for mounts, is much, much lower.
    Last edited by Sigma; 2013-09-05 at 12:19 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Acelius View Post
    Sigma : Super Intelligent Giant Moldy Anchovy

  11. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by ItachiZaku View Post
    I do understand your pain. My #1 annoyance is the Ansu mount. I got it on my DK when I meh, let me run H Sket real quick. Mount drop, i learned it and never mounted it. Not once. I feel it is a travesty that other classes and get the drop and use it. I go so far as to not heal someone that I see riding it. Why did I go in there on my DK? I really can't tell you. I'd run that place countless times on my Druid with no luck. Not that my druid would use it (travel form always, always, always) but... it's the principle of the thing.
    I went in a few times in TBC and WotLK. I ended up getting it in a LFG satchel.
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    I'm determined to someday make Med'an awesome. (MickyNeilson)
    Originally Posted by Blizzard Entertainment
    ´So.. sorry to bring this up but..you know that .."thing" (Med'an).. is that "thing" cannon still?
    ...as much have some have wished otherwise, yes. (Loreology)

  12. #32
    Legendary! Granyala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sigma View Post
    using this example, with enough characters I could guarantee that I would get the mount in a single week of rolls. That just does not happen.

    It doesnt matter how many characters you have, a 2% chance to drop is still a 2% chance chance to drop, regardless of how many chars you use. it does not increase each characters rolls are different from each other. Otherwise people would have all the mounts, loot they wanted rather quickly.
    all your doing by using additional characters is giving yourself another shot of of hitting the 2% chance.

    in reality though the drop rates for mounts, is much, much lower.
    Sure, you can't influence the individual probability. But The chance of getting a drop after 10 or 100 tries is most definitely higher than 2%.

    The chance of NOT getting your mount is 98%.
    The chance of not getting your mount after 10 tries would be: 0.98^10 = 0.817 (~82%)
    The chance of not getting your mount after 50 tries would be: 0.98^50 = 0.364 (~37%)
    The chance of not getting your mount after 100 tries would be: 0.98^100 = 0.133 (~14%)

    After 100 tries with a 2% drop chance, getting what you want is relatively likely. Though it is NEVER guaranteed.
    Remember: 100 tries on a raidboss mount would be 100 weeks a.k.a. 2 YEARS of farming and there is still a 14% chance of not getting the mount.

    A mount from sha would probably have a droprate of 0.1% or less, in order to combat the fact that everyone can kill it with as many chars as they want.

    The chance of NOT getting your mount is 99.9%.
    The chance of not getting your mount after 10 tries would be: 0.999^10 = 0.99 (~99%)
    The chance of not getting your mount after 50 tries would be: 0.999^50 = 0.95 (~95%)
    The chance of not getting your mount after 100 tries would be: 0.999^100 = 0.90 (~90%)
    The chance of not getting your mount after 500 tries would be: 0.999^500 = 0.606 (~61%)

    Now, keep in mind that there is still variance involved. The above values only count for infinite sample sizes of X-Kills.

    So yes: if you'd had 4600 characters, you could get to the point that you'd have a 99% chance (CHANCE, no guarantee) of getting that mount within one week. But I think the limit of chars was something like 50?

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  13. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Vilnar View Post
    like i said, i have made my peace with rng. I done Stonecore almost 200 times now, and have not yet to see the mount drop. But, even that one have a higher drop chance. The glaives? same situation. Its not a RNG situation because the drop and roll system implied in these WB is different from every thing else. You cannot compare the Heavely onyx mount and change to drop, rng wise, with , like, Ashes of allar. The numbers are not generated in the same way, and still, the drop chance its way above the one is this mounts (i think like 3-4%). And still you see people doing the TK run week after week with lots od alts, and the rng B**ch haven´t been in is favor. now, its a different case a completly different tipe of roll,, and still, a below 0.01% drop chance?? It´s just insane

    Ye, i want the mount, but i am also a fair fighter. I strugle with RNG since i remeber in wow, and, more often than not, i get the item/mount/pet i want. In this case, it´s not the same... not at all... I dont see why people keep considering this equal to previous Xpack RNG system... Well, sorry to burst you're buble, but its not. That's why you see exponentialy more Astral cloud serpents, CLutches of ji-kun and horridon spawns. Because the loot system is different.
    Rng is indeed a bitch


  14. #34
    Rng is indeed a bitch
    Yes, it is, And so are people that continually try to piss out other player cause they have something they don´t. Ma friend, one piece of advice, i'm not one to try and "challenge into a FoS fight", not does the other's accomplishments cause me any anger issues =P

  15. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by FenrisUy View Post
    Rng is indeed a bitch

    ;~;

    There are multiple of us in my guild who regularly farm TK for Ashes (at least 5 of us) on both mains and alts. One trial sees us talking about our shitty luck in guild chat, goes in TK for the first time and, lo and behold, gets Ashes. On his first fucking run (this was just a few days ago, still sort of a soft spot.

