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  1. #1

    Ra-den - Addon or no addon?

    Hello!

    Recently got Lei shen down and figured we'd get Ra-den before reset aswell.
    So i'm currently trying to decide if i should rely on an addon (Big wigs Ra-den assist) or just try to call out everything by myself mid-fight.

    The ability in question is the debuff you get from vita phase. It's not really that complicated, you just gotta remember the 2 guys infront of you and move when it's your turn. But it seems it was way to complicated for some of us and we lost 10 attempts just on that pretty much.

    20 attempts to go and i've been checking around. That addon looks really good to have if it works as i believe it does?
    So that for example, whomever gets the debuff gets put in the bottom, and whoever is next will be at the top, so i can easily call out who goes to soak next and so on.

    I've just never used it so if anyone else has used it and gotten it to work properly, how did you set it up in order to see everyone in the group? And did you have to configure something in order to get debuffed people at the end and "next-in-line" people in the top?

    If we decide not to use addon what can we do about that? It was kinda hectic to focus on everyone and call out who goes where for every debuff when you're 2 healing and people are taking alot of damage.

    Any general tips for the encounter? Cheers!

  2. #2
    Bloodsail Admiral Chrispotter's Avatar
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    If your 10 man I dont think you really need an addon to track 10 people... In 25 man the addon is a great help though.
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  3. #3
    We did it without the addon on 25 man just fine. We made an easy order, and had the current person calling out the next person in the order. Have been working since our first Kill.

    If you dislike having the entire raid Call out, use the addon, and Call out yourself.

    TLDR: definately not needed, but can be convenient.

  4. #4
    you don't need it in 10man, just eyes and a mouth

    would probably need it in 25m

  5. #5
    Mechagnome Devboy's Avatar
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    No need for an addon. Use the simple method of a rotation.

    Player 1
    Player 2
    Player 3
    Player 4
    Player 5
    etc etc
    Have the order start from whoever gets unstable vita first. Make sure the first person always moves to the same spot. All people need to remember is who is before them / after them. And simply individually call out.

    So for example. Player 3 gets vita first, the order now starts there. 3 goes to set point, and 4 goes to opposite set point. 4 gets vita, 3 move back into hug, 5 comes out. continue.

    Next round 5 gets vita first. 5 moves to set point, 6 moves to opposite point. 6 gets vita, 5 moves in, 7 comes out. Simples.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Devboy View Post
    No need for an addon. Use the simple method of a rotation.

    Player 1
    Player 2
    Player 3
    Player 4
    Player 5
    etc etc
    Have the order start from whoever gets unstable vita first. Make sure the first person always moves to the same spot. All people need to remember is who is before them / after them. And simply individually call out.

    So for example. Player 3 gets vita first, the order now starts there. 3 goes to set point, and 4 goes to opposite set point. 4 gets vita, 3 move back into hug, 5 comes out. continue.

    Next round 5 gets vita first. 5 moves to set point, 6 moves to opposite point. 6 gets vita, 5 moves in, 7 comes out. Simples.
    That's actually really good, we went from start everytime. So if player 3 got it, player 1 goes next, then player 2, then player 4. It was often on that "jump" that people failed. Should help out Thanks for the replies!

  7. #7
    In my group our shaman always manages who should go where, person with first debuff always goes to left mark, and so on. But if you struggle at that not using addon which will help you is just stupid;p
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  8. #8
    Mechagnome Devboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanktas View Post
    That's actually really good, we went from start everytime. So if player 3 got it, player 1 goes next, then player 2, then player 4. It was often on that "jump" that people failed. Should help out Thanks for the replies!
    Yea, that way can confuse people. rather just have everyone in an order, and whoever gets its first becomes first in the order. Simply remember before and after you, and GG. On our first kill I'm pretty sure at the end someone was just like "lol is that a boss?" So yea, pretty easy tbh.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by blgns View Post
    In my group our shaman always manages who should go where, person with first debuff always goes to left mark, and so on. But if you struggle at that not using addon which will help you is just stupid;p
    Can't really try the addon out without wiping atleast 1-2 times to get it right i think. Unless it's automatically "right"..

