Thoughts on the new Warchief

[Deleted]

I just commented on some, the rest I agree with (not that there is anything to agree with as it's all in the lore)

Well, let's see, Thrall:
-Freed the Orcish people from the internment camps
-Reestablished the connection between the Orcs and the Elements, being one of the first "new" Orc Shamans in years
-Was Blackmoore's Best Fighter Irrelevant, who cares if he was Gladiator of the month?
-Recieved Warchief from Orgrim Doomhammer Irrelevant. Vol'Jin got his title from all Horde leaders so I don't see how this matters, unless you are a Doomhammer groupie
-Founded the "New" Horde Like I said before, it was more like Old Horde 2.0, Orc and their funny friends
-Promoted peace between the Horde and Alliance So did Vol'Jin
-Brought many races into the New Horde
-Fought in the Third War No idea really why Blizz left Vol'Jin at home here, but it is what happened
-Helped Sylvanas Reclaim Undercity Wasn't Vol'Jin the one directing the Horde artillery? Wasn't such a fancy role, sure, but he was there

Just a few examples.

Do notice though that, by design, Thrall was the focal point of the Horde perspective in both WC3 and WoW (lore wise, not in game) and Vol'Jin was originally designed as a supporting character for Thrall. It isn't strange they need to build him up now, if anything blame Blizz for not knowing Vol'Jin would eventually be made Warchief at the time they were making WC3.

[Kanogan]

It was an obvious choice since Vol'jin has been part of the Horde since it existed.
True, I was hoping for Sylvannas or someone else to make the story way more interesting, yet I believe Vol'jin was the right choice.

[Flaks]

oh the event where vol'jin waited 6 years to do anything about well his people were mind slaves on there island, yeah, that event.

I mean, if we're using the game's timeline to discredit a character, we can do the same for mr. go'el with how he let the Horde starve and Alliance encroach deeper into the Barrens under his leadership.

A lot of the game's timeline is up in there air. It's much more likely that Blizzard just flat out didn't care/didn't have time to work on Vol'jin during that period, and less so that he actually didn't do anything for 6 years.

[tinyninja]

heres the thing, Thrall helped the trolls survive when he rescued them. and when vol'jin made the rebellion Thrall joined him in it, he even rescued the darkspear from the kor'kohn before vol'jin even returned.

Now, after the rebellion, after vol'jin has commanded forces to attack orgrimmar, kill countless orcs, and take command of the horde, does vol'jin intend to help the orcs get on there feet, recover from this, after all he did to kill so many orcs.

If there was any care left in the story in regards to orcs, you would have orcs now saying how vol'jin is an orc killer, and why should they trust him after so much orc blood was spilled because of his actions, and vol'jin having to prove himself to the orcs for that reason.
Like I say, Thrall proved himself in coming to the orcs aid when it counted.

You know what else I thought thought.. as warchief, Vol'jin will be in command of all the horde, but he will also have to deal with everything within the horde, all factions, he will have to deal with blood elf problems, tauren problems, forsaken problems, goblin problems, and the orcs now, as well as his own people.
Do you really think vol'jin has the mantle to be able to handle all that?

- - - Updated - - -



so because you disagree with what we're saying and shouting about it, that means your right and we're wrong?

Any orc who would have problems with Vol'jin and the rest of the Horde killing Kor'kron during the Siege would be a hypocrite. You act as if they hadn't been persecuting, executing, imprisoning, and in some cases even torturing the other members of the Horde.

Orcs are the ones who have got to make it up to the Horde now, for fucking up AGAIN. Not all of them were crazy homicidal racists, we know, but there was a very large faction that supported Garrosh that needs to be looked out for.

- - - Updated - - -

you can't make that assumption until blizzard actually does something to show it. We are basing what we're saying on whats happening right now.

So why don't you just calm down until something actually happens? You can't tell me to make assumptions when you're doing the exact same thing. All they've done is made Vol'jin the warchief... THAT'S IT. That is literally all that has been changed so far, and yet you're acting like orcs have already been made into 3rd rate Horde citizens.

