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  1. #81
    All depends on the guild experience.

    In BC my guild was "just there to do raids" so all I really cared about was progression...but then I burned out in the lull between the xpacs
    In Wrath I found a bunch of people I got along with...they weren't as hardcore as the BC guild (I guess you would call them Hardcore casual) so we progressed slowly but it was fun cause of the people
    Missed Cata, but now in MoP I found some older HC raiders that just don't have time anymore cause of life...so we raid 1/w for 4 hours. Progress is slow...but its still fun.

    We hit the Horridon wall as we only started raiding 2 weeks before 5.2 (and some of us only got to LFR 1 or 2 weeks of 5.0 content)...we went back and cleared the last 4 of Heart and TOES before we went back into Horridon and it helped a ton. Probably only two weeks....the iLevel increase was all the help we needed. Remember at the time only the first 3 of LFR ToT would have been available...so that was the only gearin option.

    We are all fully normal decked now, so I don't expect to go back...but assuming we had to, I'd guess we would Flex it down first before going back to previous...at least till LFR was released to fill the gaps.

  2. #82
    Moderator Nobleshield's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by judgementofantonidas View Post
    I have seen the endless cycle of this over and over again as the years have passed. Build a raid team, accomplish the goal, someone feels they know or can do better, they break off maybe show a moducum of success then implode. It is just the way of players unless you are in a bleeding edge guild that never gets it wrong. Players do not want to build and grow, they want to receive.
    Probably because "build and grow" takes time and effort that many guilds don't want to invest. If you're unwilling to kick/replace people performing subpar,or recruit people, or make sure people know the fight and what to do it's usually less hassle to just find a place where they do that. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

    It's actually funny I was reading an old thread from years ago on another site where I was having problems with a guild in ICC that couldn't down Saurfang with the buff, without anyone caring about improvement and dismissing any notion that things were wrong. I left and went to a guild a little bit better, but having issues on Blood Princes for weeks. Again, nothing was really being done that I could tell so I switched servers, and I recall the first week I switched servers I got up to Arthas. Went from like 7/12 to 11/12 in the span of a week by switching servers and going to a guild with better players; had I stayed in that original guild I doubt we ever would have gotten past Saurfang, because the officers could see issues but were clueless how to actually fix it, and nobody else cared.

    The first step in building and growing is recognizing a problem and taking the steps to fix it, even if you have to be "the bad guy" and tell "Good Old Bob" that you have to replace him because 40k DPS isn't going to cut it anymore. It's when you have a guild that refuses to do that because "We like Bob" or "We don't have anyone to replace Bob" or "If we bench Bob, then we lose Sue and Joe because that's his wife and brother" that you have to make a decision. Like the saying goes in the workforce: Either you can change your company, or you can change your company. Same thing in WoW. You can call me out for drama or stirring shit or whatever, but you have to admit that it gets frustrating seeing the same mistakes week in, week out without anyone but you giving a shit about fixing them, or worse saying they want it fixed but not actually doing anything to fix it.
    Last edited by Nobleshield; 2013-09-11 at 06:57 PM.
    NOBLESHIELD
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