    Some of us have logged a large amount of Kael'thas kills over the years. Tables were flipped, he was guild kicked (relax, people get kicked from the guild all the time, running guild joke), and things quieted down after a few minutes (at least until raid time, when the GL/RL found out; more gkicks/reinvites ensued).

    And FoS fights are never fair. Ever.

  16. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    I went in a few times in TBC and WotLK. I ended up getting it in a LFG satchel.
    Roommate linked in /g the sewer rat he got from the satchel, i cussed that I never got him, though fished for probably 10 hours. He gave it to me, said it was the second one he'd gotten from the satchel... Not a fan of that satchel lol Grats though.

  17. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Vilnar View Post
    ---- This is a post from the Official WOW foruns. If you agree woth the below request, please post something there (eu servers) ---

    Hello there everyone.

    First of all, this is not a QQ threat, or at least, its not my intention to be one.

    I'm a collector, it's one of the thing i enjoy doing in wow. Being that achivments, mounts, pets, anything that can be collected, i'm all for it. i have made my peace with the rng a long time ago, and i know the implications it have. I am farming the Warglaives for more than a year, and i saw the same one drop 3 times, and the off still eludes me. And i'm "okay" with that.

    My concern here is the World bosses mount drops. I know that you answer is allways the same "we want things to be rare and not for every player to get it right away", and i would be all for it, if you wouldn´t put things like Invincible and Mimiron's head on the BMAH. One thing completly negate the other, and, in my humble opinion, just "pushes" people to get gold in illicitous ways.
    The new loot sistem makes the RNG on this mounts even worst, maybe because of the coin usage and the fact that we can roll 2 times for it . But... couting the people that so far got it, i must say, its way too low.

    You may call me no lifer or whatever, but, i farm them on 9 chars every week, on my way for the 10th. I do extra roll on every single one of them since the beggining of the expantions, and increasing with the max level chars i got so far, not a single one have droped (and yes, i farm lesser charms in every one to get the extra rolls). I know that "rng" can be a B**ch, but, cammon... this is 18 try's a week, and still ziltsh. Even this is agains RNG.Accoding to the "theory", i should have at least one by now... Or maybe even the same one twice.

    Thousands of people do this bosses and, week after week, the mounts just don´t drop. I found it a "liitle Weird" that , a LOT of 40 man raids all along all the different servers do this and they seem to NEVER drop. Since th beggining of the Xpac, i saw maybe 2 of each on my server, 2... (1 of the nalak only) For a boss that you call kill in evey char every week, i think its a little low...

    There are thousands of player complaining about this, and thousands that understand the RNG system. But this is not the normal wow rng, its too low, its different. That's why you see much more astral cloud serpents, horridon spawns and clutches of ji'kun... because the loot and rng system is the original one. This one is all messed up for this kinds of drops (0.01% and 0.001% on them its WAY too low, and i think that that have been proven so far)

    Well, making my final point. I'm here just to ask for you to raise the mount chance to drop. Below 1% in a coin related boss its proven to be unnafective, so, maybe try and raise it to 2, maybe 3%. And this is just my opinion. Above that may be exagerating it, but, 2% should fix this issue.


    Thanks in advance.
    This is definitely a QQ thread. And if the drop chance is 1%, and you have 10 characters you are doing this on each week, then rng says in 10 weeks you should have the mount drop. Stop the QQ and just keep at it. Some people have gone years without getting Ashes of Alar to drop and when they finally do, its glorious to them.

  18. #38
    Mechagnome
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    Keep in mind that 5.0 world boss mounts are listed in databases with ridiculously low chance like 0.001 % simply because before 5.2 they were bugged and didn't drop at all.
    Still - RNG is RNG. Rare is rare. If a mount has, for example, 1% chance to drop - it also has 1% chance to not drop after 450 kills.
    There are some guaranteed achievement mounts, some 1-2% chance mounts...and some mounts that are more rare. Do you want rare mounts to not exist at all, and every mount to be easier to obtain? Or do you just want those specific mounts to be less rare?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaylock View Post
    This is definitely a QQ thread. And if the drop chance is 1%, and you have 10 characters you are doing this on each week, then rng says in 10 weeks you should have the mount drop. Stop the QQ and just keep at it. Some people have gone years without getting Ashes of Alar to drop and when they finally do, its glorious to them.
    ...RNG says that if you have 63% chance of getting the mount if you kill it with 10 character for 10 weeks.
    Old Gods made me do it.

  19. #39
    There is an even lower chance for it to appear on the BMAH than the boss so I'm not really sure how that's relevant

  20. #40
    Legendary! Granyala's Avatar
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    One trial sees us talking about our shitty luck in guild chat, goes in TK for the first time and, lo and behold, gets Ashes.
    Similar thing for me although I did kill Kael now and then when I felt like it.

    I took my final exam (Diploma) and got a 2.7.
    I was so pissed, that the first thing I did upon getting home was give that ol' Kael a beating to vent some steam.

    Guess my facial expression when I looted the mount.

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