[Darkhallows]

- - - Updated - - -



so because you disagree with what we're saying and shouting about it, that means your right and we're wrong?

- - - Updated - - -



you can't make that assumption until blizzard actually does something to show it. We are basing what we're saying on whats happening right now.

I find it funny that you say that, and then make a ton of assumptions on how Vol'jin's character will play out. I'm not even sure why I'm discussing it here, because there's no pleasing vocal minorities.

But what I don't understand about you, Traask, is that you want Thrall. THRALL. To be Warchief again. First you complain about Garrosh, and now Vol'jin, but tell me why I as a long-time player of every single Warcraft game, should be interested in just having Thrall, and an Orc-lead Horde (they'll probably still get the spotlight, by the way, a troll-centered Horde is a baseless assumption being touted by naysayers) would be better?

Honestly, either you have very little experience writing, or you just don't care. Thrall just taking the seat again would just put the story back to pre-wrath in terms of politics. Now, at least, there's a different head there that isn't warmongery, and they might have plans we haven't seen for him. However, the small hate base tends to try to drown that out. That's not an assumption, it's just a hope, but who knows?

In addition, what good is Thrall's character now? He doesn't want to be Warchief and doesn't want to lead. He's done, for a while. That was established in Cata. Even HOPING for Thrall to take the seat was foolhardy with those facts. There's be alot more combining than there is now, if Thrall was Warchief again, I guarantee. This is based on the dislike of his "character" development in Cataclysm. Aggra is generally unpopular or people just don't give a shit, etc. (Don't believe it? I'll make a thread.)

I don't get it. Then again, maybe I can't hope for real answers from MMO Champ.

Proud member of the majority.

[Grocalis]

Do notice though that, by design, Thrall was the focal point of the Horde perspective in both WC3 and WoW (lore wise, not in game) and Vol'Jin was originally designed as a supporting character for Thrall. It isn't strange they need to build him up now, if anything blame Blizz for not knowing Vol'Jin would eventually be made Warchief at the time they were making WC3.

Exactly.

Thrall didn't just start out a "omg the best warchief ever!" He was the main character of a dead game (WarCraft Adventures), resurrected for a novel, and then thrust into WC3 already established as the Warchief. If you missed the novel you were probably wondering who the hell he was and why he was in charge riding on his wolf shooting lightning bolts at people. Thrall didn't start out epic, he had to grow into it.

It's interesting that some people here don't even want to give Vol'jin the chance. I guess being born a support character means you can never develop beyond that to some people.

[Flaks]

Holy hell, is 70% of MMO-Champion seriously Horde?!

[Zonas]

I like how up in arms some people are getting for the choice who is clearly most deserving of it... But you know... the upstart orc who did literally nothing until he became a war-mongering nutcase... yeah, no problem with him suddenly assuming the mantle of power...

We'll always remember all the dumbass did for us... like pissing and moaning during BC, gaining a misplaced sense of "honor" in wrath until Saurfang shut him up, then doing nothing at all...

But nah, logic and reason should be thrown out the window again for amazing drama. THrall should have just said fuck off to Varian and Pandarama and smashed Garrosh's skull in, then shout, "Next Warchief... well, screw you guys, 'cus I'm picking Hogger!" Que the massive explosion behind him and the gnoll flys into the room twirling sparklers while the trumpets sound...

[The Ogdru Jahad]

I don't know how anyone who truly likes the horde can be against Vol'jin as Warchief. The horde has evolved, it isn't just Orcs and a few subraces. The whole point of this story arc was to show that the races like trolls and bloodelves can make a difference. It only makes sense to show this new representation of the races by having a warchief that IS one of those races.

Garrosh's metal horde wasn't the kind of horde that would ever survive long term. Only a horde seeking peace (like one led by Vol'jin) will stand a chance in the way Thrall's did.

