1. #3461
    The Patient royals's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maldias View Post
    pay the fuck attention, cause i am only explaining this once.

    we. did. not. want. it.

    we now DO have the choice to raid with the guild and again with freinds.
    thats what FLEX MODE IS FOR.
    Damn Maldias you beat me to it. Those blanket "I'm sure 99% of raiders agree with me" statements just ooze with ignorance.

    Flex is exactly what 10 ICC was in Wrath. Its perfect... slightly lower difficulty, not considered for world first race etc. Good use to gear alts and practice strategy, but not face roll like LFR it still takes a brain to complete.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    Flex mode is garbage mode. Even 10 normal icc was 10x more complicated.

    I like to help friends in normal mode, not bloody flex, nobody gives a flying sh** about
    It sounds like you just don't like what it is "called". IF they called Flex "Normal with friends" then you would be ok with it?

    Also, this conversation has completely de-railed from the threads intent.
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  2. #3462
    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    Flex mode is garbage mode. Even 10 normal icc was 10x more complicated.

    I like to help friends in normal mode, not bloody flex, nobody gives a flying sh** about.

    Couldn't care less about your opinion tbh.
    hahahahaha


    same to you, but heres the thing.
    my opinion isn't a minority one.

    during wrath the feedback about that system was vitriolic to say the least.
    people became burned out on content far faster then they do now because of how required it was to do as many raids as possible.
    at one point that means doing within one week:
    normal 10man,
    heroic 10man,
    normal 25man,
    and heroic 25man.

    and that wasn't optional as there was different loot tables between 10 and 25.
    Last edited by maldias; 2013-09-30 at 12:59 AM.

  3. #3463
    speak for yourself, i loved Wrath's raiding model. And i bet some of the millions that left after wrath would say the same. The changes to raiding signified the downhill run of this game if you recall the history.

  4. #3464
    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    Flex mode is garbage mode. Even 10 normal icc was 10x more complicated.

    I like to help friends in normal mode, not bloody flex, nobody gives a flying sh** about
    Well that's intentional, if you have a regular organised NM group that doesn't have headcount issues you are the target audience for NM, not flexi. You can do flexi at your leisure with a pug group/openraid or semi-guild group or whatever you please outside of NM, for a few extra loot slots, or for achieves, or for practice, or on alts - if you so choose (therefore it doesn't share a lockout).

    Flexi is intended as a PRIMARY raiding avenue for people who don't have a regular raid group like that, or their regular group can't run a lot of weeks due to attendance issues. For you it's just an optional SECONDARY raiding avenue.

    I agree it'd be great if flexi could've been applied to NM so you could take 11 people if Phil the Irregular Raider turns up for raid on a night when you're already full. But Blizzard chose not to apply flexi to NM for fear of creating issues for 10m or 25m NM guilds due to possible pressure to min-max rosters.
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  5. #3465
    Herald of the Titans Blitzo's Avatar
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    It's a shame the community and or Blizzard had to make things different across the world. They should release games and their expansions across the world at the exact same time with the exact same game. (No double lockouts, 4 upgrades, ect) This way, there would not be this derailing and blatant ignorance of the community on the meaning of WORLD first.

    Asia first, West first, East first, US first .. Damn. That doesn't even look appealing.

    World first looks appealing

    It's also a shame most of the old school top guilds have quit/disband/merged with other guilds. I'd like to see REAL global rankings.

    Maybe the next expansion will be different, but alas, I doubt it.
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  6. #3466
    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    Flex mode is garbage mode. Even 10 normal icc was 10x more complicated.

    I like to help friends in normal mode, not bloody flex, nobody gives a flying sh** about
    We've only done the first half of flex already, too soon to make that assumption. Also 10m normal icc was kinda cake.

  7. #3467
    Brewmaster Jess Day's Avatar
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    pay the fuck attention, cause i am only explaining this once.

    we. did. not. want. it.
    Well i did. And that means not everyone hated it. I'd gladly take double lockout. 10 normal/heroic, flex, 25 normal/heroic? Yes please.

    It's interesting to see you putting down blanket statements as bullshit and then coming up with your own.

  8. #3468
    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    Flex mode is garbage mode. Even 10 normal icc was 10x more complicated.
    No, it wasn't. 10N ICC was easier than flex.

    I like to help friends in normal mode, not bloody flex, nobody gives a flying sh** about
    Well, unless you want to roll an alt or take them on the main raid, that isn't going to happen. Flex was made so you could take inexperienced friends to a raid. And nobody needs to stay out either in case you have more than 9 friends that want to come with you.
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  9. #3469
    Quote Originally Posted by Hikashuri View Post
    They killed a boss with almost being 11 ilvls over the intended scaling, to me it's not a world first, world first cheesing yes, but that's all it will be. I personally wouldn't really care too much if they killed it in the intended difficulty with the intended or around tuned ilvls, but yeah this, is just dumb. So if they had killed it in 25hc, I would have said awesome job, and well done (just to prove the point I'm not hating on Asia).

    And it's even dumber that blizzard allows this, it works in Asia so bring it to the West.
    And the West gets the patch 2 days earlier than Asia (it used to be a week head-start)
    And the Western top guilds already got advance fight experience in PTR test realms where Asian guilds do not.

    Does this mean all previous World-firsts do not count as well, because they were unfair to Asia ?

