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  1. #41
    The Patient Volbian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleshield View Post
    And therein lies the rub, because sometimes you can have friends but not have confidence in the group as a whole to be at the level you want to be at, and then deciding becomes a much harder choice.
    That's most of players' problem. Their loyalty to "friends" they met online. Not realizing that you can make NEW friends somewhere else. How else did you get into your guild or previous guilds?

    I, personally, dont view anyone online as a friend. They're acquaintances. Friends know everything about you, someone you go to bars with, someone who got your back, knows your family, knows your deepest darkest secret. Acquaintances, know enough to trust you and thats all. They will never have your back nor do they care enough about you. Yes, you have a common interest, in this case, raiding on WoW, but thats as far as it goes. They are just a voice over a chat program.

    If this doesnt apply to you then just disregard everything i said. But if it does, remember you pay to play the game how you want. Not to please people you'll never meet or even hang out with. Also, when you were a noob, like everyone was at one point, you made obviously got into a guild and made friends there, without knowing anyone, right? Why cant you do it again?


    Thats my story and i'm sticking to it!

  2. #42
    Field Marshal Teddybird's Avatar
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    Guilds that stay together and get whatever goal set are with people all with the same mind.
    If half your raid team wants progress that is not only happening, but there being force by leadership to go to content that they feel is done or waste time. Them leaving was the easier of situations.

    Guilds should recruit to there level of play so you don't have a gap between best and worse. Same goes for people looking to join guilds, join one of your level or close to it.
    This is ten percent luck, twenty percent skill
    Fifteen percent concentrated power of will
    Five percent pleasure, fifty percent pain
    And a hundred percent reason to remember the name!

  3. #43
    Stood in the Fire Vattenmelon's Avatar
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    First weeks of ToT my guild was struggling on Horridon so we runned Heart of Fear to gear people instead, and everyone was ok with it, we found a couple of new people also and some week later we downed Horridon.

  4. #44
    I dont mind doing old raids for gear, but from past xp all i can say it never works out right because of the following reasons.

    1) Some dont want to do it on their mains, but want to do it on alts to gear them up, which ends in wipe night or people being unhappy because x person can take alt and y person cant, even tho one alt is ilvl500+ and other is ilvl 450.

    2) People not having any focus, thinking its all a zerg fest and again 2h clear turns into a full night of wipes.

    3) Everything works out fine in gear raids, but the people you geared get tiered or have some RL problem and dont show for main raids. Because lets face it , sure its RNG, but if someone is 20+ilvl under the rest of raid when new raid tier comes, he is either new recruit who didnt raid that much in the raid tier he lacks gear from or he was slacking already and didnt show for raid thus missed gear. I dont rule bad RNG out, but thats 1:10000000000000....

  5. #45
    We have mage who with hc tot gear for looooong time did like 120k dps top. in addition he stay in all posible shit(i ha ve tofinish fireball cast). even with him we did 10/13 hc + 1more when he finaly improved dps and did like 250 or 300k on animus(i am not sure).
    killing bosses is about learning your str and weak points so doing old content may help but not in gear but skill. Leving guild ONLY becaulse you do old content is dumb but ppl are free and they can do what they want

  6. #46
    Immortal Raiju's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lokatii View Post
    Not trying to sound like a jerk, but how do you get stuck on normal horridon for a few months... xD
    I think Horridon has had the highest guild stopping % since wrath of any normal mode boss, and more than the majority of some tiers.
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    which is kind of like saying "of COURSE you can't see the unicorns, unicorns are invisible, silly."

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Raiju View Post
    I think Horridon has had the highest guild stopping % since wrath of any normal mode boss, and more than the majority of some tiers.
    That's not because of Horridon himself, that's because Jin'Rokh is the biggest joke of the past two expansions. There's no data available for the people stuck on boss 1 of a raid because they don't show up until they kill something, Jin'Rokh is just so easy that all these people who by any normal circumstances shouldn't be raiding can still kill one boss then get "stuck" on the second.

    If a guild is still struggling on Horridon they really have no rights to call themselves a raid guild, there were plenty of pugs in the first two weeks that could get further than that. OP, if you have any real interest in raiding, find a new guild. Your current one seems rather pathetic.

  8. #48
    Immortal Raiju's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CptAwesome View Post
    That's not because of Horridon himself, that's because Jin'Rokh is the biggest joke of the past two expansions. There's no data available for the people stuck on boss 1 of a raid because they don't show up until they kill something, Jin'Rokh is just so easy that all these people who by any normal circumstances shouldn't be raiding can still kill one boss then get "stuck" on the second.