[Lavannah]

I don't know how anyone who truly likes the horde can be against Vol'jin as Warchief. The horde has evolved, it isn't just Orcs and a few subraces. The whole point of this story arc was to show that the races like trolls and bloodelves can make a difference. It only makes sense to show this new representation of the races by having a warchief that IS one of those races.

Garrosh's metal horde wasn't the kind of horde that would ever survive long term. Only a horde seeking peace (like one led by Vol'jin) will stand a chance in the way Thrall's did.

Yep, this exactly. If there's one thing Blizz had tried to do since Cata (with varying success rates) is move the world along. The revamp unfortunately didn't go as planned, and any and all continuation with story is going to cause breaks unless they use phasing. But they themselves have said the that world needs to move forward. Moving the story in the is direction does exactly that. The Horde is more than just Orcs now, and this change of race for Warchief reflects the character development of the HORDE.

[Deletedaccount1]

How could any of you honestly think it could be anyone else? He gets a brand new model and book written about him and you are honestly surprised?

[Deleted]

Garrosh's metal horde wasn't the kind of horde that would ever survive long term. Only a horde seeking peace (like one led by Vol'jin) will stand a chance in the way Thrall's did.

A sadly revealing statement about a story called WARCRAFT where war is actually foolish and detrimental.

I would rather have this setting adapt a Warhammer-like quality: if you stop fighting, you fucking die and that's it. The last thing I need is ham-fisted morality from a vidya game with sub-par writing.

[Lavannah]

How could any of you honestly think it could be anyone else? He gets a brand new model and book written about him and you are honestly surprised?

His model isn't 'brand new', just a modified form of the original, with the same limitations. They added a few more polygons to his cinematic version, but otherwise he's still got the same model. Brand new model goes to Thrall. Even Garrosh's was better in terms of definition and mobility.

The book wasn't anything amazing. I loved it, but there was nothing phenomenally developed or even hinted at the outcome of the Siege.

[Xecks]

lol so much hate for yalls wc . i love it.

[Omgarsh]

The main problem with Vol'jin is he has zero accomplishments in WC3, and not a lot in WOW overall until MOP. A lot like Lor'themar, but more history and he's one of the "main" horde races at least. But seriously all he ever did prior to WOW was be a plot device to turn Rexxar, Rokhan and Chen into spirit bats so they could fly in and infiltrate an area in the TFT Horde campaign. He has potential to be an awesome leader, but now they really have to force him on us. And that means all the Horde (and probably Alliance, since no doubt he will factor into many quests in the upcoming expansion) will be tired of him before they reach the next level cap.

MOP is such a shitty expansion though. Blizzard screwed over all their Horde players so they could tell a really shitty pro-Alliance story that doesn't even make Alliance players satisfied.

[Deleted]

I don't know how anyone who truly likes the horde can be against Vol'jin as Warchief. The horde has evolved, it isn't just Orcs and a few subraces. The whole point of this story arc was to show that the races like trolls and bloodelves can make a difference. It only makes sense to show this new representation of the races by having a warchief that IS one of those races.

Garrosh's metal horde wasn't the kind of horde that would ever survive long term. Only a horde seeking peace (like one led by Vol'jin) will stand a chance in the way Thrall's did.

Yeah lets start picking flowers and dance around a fire with the aliance.. That is exactly what we want in a WARcraft game..

All the horde's races are important but the orcs were always the figure head of our side.. Like humans are to the aliance.. Like some ppl said previously when you think of the rivalry between the factions you imidialy think of a orc and a human at battle.. Heck look at Mop's intro it had a orc and a human figthing not a bloody goblin and a dwarf.. And that is because thouse are the races that best represent both factions.. Can you imagine a troll and a human face to face representing both faction? It would look wrong..

The problem is how this concept was just trown to the garbage so sudently.. And how we have a leader that did NOTHING to justify the place he got.. If the horde rallied against garrosh it wasent because of voljin it was because of how garrosh acted..