  10. #3470
    You have to understand that world-first cutting edge raiders, and people who follow said race, make up such a small % of the player base that they will never cater to a world first race. IIRC, they even have a stance as a company that they do not recognize world-first kills (though individuals within the company may chose to do so).

  11. #3471
    Brewmaster Otaka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by corebit View Post
    And the West gets the patch 2 days earlier than Asia (it used to be a week head-start)
    And the Western top guilds already got advance fight experience in PTR test realms where Asian guilds do not.

    Does this mean all previous World-firsts do not count as well, because they were unfair to Asia ?
    Asia has gotten legit world firsts before mop.

    They are superhuman anyway so its only fair to us that we get a headstart. :P

  12. #3472
    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzo View Post
    It's a shame the community and or Blizzard had to make things different across the world. They should release games and their expansions across the world at the exact same time with the exact same game. (No double lockouts, 4 upgrades, ect) This way, there would not be this derailing and blatant ignorance of the community on the meaning of WORLD first.

    Asia first, West first, East first, US first .. Damn. That doesn't even look appealing.

    World first looks appealing

    It's also a shame most of the old school top guilds have quit/disband/merged with other guilds. I'd like to see REAL global rankings.

    Maybe the next expansion will be different, but alas, I doubt it.
    Maybe I'm a heretic in this thread, but the fact of the matter is that World Firsts are a meta-game. WoW is designed for people to play for weeks, gear up progressively and eventually beat all the bosses. What WF guilds do is push themselves and the game far beyond reasonable limits for their own amusement. Consider for a moment the fact that although there are Realm First achievements, there is no World First one.

    So their design decisions have to cater to the majority of their players, not the tiny proportion of WF players (and all the people who like to spectate on it on forums etc). And they decided that the Asian market was so much different to the West that this was the right call. I don't know enough about it to comment personally.
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  13. #3473
    lol at ppl that think there is even a world first race. a race would suggest that every1 starts at an even playing field and with the same access to stuff and at the same time which in wow just isnt true. its kinda like the olympics. there is the summer olympics which is the US as they get shit earlier, then there is the winter olympics which is the EU as they get shit later, and then there is the special olympics(sorry if the disabled takes offense) which is the asians as they have entirely difference rules than the others. sure you can win gold in any of the olympics, but some1 who is competing in the summer olympics cant exactly compete in the winter olympics or special olympics as a marathon runner wont do very well in skiing, so the idea of a world first race is counterproductive, in reality, you can only really get US first, EU first(altho one can argue that if a EU guild kills a boss b4 a US guild then they would technically also get a US first) or asian first.

  14. #3474
    Quote Originally Posted by Jess Day View Post
    Well i did. And that means not everyone hated it. I'd gladly take double lockout. 10 normal/heroic, flex, 25 normal/heroic? Yes please.

    It's interesting to see you putting down blanket statements as bullshit and then coming up with your own.
    Clearly some people loved the 10/25 lockout situation. Because it's been 2 expansions now and they still won't shut up about it. Personally I found it a pain in the ass.

    I was sceptical about flexi and the need for a pug-accessible tier between LFR and NM, but since it came out I have to admit it makes sense, appeals to a definite group of people. Also I ran it in week 1 and it was a great experience.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tojara View Post
    Look Batman really isn't an accurate source by any means
    Quote Originally Posted by Hooked View Post
    It is a fact, not just something I made up.

  15. #3475
    I don't care Asian kill doesn't count. They have higher levels and can do 10 & 26. World first is still on.

  16. #3476
    Taking a look at Jhazrun's armory: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/characte...azrun/advanced

    It looks like he went to a full haste build. He had been running full crit up until Garrosh. Seems interesting.

  17. #3477
    Seriously, WORLD FIRST thing has been gone downhill since when.. firelands? World first isn't interesting anymore as it used to be...

  18. #3478
    Quote Originally Posted by almara2512 View Post
    lol at ppl that think there is even a world first race. a race would suggest that every1 starts at an even playing field and with the same access to stuff and at the same time which in wow just isnt true. its kinda like the olympics. there is the summer olympics which is the US as they get shit earlier, then there is the winter olympics which is the EU as they get shit later, and then there is the special olympics(sorry if the disabled takes offense) which is the asians as they have entirely difference rules than the others. sure you can win gold in any of the olympics, but some1 who is competing in the summer olympics cant exactly compete in the winter olympics or special olympics as a marathon runner wont do very well in skiing, so the idea of a world first race is counterproductive, in reality, you can only really get US first, EU first(altho one can argue that if a EU guild kills a boss b4 a US guild then they would technically also get a US first) or asian first.
    Exactly. It cannot be called a "race" because of the simple fact that EVERYTHING from patch-day release to PTR is handled differently for every region.

    Asian realms always got the short end of the stick in these kinds of races. They used to get the patch way after US/EU realms, and do not have PTR to practice all those boss fights beforehand like the US/EU guilds. The top Chinese guilds suffered the most during TBC and WotLK because those expansions were delayed (not really Blizzard's fault), so a ton of those guilds migrated to Taiwan realms but they had terrible ping, and for the most part remained uncompetitive while US/EU guilds nabbed those world firsts uncontested.

    If Blizzard were serious about world first races, they would have made everything the same.

  19. #3479
    Blah blah, cry more. Congrats to the Asians for world first. ilvl higher or not they downed it first. Big Congrats.

  20. #3480
    Didn't a mod order you people to stop talking about EU/US vs Asia?

    World first is a world first. Move on. Let's discuss who will get EU/US first instead.

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