    If a guild is still struggling on Horridon they really have no rights to call themselves a raid guild, there were plenty of pugs in the first two weeks that could get further than that. OP, if you have any real interest in raiding, find a new guild. Your current one seems rather pathetic.
    All easy to say from our perch but very ignorant of you. The same people that could kill 4-6 bosses in ICC, kill 3-8 bosses in T11, 4~ bosses in T12, 6 bosses T13, and 6-9 bosses T14 struggled on horridon. It has broken a lot of guilds and Jin'rokh is not the outlier here. Once you get past Horridon and Council it's basically a free ride to Lei shen with a couple execution checks along the way (durumu and dark animus).
    Quote Originally Posted by Endus View Post
    which is kind of like saying "of COURSE you can't see the unicorns, unicorns are invisible, silly."

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Ugru View Post
    Simple - some players are just less skilled than others.

    I had a similar situation. When 5.2 went live, my guild was only 9/16 in the 5.0 raids. We had a solid membership but had some REALLY unskilled players that literally died on every attempt of every boss. It felt like a huge accomplishment if we all survived an encounter intact. We tried Jin'rokh and gave up after 6 hours of wipes. The officers decided to go back and complete the 5.0 raids in the following weeks. When we got stuck on Amber Shaper Un'sok I decided I was done beating my head against the wall trying to be patient with raiders that can't step out of fire or couldn't grasp simple concepts like "switch DPS to the add."
    At that point it isn't even about skill, either those players have some major disability like they are blind and have no hands, or they simply don't care.
    Most people would rather die than think, and most people do. -Bertrand Russell
    There is not a flag large enough to cover the shame of killing innocent people. -Howard Zinn
    The stars may be far away, but people still reach for them. -My Grandfather
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  10. #50
    Stood in the Fire Weightlifter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voidspark View Post
    Just do it.
    Maybe if there wasn't a new raid coming tomorrow. Now is probably the worst possible moment to find a new guild, and being a retri paladin doesn't make it any easier.

  11. #51
    Focusing one day of a week for gear up raids shouldn't be an issue in a guild, which isn't top 100 and going for the ranks. Otherwise everyone should focus on and only on the progress
    Time is on our side
    Brutal Gladiator Enhancement Shaman *rawr*

  12. #52
    Moderator Nobleshield's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weightlifter View Post
    Maybe if there wasn't a new raid coming tomorrow. Now is probably the worst possible moment to find a new guild, and being a retri paladin doesn't make it any easier.
    Right now is probably the worst time for anyone to find a new guild, or at least one that has hope of doing well in 5.4.
    NOBLESHIELD
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  13. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Darksoldierr View Post
    Focusing one day of a week for gear up raids shouldn't be an issue in a guild, which isn't top 100 and going for the ranks. Otherwise everyone should focus on and only on the progress
    If that one night is the sole raid night of the week, then there is an issue. Old content should (in any guild that wants progression) be on off-nights (scheduled, sure, normal raid night, no).

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryngo Blackratchet View Post
    Yeah, Rhandric is right, as usual.

  14. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Drummerboy View Post
    Don't fall in love with your guild.
    This accurate statement right here. Its what happened to me with my current guild and I've put up with so much because of it where a normal person would just leave. Doesn't apply to the current situation but when you start to care too much, you end up taking a lot of crap that you shouldn't need to.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nobleshield View Post
    Right now is probably the worst time for anyone to find a new guild, or at least one that has hope of doing well in 5.4.
    With all the guilds recruiting right now (high end included), I disagree.

  15. #55
    If the undergeared players were doing all they could(ie: crafted, capping valor/rep and buying appropriate items) I would be fine with it. If they were just coasting along and soaking up gear I would be against doing old raids. If I recall, Horridon was pretty tight back when it first came out for raid groups who were undergeared.

  16. #56
    It's easier to get into a good guild right now than into a bad guild. The reason is very "on topic" mentality.

  17. #57
    Legendary! vindicatorx's Avatar
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    No, I'm a ridiculously nice person and have always raided with people who severely hold back progress no matter how much I wanted to down content.

  18. #58
    Scarab Lord nightfalls's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Audiocubes View Post
    With all the guilds recruiting right now (high end included), I disagree.
    Same. The start of the tier is usually one of the best times to find a guild (the only better time, in my books, is shortly before the start of a new tier) because there will always be a player shuffle at the start, a lot of players will realize they can't commit and step down, etc. so long as you aren't extremely undergeared. If you wait even a few weeks you will fall behind significantly in gear and be fucked until content is cleared.

    The faster the better at this point. (Actually to think about it, when is sooner not better?)

  19. #59
    Well I've never been a raider so I guess I can't completely relate, but I think it'd depend on how close I was to the people. Am I in the guild for the people (friends) and raiding is just something we do together? If so, I wouldn't leave. Or am I in the guild for the sole purpose of progressing, and the other members are just a means to an end that I've met along the way? In that case, I'd leave as soon as I felt they didn't share my goals. But either way, it's stupid to quit because of one missed raid night. That's just taking it way too seriously.

  20. #60
    It's not like you automatically get decked out in tier 16 gear the moment the new raid opens. Gearing up takes time, raiding lower tier instances to get gear is a perfectly valid choice, especially if your group is having trouble with the current raid.

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