Also despite what some ppl migth say the orcs are in their lowest since the new horde was made.. They are always the race that needs to be demonized.. And with a troll warchief rulling the horde they are going to just be underdogs from now on.. I mean do you think there will be orc grunts patrolling ogri now? Wouldnt make sense lorewise or a orc elite unit like the krokron? Nope..

[The Ogdru Jahad]

Yeah lets start picking flowers and dance around a fire with the aliance.. That is exactly what we want in a WARcraft game..

All the horde's races are important but the orcs were always the figure head of our side.. Like humans are to the aliance.. Like some ppl said previously when you think of the rivalry between the factions you imidialy think of a orc and a human at battle.. Heck look at Mop's intro it had a orc and a human figthing not a bloody goblin and a dwarf.. And that is because thouse are the races that best represent both factions.. Can you imagine a troll and a human face to face representing both faction? It would look wrong..

The problem is how this concept was just trown to the garbage so sudently.. And how we have a leader that did NOTHING to justify the place he got.. If the horde rallied against garrosh it wasent because of voljin it was because of how garrosh acted..

Also despite what some ppl migth say the orcs are in their lowest since the new horde was made.. They are always the race that needs to be demonized.. And with a troll warchief rulling the horde they are going to just be underdogs from now on.. I mean do you think there will be orc grunts patrolling ogri now? Wouldnt make sense lorewise or a orc elite unit like the krokron? Nope..

The political leader of a group doesn't need to racially represent the majority of his people. Obama is the president of the United States.

To be honest, only people who hate change will hate Vol'jin being warchief. Stories progress, characters rise and fall. You can't stick to principles established from the beginning and expect to get by without changing up the formula.

I understand people want war in WARcraft. But it's a common theme to have the two factions united to face a common evil, that will probably always be the way it is, because if lorewise any faction got a serious gameplay changing advantage, it wouldn't be fair.

[Daetola]

A sadly revealing statement about a story called WARCRAFT where war is actually foolish and detrimental.

I would rather have this setting adapt a Warhammer-like quality: if you stop fighting, you fucking die and that's it. The last thing I need is ham-fisted morality from a vidya game with sub-par writing.

A little off point, but I'd just like to say I don't understand why people associate the "War" in Warcraft meaning Alliance v Horde and only that. Don't we "war" with all sorts of baddies? The Legion, the Scourge, Deathwing, and now Garrosh and his false horde. Alliance and Horde can make peace, or at least a cease-fire, and we'll still maintain a war, just not with eachother; with all the rest of Warcraft universe.

[Deleted]

A little off point, but I'd just like to say I don't understand why people associate the "War" in Warcraft meaning Alliance v Horde and only that. Don't we "war" with all sorts of baddies? The Legion, the Scourge, Deathwing, and now Garrosh and his false horde. Alliance and Horde can make peace, or at least a cease-fire, and we'll still maintain a war, just not with eachother; with all the rest of Warcraft universe.

Then why a separation at all? Lets make a best buddys club and end the aliance and horde..

Warcarft was made with orcs and humans at war.. MoP was supposed to be all about it.. And to some extent it was.. So yes that is what the developers want aswell..

It's a good question to make to the devs in blizzcon.. Will the horde ever win a war? I mean wc1 and wc2 horde lost both wars.. And the Mop campaign was the 3 horde vs aliance war.. Sure garroshes horde was also facing a civil war but the horde in Wc1 and Wc2 also had his internal disputes and was still considered the horde as a whole.. So yeah its our 3 loss in wow historie..

[Deleted]

Vol'jin Warchief? The same guy that sat his lazy ass out due to "injuries" while I went on quests to obtain the Divine Bell and all this other shit while he sent mail: "I'll let you handle this one, II need me rest" Useless prick. If there's no glory given back to the Orcs that didn't blindly follow Garrosh then Alliance will be my faction of choice.

lvl 80 Thrall sent us to kill lvl 15 mobs in his basement.