Tier/Trinkets/Role Gearing Priority for SoO 5.4

[Deleted]

Thought it would be a good idea to get some discussion going regarding where min/max guilds will be assigning the first drops of the important gear this tier. I'll start it off with my own (most likely biased towards) very quick single-person-quoting research for things I would want. Give your thoughts/opinions of whether or not it's correct! Would also like to fill in the blanks or add any items I haven't thought of!

Roles
In general: DPS > Healer. I don't know where tanking goes in that.

Tier (DPS)
Vanq: Rogue 2 set > Fire Mage 4 set > Balance Druid 4 set > DK 2+4 set / Rogue 4 set
Conq: ???
Prot: ???

Trinkets
Immerseus Amp: Mage/Lock > Rest
Agil CD: ???
Heal CD: ???
Str CD: ???

[iDrunkenheal]

Tanks should get their tier sets if they are really good otherwise

dps > tanks > healers

Gearing dps will make fights shorter thus making fights easier for tanks and healers. Where as gearing healers while it helps them heal more doesn't make it easier for dps and it also has diminishing returns.

[Nobleshield]

It's normally DPS > tank > Healer, no?

[Azlo]

The int amp trinket will benefit Elemental in terms of percentage DPS boost by far more than a Fire Mage, due to the crit damage boost (~70% of elemental damage is crit), as well as haste/mastery boosts (best 2 stats). In addition, Elemental/Balance/Shadow can use the amped Spirit as well, whereas that's completely useless for Mage Warlock. Mages also have Crit>Haste>Mastery, meaning that their best stat doesn't even get boosted.

I think in terms of percentage DPS boost to the character, it will go Elemental -> Boomkin -> Shadow -> Mage -> Warlock.

However, Mages always do absurd overpowered damage, so as an absolute raid DPS gain the mage might be better.

[justflayin]

I disagree with the specific dps class that gets gear first. You should always hook your top performers up. You could have a shit mage, but an awesome boomkin.

[Amerrol]

In addition, Elemental/Balance/Shadow can use the amped Spirit as well, whereas that's completely useless for Mage Warlock.

The Spirit amp trinket won't proc the Intellect for dps though. Not sure if it would be worth it, especially since that trinket is BiS for most healers (well at least for Priests it is).

- - - Updated - - -

I disagree with the specific dps class that gets gear first. You should always hook your top performers up. You could have a shit mage, but an awesome boomkin.

Also, this.

[Azlo]

The Spirit amp trinket won't proc the Intellect for dps though. Not sure if it would be worth it, especially since that trinket is BiS for most healers (well at least for Priests it is).

I'm talking about the fact that the amplifcation trinket is X% to haste, mastery, crit damage, healing, and spirit.

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=102293/p...s-of-immerseus

[Alzu]

The balance 4set isn't actually that great so I'm not sure if it's worth prioritizing that asap. The 2set though is amazing.

[Fluorescent0]

I'm talking about the fact that the amplifcation trinket is X% to haste, mastery, crit damage, healing, and spirit.

http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=102293/p...s-of-immerseus

And he's saying that since it doesn't proc for casters you have half the trinket wasted.

[Tojara]

I don't think you get what he's saying. He's still talking about the intellect caster based amplification trinket. Even the caster one, designed for CASTER DPS boosts spirit as well. Which means it gives crit damage, haste/mastery and essentially hit rating for spirit based casters like elemental, shadow, and balance.

I have no idea if hit cap is going to be an issue, but if you can use hit those classes get a little bit more itemization out of it.

[Gorfion]

Distribution of the gear depends both on how amazing the set bonus/trinket is for a class and how good the player behind the class is in your raid. Whether set bonuses go to tanks or dps first depends on how good the set bonuses are for each person on that token, and on how much damage your tanks contribute to the raid. Weapons and trinkets should basically always go to dps first, and gear in general should go to healers last. Everyone in your raid should know how beneficial set bonuses and trinkets are to their class, and be able to work out among that token/trinket's group the priority order.

Regarding dps dk tier, if your dks are going to play unholy next tier they should be pretty low on priority for 2 set and probably won't even want the 4 set. On the other hand, if they are going to play masterfrost, both the 2 and 4 set are fairly powerful. And our current 4 set is pretty worthless for masterfrost, so at least the 2 set would be pretty high priority. But again, it depends on how good your mages, rogues, druids, and dks are.

[Azlo]

I don't think you get what he's saying. He's still talking about the intellect caster based amplification trinket. Even the caster one, designed for CASTER DPS boosts spirit as well. Which means it gives crit damage, haste/mastery and essentially hit rating for spirit based casters like elemental, shadow, and balance.

I have no idea if hit cap is going to be an issue, but if you can use hit those classes get a little bit more itemization out of it.

I'd love to improve my communication skills but I really did not think I was that unclear. My bet is that most people think the amp trinket doesn't add to spirit even though it is clearly written on the tag. I'll give it another shot at explaining what I'm talking about.

I am talking about this trinket: Purified Bindings of Immerseus. This trinket procs an intellect buff from attacks. Due to this, this is the caster DPS trinket.

The actual amplification effect is as follows (for the 553 version):

Equip: Amplifies your Critical Strike damage and healing, Haste, Mastery, and Spirit by 7%.

