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  1. #201
    Conclusion:

    Content Blizzard creates is too hard for 90%+ of player base. Blizzard FAIL.

  2. #202
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    I can't imagine how a 'me-first' playerbase, filled with players who feel it's not their responsibility to help out other players, becomes surprised when they find out how many sub-par players are around.

    In short, if you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
    Once again....people tend to care more about you when you are in their guild as opposed to being a pug outside of guild or just another guy from open raid.

  3. #203
    Quote Originally Posted by melodramocracy View Post
    I can't imagine how a 'me-first' playerbase, filled with players who feel it's not their responsibility to help out other players, becomes surprised when they find out how many sub-par players are around.

    In short, if you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
    No, back when I started there were plenty of people who helped me. But I never felt like they should help me. Helping somebody should be spontanious when you feel like it, not expected because some people can't be fucked read tooltips.

    This is a game, you pay for YOUR OWN entertainment. Not for somebody else.

    Again, often I'm the first in line to help people. But it pisses me off when noobs feel entitled to assisstance. (noobs isn't meant in a bad way) Someone isn't a bad guy because he just wants to have fun playing his game without the hassle of a noob/new player.

    Quote Originally Posted by pallyopness View Post
    Once again....people tend to care more about you when you are in their guild as opposed to being a pug outside of guild or just another guy from open raid.
    Which isn't bad, if I had to help every new player out there who sucks in raids I'd be busy 24/7 and still not get shit done. If I have 3 hours of relaxtime in a night, I don't wanna spend 1/3 of my time helping somebody else.

  4. #204
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    Conclusion:

    Content Blizzard creates is too hard for 90%+ of player base. Blizzard FAIL.
    So wrong on so many levels.

  5. #205
    Quote Originally Posted by pallyopness View Post
    So wrong on so many levels.
    I don't think he was serious.

  6. #206
    Brewmaster Cherrypowdah's Avatar
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    wait, wtf, this is heroic lfr we're talking of, it's like, supereasy o_o

  7. #207
    The Patient nulir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cherrypowdah View Post
    wait, wtf, this is heroic lfr we're talking of, it's like, supereasy o_o
    Yeah but we're from Al'Akir so obviously it's easy for us.

    GL on world first as always Apex!

  8. #208
    They still dont teach entry level raiders anything. the "one difficulty" model was pretty tough and was a hell of a lot more rewarding to each player. if you pugged a guy that had been raiding a previous tier then he more than likely had the skills to do well in new content. todays crowd wants everything given to them. Flex ilv is about H tot right? that is a joke in itself. 4 difficulties now... this game is such a joke of its former self but then again in my "peak MMO raiding days" i am glad I got to experience WoW in its prime why anyone still plays this game seriously beats the hell out of me but i guess the "next gen gamers" that have taken over are the ones who shaped it into what it is today.
    "I'm Tru @ w/e I do" ~ TM

  9. #209
    Mechagnome Mear's Avatar
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    First week of flex have been a pain for me since 70 of the people in every pug seems to expect 1 shot everything and leaves after one wipe, so after wasting time finding a group and waiting the group to build up and clearing all the trash only to repeat that like 5 times. But like one hour ago I found a group of people who did not rage quit after 1 wipe so all bosses died withing 1-3 attempts.

  10. #210
    Quote Originally Posted by pallyopness View Post
    So wrong on so many levels.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarac View Post
    I don't think he was serious.
    I'm half serious. If Blizzard made the game stupid hard like, like Battletoads level of difficult, do you think the game will survive?

    Difficulty has to be at a reasonable level. Challenging but not so frustrating that the players just give up.

    Making the vast majority of the content too hard for 90% is not a good way to make a game. Fortunately, Blizzard isn't totally stupid. That's why we have LFR - which the elitist are trying to kill in their misguided attempt to "improve" the game.

  11. #211
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    I'm half serious. If Blizzard made the game stupid hard like, like Battletoads level of difficult, do you think the game will survive?

    Difficulty has to be at a reasonable level. Challenging but not so frustrating that the players just give up.

    Making the vast majority of the content too hard for 90% is not a good way to make a game. Fortunately, Blizzard isn't totally stupid. That's why we have LFR - which the elitist are trying to kill in their misguided attempt to "improve" the game.
    Neither LFR or Flex is ultimately too hard... people need to quit whining that they can't one shot bosses or it's too hard. That is the issue. Things take effort and time which many of the whiners I see refuse to give. It isn't even much time at that....In our flex we had a rogue in half blue pvp gear half green gear and we took him and still had 0 issues....

  12. #212
    Quote Originally Posted by pallyopness View Post
    Neither LFR or Flex is ultimately too hard... people need to quit whining that they can't one shot bosses or it's too hard. That is the issue. Things take effort and time which many of the whiners I see refuse to give. It isn't even much time at that....In our flex we had a rogue in half blue pvp gear half green gear and we took him and still had 0 issues....
    You tailor to game to the preferences of your players, not the other way around.

    Some want it easy, some want it difficult. That's why most games have difficulty levels.

  13. #213
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    I'm half serious. If Blizzard made the game stupid hard like, like Battletoads level of difficult, do you think the game will survive?
    What's wrong with Battletoads level of difficulty? We used to complete that game when we were kids...

    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    Difficulty has to be at a reasonable level. Challenging but not so frustrating that the players just give up.
    But difficulty IS at reasonable level. Some bosses at the start of MoP were too hard (Shekzeer HM, Amber shaper HM, Garalon on every difficulty), Blizz understood that and we now have no unbearable ubertight enrage timers. Bosses have mechanics that need to be adopted and learned. That mechanics are not to be ignored. Of course you'll have to wipe a couple of times on every boss until most people in your raid will learn what to do. It's not a Sims game, you know. A little effort from your side and you'll conquer everything. Its a computer game, you know, not a rocket science

    If that is hard for modern gamers - I feel ashamed for them, because there is nothing really hard in learning how not to fail in a computer game.

