Page 25 of 28 FirstFirst ...
15
23
24
25
26
27
... LastLast
  1. #481
    Pandaren Monk Adoxe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Temple of Karabor
    Posts
    1,989
    Quote Originally Posted by Kazlofski View Post
    Well Mione did 78 waves on endless and overall a great tank I think?
    And there is requirements all over the world so I don't see the problem.
    You want to get into a job? It has requirements like experience, degree etc etc.
    You want a decent raiding group to take you seriously and have the slightest impression before taking you in and wasting a spot for you instead of someone else that is good? Do that simple requirement, not a big deal.
    As much as people say it's pointless, I have seen myself a group in openraid HC ToT (Nerfed but still) , only requirement was gold proving grounds and bam not too bad 10/13 HC for a pug.
    It does at least a bit show minimal awareness, if you fail on bananas too much you get -75% hit chance and you won't kill stuff in time. If you get stunned too much in that amber, you won't kill stuff in time. Teaches the minimal stuff of moving at least a bit more from shit or kiting shit or switching priorities to that Banshee for example.
    Trinket/CoS/Icebound/etc the amber, keep the monkey CC'd or kill it and you don't have to avoid the bananas. Easy mode, still don't see how it will help anyone in a raiding environment.
    Formerly known as NonameXADX

    Thanks to Noxychu for the wonderful avatar!

  2. #482
    High Overlord KennyBoi3's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    167
    It's the guild's first experience. You will fail many times before you succeed. If you expected to get a full clear on your first try with 20+ strangers, be realistic. Especially if you are a casual raid guild that raids once a week. I've been in a couple of those and did that once myself. Guess what happened? Same thing. Don't be afraid to fail to the point where you need to create standards for entry.

  3. #483
    Seems it would be better to get prospective raiders together and complete challenge dungeons or even lower teir raids/flex raid. There is more variety to what may happen and they will need to work with a group. There is little or no need to have chemistry with a group of others in proving grounds but getting some together in dungeons/raid will better gauge their response when working with others.

  4. #484
    Quote Originally Posted by KennyBoi3 View Post
    It's the guild's first experience. You will fail many times before you succeed. If you expected to get a full clear on your first try with 20+ strangers, be realistic. Especially if you are a casual raid guild that raids once a week. I've been in a couple of those and did that once myself. Guess what happened? Same thing. Don't be afraid to fail to the point where you need to create standards for entry.
    Oh no, I didn't expect that. I did expect for us to not wipe as many times on Narushen because of people dying downstairs, though.

  5. #485
    The first time anyone in a guild "required" me to do anything I deemed unnecessary, I'd be gone before they could even complain I wasn't listening.

  6. #486
    Quote Originally Posted by Itisamuh View Post
    The first time anyone in a guild "required" me to do anything I deemed unnecessary, I'd be gone before they could even complain I wasn't listening.
    So you deem it unnecessary?

  7. #487
    Quote Originally Posted by Tankitbetter View Post
    The few people who haven't done it have usually said "I know what I'm doing wrong - I'm going to try x to fix it next time!" "Okay, finally got past the double healer wave - I repentance'd the 2nd healer and it worked great! I didn't realize the big sha required burst though, so I'm going to use my avenging wrath on him this time and I'll save my BOAK for the 10th wave where you told me another Sha was."

    It's been great for our guild.
    That's why I think your idea is great in your situation. And it is going to improve your raid a lot simply by the fact that several people realized that proper analysis of their mistakes will lead to improvement. That's a very useful thing to learn before start raiding.

    I would probably raise an eyebrow if my guild suddenly requests something like that, because we already are a raidgroup with members who should trust each other. But if your forming a new raid group at entry level (like stated in the first post) its better way than any "post a ui screenshot", "what's your ilvl", "post a lfr log" criteria.

  8. #488
    Quote Originally Posted by Cov View Post
    I would probably raise an eyebrow if my guild suddenly requests something like that, because we already are a raidgroup with members who should trust each other.
    even in a 10man, there's 90 different opinions of 'who's pulling their weight'. additional standards that need to be met can help defray some of the resentment that grows when people feel that they are working harder at their class then others are. it can also provide the raid & guildleader with a "neutral arbiter" to speak for them.

    i remember reading an anecdote about when damage meters were first introduced. there were 3 mages in the raid, two of them constantly belittling another one because he wasnt 'as good as they were'. once damage meters were used to track the raid, it became clear that the situation was the opposite, and they quickly shut their mouths.