Thus, for Elemental, Boomkin, and Shadow, this trinket actually gives you hit rating as well. This is because for Elemental, Boomkin and Shadow, Spirit gives you hit. This 7% spirit is completely wasted if it's given to a mage or a warlock.

I will once again link the trinket I'm talking about: http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=102293/p...s-of-immerseus

[Amerrol]

I'd love to improve my communication skills but I really did not think I was that unclear. My bet is that most people think the amp trinket doesn't add to spirit even though it is clearly written on the tag. I'll give it another shot at explaining what I'm talking about.

I am talking about this trinket: Purified Bindings of Immerseus. This trinket procs an intellect buff from attacks. Due to this, this is the caster DPS trinket.

The actual amplification effect is as follows (for the 553 version):

Equip: Amplifies your Critical Strike damage and healing, Haste, Mastery, and Spirit by 7%.

Thus, for Elemental, Boomkin, and Shadow, this trinket actually gives you hit rating as well. This is because for Elemental, Boomkin and Shadow, Spirit gives you hit. This 7% spirit is completely wasted if it's given to a mage or a warlock.

I will once again link the trinket I'm talking about: http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=102293/p...s-of-immerseus

Ah, wasn't aware there is Spirit on the DPS one as well. I feel like last time I saw it the Spirit wasn't there.

[Weightlifter]

We are very far from a min/max guild, but our raid leader (DK tank) said that he'd like to gear tanks first when the new tier comes because "that's what all the top guilds do". I know that used to be the case in the past, but sounds more like an excuse to be greedy. Tank damage is like the smallest of all problems in 10man raiding.

[Woobels]

We are very far from a min/max guild, but our raid leader (DK tank) said that he'd like to gear tanks first when the new tier comes because "that's what all the top guilds do". I know that used to be the case in the past, but sounds more like an excuse to be greedy. Tank damage is like the smallest of all problems in 10man raiding.

No top guild does that anymore unless you get significant boosts from it like the raid cooldowns in DS.

Tanks tend to get gear quickly usually anyways though.

[Deleted]

We are very far from a min/max guild, but our raid leader (DK tank) said that he'd like to gear tanks first when the new tier comes because "that's what all the top guilds do". I know that used to be the case in the past, but sounds more like an excuse to be greedy. Tank damage is like the smallest of all problems in 10man raiding.

Correct
10char

[Deleted]

Can people not read?

The amp trinket says, your attacks therefore it procs from damage, therefore it is a caster trinket.

Also, the new boomkin 4 set is pretty lack luster now after they nerfed it, we will want our tier 16 2 set very fast, as it is a fairly large dps increase.

[Deleted]

No top guild does that anymore unless you get significant boosts from it like the raid cooldowns in DS.

Tanks tend to get gear quickly usually anyways though.

As an officer of a 13/13 Heroic guild, we're going to gear dps>tanks>healers and then prio top dps. As in, the best dps (they're all more or less equally geared) gets the upgrade first, cause they'll be doing more dps.

Damage taken for tanks isn't a problem (at least in 10 man) and therefore the only reason you'd give your tanks some gear, is because they add significantly with the damage - specially in 10 man. But it isn't really that easy or fast to gear tanks these days. Bears, Monks, Paladins and some DK's go for dps gear and trinkets. As a Bear tank myself, I always have to pass to our Rogue, Hunter and then everyone on the same token - unless my Tier bonus is extremely OP or unless I get my hands on a token from say Flex and can get a 2p bonus over someone who won't get a bonus.

What I'm trying to say is, that it's become much harder to gear tanks now. And it sucks always having to be last in line to get the loot but that's how it has to be, when you want to progress. Healers are in the same boat, they have to heal more with less gear.

[Tojara]

You don't really need to gear tanks first. Tanks are privy to gear that 1-2 people max want in your raid, and therefore get these items defaulted to them anyways.

I tank and have been passing stuff to everybody else first for quite sometime. The only time you would want to prioritize gearing tanks is if something is incredibly broken for them, but you use that logic regardless of role. The set bonuses in DS are a really good example of possibly wanting to gear tanks out first.

Realistically the only way I would think of tanks ahead of DPS is if it's a DPS that is likely to be rotated in and out, whereas a tank is typically going to be in 100% of the time. Also there are particular trinkets that some tanks share with DPS that might be better served on a tank first, but that's about it.

As far as general gearing goes DPS > Tank > Healers. It's a good guideline and will give you the most bang for your buck if progression is your thing.

Someone already mentioned it but tank damage is typically the smallest problem, at least in 10 man. So much that you have tanks running around focused entirely on DPS, even sacrificing survival in most instances. If a tank needs to mitigate damage there are lots of things they can do just by changing stats, legendary meta, legendary cape, and how they even play. If it's still a problem well, I guess then you could gear out your tanks. Although if there are still problems there might be more pressing issues like bad play (whether it be the tank, healers, or strategy).

[Marxman]

As far as Agi DPS gear goes, prioritize Rogues > WW/Feral/Enhance > Hunters.

Hunter stat scaling is absolutely terrible. We see much less gain from gear upgrades than most other classes.

Prot tokens may be an exception, our set bonuses are fairly good (4pc for Surv is very good).