    For example if you look on this picture - http://i.imgur.com/9Edf3Ei.jpg
    Don't know how the addon will "show" me midfight.. why is there 2 groups? I only need 1 group i guess... Want all of em in a line and then show the debuff per person and so on.

    That's why i asked at the start if anyone has used it, if they could let me know how it works

  10. #10
    Pandaren Monk Spacebubble's Avatar
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    Might I suggest on top of making a list like mentioned above (which is the best way to do it) you make a weak auras with unstable vita on a specific target (in this case the person before you on the list) that way you'll get an aura up every time it's on the person before you on the list.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Spacebot View Post
    Might I suggest on top of making a list like mentioned above (which is the best way to do it) you make a weak auras with unstable vita on a specific target (in this case the person before you on the list) that way you'll get an aura up every time it's on the person before you on the list.
    That means that everyone has to get weakauras doesn't it? In order to get told when to move, right?

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanktas View Post
    Can't really try the addon out without wiping atleast 1-2 times to get it right i think. Unless it's automatically "right"..

    For example if you look on this picture - http://i.imgur.com/9Edf3Ei.jpg
    Don't know how the addon will "show" me midfight.. why is there 2 groups? I only need 1 group i guess... Want all of em in a line and then show the debuff per person and so on.

    That's why i asked at the start if anyone has used it, if they could let me know how it works
    I don't know if you are still undecided or unsure about the addon, but here is how it works - it's designed for the original 2 groups strat - you have two groups - Star / Diamond, and people will take turn to go Star, Diamond, Star, Diamond, etc. (have a quick look at Method's vid).

    If you are using the one group + lock portal strat - just put everyone in the same group on Ra-den assist, and leave the other group blank. I.e: if you want the next soaker to run to Diamond and the one giving away Vita waitting at Star, leave Star blank and put everyone in order in Diamond.
    Mouse-over Ra-den, click Send List button, you should see a list of name on your Ra-den assist. If you put everyone in the same group, they should be in something like
    Guy 1
    Guy 2
    ...
    > You <
    ...
    Guy n

    If you see that list already, it should be fine. In combat, that list will be updated automatically - if a guy get the debuff, or is killed, his name is automatically moved to bottom. If a guy get killed and rezzed, his name will be back to its old position (if his turn has passed, his name will jump to top IIRC).
    The one on the top of the list will be the one whose turn to get debuff is up (= the one who should move to the taking debuff position, wait for it, then click portal or run to the giving debuff position). Remember that you have to click Send Lists again to re-sync the lists with everyone at beginning of each pull (someone told me it may not be needed, but it takes only few seconds at most, so just do it).

    If you are 10m, you won't need to use Ra-den assist, just call names - sometimes it may even be confusing if you are going to have your raider immune, clear the debuff (I know my friend's 10m guild do that) and mess up the list. If you are 25m, the list will definitely help if everyone run Ra-den assist (easier to know when it's your turn without the need to rely on Vent in case of Vent lag & easier to know when it's going to be your turn so your raiders can be prepared when your name come closer to the top), but you can just use Grid (going top to bottom, left to right in Garalon's fashion) and it will work just fine.
    Last edited by Qualia; 2013-09-06 at 11:20 AM.

  13. #13
    Stood in the Fire Winkle's Avatar
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    Use the weak auras provided by the vox guys,
    video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-ij6u5uqk0
    weak aura: http://pastebin.com/L0TaUALX

    The debuff is the only mechanic the raid really have to consider (outside the tank) but messing it up will quickly eat through your attempts. Calling it out on 10man should also work without issue. The vox group positioning is nice since it allows for the highest melee uptime.