  9. #489
    Quote Originally Posted by Halicia View Post
    even in a 10man, there's 90 different opinions of 'who's pulling their weight'. additional standards that need to be met can help defray some of the resentment that grows when people feel that they are working harder at their class then others are. it can also provide the raid & guildleader with a "neutral arbiter" to speak for them.

    i remember reading an anecdote about when damage meters were first introduced. there were 3 mages in the raid, two of them constantly belittling another one because he wasnt 'as good as they were'. once damage meters were used to track the raid, it became clear that the situation was the opposite, and they quickly shut their mouths.
    I would have loved to been there for that.

    So far, the experiment has worked for my guild. Wondering if other guilds have done similar things.

  10. #490
    Quote Originally Posted by Bloodydemize View Post
    i've done gold tank and dps as a dk tank (yes im a noob and did the dps one in tank gear because i have no dps gear ;_ but it's really easy, if people complain about doing an easy solo scenario that takes 10 minutes (literally) to get in a raiding guild, then just let them leave, they are A) not willing to put in work B) not listening to their guild or raid leader (whichever you are ) and C) if they honestly can't do gold .. they really shouldn't be raiding.. especially if you are looking for decent progression
    Id rather take a healer that prepares for raiding than a healer that optimize gear FOR PROVING GROUNDS and spend a day actually working on it(time that should probably be spent capping valor or doing timeless)

    ....I guess that's just me
    You cannot trust, nor take seriously, an adult male without facial hair.Boys have no facial hair and boys are not men.
    ╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻

  11. #491
    Quote Originally Posted by Tankitbetter View Post
    So you deem it unnecessary?
    Of course. I could almost understand wanting new players with no experience to do it, but not people who have been playing forever.

  12. #492
    This seems like a great idea, back when Brawlers guild came out. I felt that even that could be used as a great tool to judge new raiders, taking somebody who has beaten brawlers guild and gotten gold on proving grounds would make a much better recruit than somebody who didn't or can't.

  13. #493
    High Overlord
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Leeds, England.
    Posts
    114
    Not even doing Proving Grounds, yet i'm raiding.

  14. #494
    I think proving grounds is valuable to train and demonstrating understanding of SOME raiding concepts, but I don't think it is really important. The most important skill that 90% of the group can have is being able to follow instructions, and proving grounds does not teach that.

  15. #495
    In B4 the bleeding hearts at Blizz say "O Noes! Guilds using PG not for what is is intended for??? We better nerf it asap so people aren't sat for raids!"

  16. #496
    Quote Originally Posted by Inthislzon View Post
    That's not even close to true. If having SotR + guardian with SoI requires you to LoH then gold is impossible for everyone else. Guess what? It's not.

    The only wave of gold that needs some kind of CD is the start of round 10
    This is why I said the challenges don't prove anything for raiding. As some of them are skewed. Having to blow that many cooldowns in the tank one I don't think is intended since not all tank classes have as many tools. That's why I said things like the NPC not healing and dps more could cause issues for some, etc.

  17. #497
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucetia View Post
    This is why I said the challenges don't prove anything for raiding. As some of them are skewed. Having to blow that many cooldowns in the tank one I don't think is intended since not all tank classes have as many tools. That's why I said things like the NPC not healing and dps more could cause issues for some, etc.
    What he meant was probably that you were doing something else wrong, since other classes do not have that many cds yet survive just fine. Considering some people are getting to 100+ on Endless tank, I highly doubt Gold really requires all of your cooldowns to merely survive.

  18. #498
    Quote Originally Posted by Lucetia View Post
    This is why I said the challenges don't prove anything for raiding. As some of them are skewed. Having to blow that many cooldowns in the tank one I don't think is intended since not all tank classes have as many tools. That's why I said things like the NPC not healing and dps more could cause issues for some, etc.
    You're missing the point. Every tank class can do it. We've done it.

    It means you're making a mistake if you have to use those cooldowns at that time or that for your class that is the most dangerous part.

  19. #499
    Quote Originally Posted by Mionelol View Post
    What he meant was probably that you were doing something else wrong, since other classes do not have that many cds yet survive just fine.
    Quite possibly the case. The only thing that were up at the time was melee mobs. There was no fire caster, wind caster or anything that would've taken a lot of damage. Just the stacking bleed dot they do. Though as I mentioned before I only gave gold one attempt to see what it was like and could just be a case of really bad RNG. I'll have to toy around with it later this week. Would do it tonight, but I have a paper to write and I want to beat the Celestial Tournament before it resets.

  20. #500
    When it comes to the stacking dot, you're supposed to use an aoe CC ability (blinding light comes to mind for a paladin I guess) and cc/kite for a bit in order to reset the stacks.
    I didn't attempt it on live at all, but that's what I did on my PTR attempt and it went just smooth.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •