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  1. #1

    Legendary Cloak and Meta Gem Underrated?

    I've been hopping around the hunter forums for the last couple weeks as I've decided to ditch the tanking world (druid) that I've lived in for the last 6 years and play a dps class.

    I keep seeing, over and over, hunters stating "the cloak is good, but it doesn't make THAT much of a difference." I don't have any kind of reference to look at for hunters, but my rogue friend's cloak (as assassination) is a solid 15% of their damage. Is the damage output less for hunters on the cloak?

    Tanks are quirky with vengeance and what not, but on my druid during ToT the moment I got the dps meta gem my damage went up by ~15k (pre-nerf).

    So, how are these items only getting "they're good, but not going to make a huge difference" type of response?

  2. #2
    On pure singletarget it does around 5% of my damage, but on bigger AoE fights (fallen protectors, galakras etc) it goes up a lot to around 10% or 15% even.
    When I upgraded my 535 timeless cloak to the 608 legendary I saw a major dps boost. I dont know how it compares to a 551 SoO cloak though.
    Last edited by nuclear898; 2013-11-23 at 01:43 PM.

  3. #3
    Brewmaster Marxman's Avatar
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    Meta gem and cloak combined are at least a 20% DPS increase. At times they can be as much as a 30% increase.

    Not sure why anyone would say they aren't a big deal.

  4. #4
    More than likely fall out from other classes and people think it translates across to hunters. Destro locks for example can use either gem as the legendary is either better or worse depending on your other stats.

  5. #5
    Stood in the Fire
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    If we're solely speaking of the buff, Flurry of Xuen, I'd say you have to be quite lucky to get it to cover 20% or even 15% of your damage.

    Mine consitently lies around 5%.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Marxman View Post
    Meta gem and cloak combined are at least a 20% DPS increase. At times they can be as much as a 30% increase.
    You're overestimating here. They're typically 10-13% combined gain on pure single target, and up to maybe 25% at most on heavy multi-target (typically closer to 20%). On straight-up sustained AoE, yes, the cloak can do more (especially with lucky procs), but you don't see that level of AoE in boss fights on a consistent basis.

  7. #7
    Stood in the Fire Conjor's Avatar
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    No one "seriously" talks about them because everyone and their grandma has them. I always think about this when someone talks about the Legendary quest line:



    The end game content was balanced around the expectation that everyone in the raid would have the cloaks and gems. So I would say that while you may be able to clear SoO on normal without the gems and cloaks, you'll be at a disadvantage for the cutting edge without them.
    Last edited by Conjor; 2013-11-23 at 06:18 PM.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    No one "seriously" talks about them because everyone and their grandma has them. I always think about this when someone talks about the Legendary quest line:



    The end game content was balanced around the expectation that everyone in the raid would have the cloaks and gems. So I would say that while you may be able to clear SoO on normal without the gems and cloaks, you'll be at a disadvantage for the cutting edge without them.
    You hit the nail on the head right there. The reason nobody talks about them is because it has become the standard to have them when actively raiding, hence why other things are more dominantly discussed on these boards.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    No one "seriously" talks about them because everyone and their grandma has them. I always think about this when someone talks about the Legendary quest line:

    The end game content was balanced around the expectation that everyone in the raid would have the cloaks and gems. So I would say that while you may be able to clear SoO on normal without the gems and cloaks, you'll be at a disadvantage for the cutting edge without them.
    Okay, but that doesn't really answer any question of mine.

  10. #10
    Stood in the Fire Conjor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystile View Post
    Okay, but that doesn't really answer any question of mine.
    Actually it does. The cloaks are "nice to have" and are clearly an upgrade. But you can even see from this thread that everyone has a different opinion on what they are worth and for the most part no one has seriously looked at the difference between, say, BiS with the cloak and BiS without the cloak because, well, everyone has them and that case rarely, if ever, has come up.

    RNG and player skill will be more of a factor then "this guy has a cloak and so he does 30% more damage then me".
    Last edited by Conjor; 2013-11-23 at 07:18 PM.

  11. #11
    The raw stats the cloak offers are already a big boost by itself and the proc is on average 4-8% of my single target dps ,when it comes to cleave/aoe fights the numbers can go up 20%(galakras).
    Now on the legendary gem,mine crits for more than 500k and its usualy like 3-6% of my dps.

    So to summ things up yes you can do competitive dps without them but together they boost your numbers for like 15%-25% so yes they are a huge diference

  12. #12
    The Lightbringer Tehterokkar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatao View Post
    The raw stats the cloak offers are already a big boost by itself and the proc is on average 4-8% of my single target dps ,when it comes to cleave/aoe fights the numbers can go up 20%(galakras).
    Now on the legendary gem,mine crits for more than 500k and its usualy like 3-6% of my dps.

    So to summ things up yes you can do competitive dps without them but together they boost your numbers for like 15%-25% so yes they are a huge diference
    How do you Hunters get to stay down full time?! I'm always chosen to kill the Tower Grunt and go up towers!!! ( qqq

  13. #13
    The Patient Kuul's Avatar
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    Every hunter who knew more than basics of his class realized meta gem by the time wasn't just a "slight update". If you've played in semi-hc guilds without gem or cloak when it it was relevant, there was no way you could of compete in DPS with others if they knew what they were doing and had even close similar gear. And being hunter from the start of MoP till 5.2 hotfixes wasn't easy, even BM was at the middleish when it came to damage done pretty much the first half of expansion.

    Hunter also scales nicely with the cloak because of the cloak benefitting from ranged attack power and having a stance which brings 25% more is nice.
    Last edited by Kuul; 2013-11-24 at 04:57 AM.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    How do you Hunters get to stay down full time?! I'm always chosen to kill the Tower Grunt and go up towers!!! ( qqq
    Hunters aoe and control is more valuable on the adds in my opinion(frost trap,md,binding shot)

  15. #15
    Legendary! Spl4sh3r's Avatar
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    Not sure about cloak but I know that the legendary gem is a 10k DPS increase over the regular agility meta.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Gatao View Post
    Hunters aoe and control is more valuable on the adds in my opinion(frost trap,md,binding shot)
    Not to mention Arcane Shot being one of the best abilities to pick off Banners/Totems.

  17. #17
    The Lightbringer Tehterokkar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gatao View Post
    Hunters aoe and control is more valuable on the adds in my opinion(frost trap,md,binding shot)
    What can Hunters do on the adds that other classes can't? Nothing. Other classes have CC too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Aertea View Post
    Not to mention Arcane Shot being one of the best abilities to pick off Banners/Totems.
    Arcane Shot has travel time, a melee will always be better.

  18. #18
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    Melee are facerolling bads who don't know how to right click things near them.

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    What can Hunters do on the adds that other classes can't? Nothing. Other classes have CC too.

    Arcane Shot has travel time, a melee will always be better.
    1.) Binding shot is simply the best ability in the game to stop the Bonecrushers. Not only does it stop the ability, it stuns them before they get too far out of range, reducing DPS time lost. Players could technically do this, but it requires damn fast reaction time and not being on the GCD when the charge happens.

    2) Try doing the fight as a melee. The totems and banners don't always drop in melee range, and it can be quite difficult to determine that range in a stack of nameplates. Travel time is next to nothing as there isn't a mechanic that prevents hunters from standing close enough to negate it.

  20. #20
    Blademaster Zaee's Avatar
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    Last i checked, hunters are the best dps for thok. Also they are the default conveyor belt class on siegecrafter as well

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