    Though I, by myself, prefer more enrage-based mechanics than reaction-based slasher-like action.

    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    Making the vast majority of the content too hard for 90% is not a good way to make a game. Fortunately, Blizzard isn't totally stupid. That's why we have LFR - which the elitist are trying to kill in their misguided attempt to "improve" the game.
    Elitists are not more true raiders than lfr crowd, to be honest. Top end raiders don't dive a damn about lfr existence.

  14. #214
    I feel that flex is overtuned for its audience - It will be easy for normal raiders but it isn't really viable for people used to LFR.

    Flex is like normals minus dps requirements, so if you fuck up mechanic you still die like normals so the truly casual people are not going to be happy with that, and it will only make lower leveled normal raiders switch to flex

  15. #215
    Quote Originally Posted by l33t View Post
    What's wrong with Battletoads level of difficulty? We used to complete that game when we were kids...



    But difficulty IS at reasonable level. Some bosses at the start of MoP were too hard (Shekzeer HM, Amber shaper HM, Garalon on every difficulty), Blizz understood that and we now have no unbearable ubertight enrage timers. Bosses have mechanics that need to be adopted and learned. That mechanics are not to be ignored. Of course you'll have to wipe a couple of times on every boss until most people in your raid will learn what to do. It's not a Sims game, you know. A little effort from your side and you'll conquer everything. Its a computer game, you know, not a rocket science

    If that is hard for modern gamers - I feel ashamed for them, because there is nothing really hard in learning how not to fail in a computer game.

    Though I, by myself, prefer more enrage-based mechanics than reaction-based slasher-like action.



    Elitists are not more true raiders than lfr crowd, to be honest. Top end raiders don't dive a damn about lfr existence.
    This is what happens when a game becomes too hard,



    This is in general is not what you want happen when you are trying to attract a huge player base.

  16. #216
    Herald of the Titans Anzaman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PrairieChicken View Post
    I feel that flex is overtuned for its audience - It will be easy for normal raiders but it isn't really viable for people used to LFR.
    As Looking For Raid -player, I'll comment on this.

    Today I managed to get myself a group from trade chat. We managed to defeat Immerseus on first try with no problems... on The Fallen Protectors we wiped few times due the fact we were still clueless "how exactly to defeat them" but eventually got them down. Then we continued our journey towards to next encounter, Norushen, and wiped on it because we hit enrage but got it down on second attempt.

    But Sha of Pride... we tried and tried but we just couldn't get him down, in the end our raid disbanded due frustration.
    Healer/Damage Dealer of SuN
    Highmaul: Normal 6/7, Heroic 1/7

  17. #217
    Quote Originally Posted by SodiumChloride View Post
    You tailor to game to the preferences of your players, not the other way around.

    Some want it easy, some want it difficult. That's why most games have difficulty levels.
    This game has multiple difficulty levels. Most of the content across the entirety of this game IS actually quite easy, as it's really nothing more than a matter of execution against repeatable, nearly 100% predictable boss behavior, and putting math in your favor as far as gear stats go.

    It is fairly interesting to see how things slowly evolve in the game, in response to the playerbase however. In Wrath, I recall Sindragosa being one of the first fights that really REALLY put a player at a disadvantage if he / she was a keyboard turner (assuming your raid followed a certain strat). In more recent tiers, that sort of movement capability is the rule, rather than the exception.
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion
    Plox. I got your plox right fucking here. - Animalhouse
    I still prefer seeing Thrall rather than blood in my urine, that doesnt make him a good character. - Verdugo

  18. #218
    510 is a fine ilvl for flex btw, u could even get away with 500 if u know ur class inside and out, but its more likely 510 will save u when u make a few mistakes.

    back to flex its a welcome addition to raiding, lfr only gives 528 gear anyway, which is much worse than 540 from flex.

  19. #219
    Scarab Lord Grubjuice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sarac View Post
    It's not other people job to teach or help new players, the majority of players (or humans in almost every situation in life) don't give a shit about anyone but themselves or people close to them. While I agree that inviting bad players is there own fault to some degree, kicking people is just as much part of being a good raidleader.

    A raidleader is there to guide you in big lines of what is going to happen soon, not to hold peoples hand and guide them every step of the way.

    But I agree with you, for different reasons.
    It is man's duty to man that we teach each other what we know.
    I would not want to live in a world where knowledge and experience is not freely shared in the spirit of friendship and brotherly-concern
    .


    When someone asks you if you're a god, YOU SAY 'YES'!

  20. #220
    Quote Originally Posted by PrairieChicken View Post
    I feel that flex is overtuned for its audience - It will be easy for normal raiders but it isn't really viable for people used to LFR.

    Flex is like normals minus dps requirements, so if you fuck up mechanic you still die like normals so the truly casual people are not going to be happy with that, and it will only make lower leveled normal raiders switch to flex
    It's far too early to make an assessment like this about the mode. It can, and will be, nerfed on its own just via folks gearing up in SoO LFR. Revisit it a month from now, after people have a bit more experience w/ the fights, and see if you still feel that it's too difficult.
    Benevolence is a luxury for the strong - Wrathion
    Plox. I got your plox right fucking here. - Animalhouse
    I still prefer seeing Thrall rather than blood in my urine, that doesnt make him a good character. - Verdugo

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