    Don't use the bigwigs addon.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Winkle View Post
    Use the weak auras provided by the vox guys,
    video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-ij6u5uqk0
    weak aura: http://pastebin.com/L0TaUALX

    The debuff is the only mechanic the raid really have to consider (outside the tank) but messing it up will quickly eat through your attempts. Calling it out on 10man should also work without issue. The vox group positioning is nice since it allows for the highest melee uptime.

    Don't use the bigwigs addon.
    Any reason not to use bigwigs? Did you have any bad experiences with it? It if works the way qualia said, then it seems to be extremely simplified.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Sanktas View Post
    Any reason not to use bigwigs? Did you have any bad experiences with it? It if works the way qualia said, then it seems to be extremely simplified.
    Well, if you are running a 10m, then I don't think Ra-den assist is necessary, too, because:
    - The Vita debuff has 10s duration in 10m, making calling people to run out trivial hence an addon isn't needed. Its duration on 25m is only 5s, plus vent delay, you would want people to be prepared as much as possible when their turn is coming.
    - AFAIK, many 10m use immunity users to take the debuff twice. It can be confusing using Ra-den assist (seeing a name drop to bottom when he got debuff, then jump back up top when he uses immunity)
    However, besides that, I don't see how it can harm your ra-den attempts. Even in 10m, while it isn't as helpful as it is in 25m, Ra-den assist will still be a big help to simplify things - it gives you a nice list to call, it marks people who need to go to taking position, it can be configured to call out which orb you are killing / touching if you are too lazy to count. It's not a must, but definitely helpful (off topic: and I have always preferred Bigwigs to DBM)

    Vid with Vent if you want to see how Ra-den assist works in action: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4bAZh9zMas

    Edit: If you just get Ra-den assist, you may want to double check at its orb configuration (killing how many before touching). IIRC, the first time I downloaded it, the numbers were a bit off (should be 3-2-3-w/e), so I got to change these numbers and sync the config with everyone else.
    Last edited by Qualia; 2013-09-06 at 12:13 PM.

  16. #16
    Pandaren Monk Spacebubble's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanktas View Post
    That means that everyone has to get weakauras doesn't it? In order to get told when to move, right?
    Everyone should really get that addon to begin with for these kind of situations. There's many more debuffs or buffs that you can track on other players that you want to know about.

  17. #17
    I like this addon quite a bit in 25. No need for me to call anything, it marks people automatically so they go to their assigned spot on their own. Calling out 20 people every 5 seconds would be far more annoying. It can get a bit messy if someone dies and gets ressed, but nothing major - people simply should expect to soak again soon after they're up.

    As a sidenote, default orb kill order was confusing for me. Is four balls after pull even possible? Seems to be way over 25 debuffs that way. Not that I used addon for that part, but it was still strange.

  18. #18
    Atleast on 10, after 3 debuffs almost everyone has the debuff, 4 is probably possible if you have people that can remove the debuff and take it again. Otherwise 3 seems to be precise.

    I'll probably just go with the addon, get it to work and it should be fine. Might aswell use it if it simplifies it for us.

  19. #19
    Stood in the Fire Winkle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanktas View Post
    Any reason not to use bigwigs? Did you have any bad experiences with it? It if works the way qualia said, then it seems to be extremely simplified.
    We had significant issues with it, often people wouldn't show up on, it requires constant Ui reloading for others. Seemed like to much hassle for what is relatively simple mechanic. The weak aura just adds a bit of security and most people run weak auras anyway.

    If all your raid uses bigwigs already then maybe it isn't such an issue (everyone needs to run the BW's addon btw).

  20. #20
    We used the strat with the current vita-debuffed player by the boss on the right (blue world marker), the next vita target ~15 yards away (green world marker), and the raid on the left of the boss (red marker). This, paired with 2 weakauras, one that would say "stand on green" if your focus had Unstable Vita, one that would say "stand on blue" if you have unstable vita. Everyone's /focus being the person in the assigned order that comes before them, or, for the first person in the order, the last person in the order is their focus (so it is circular loop). That's all.
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