I have to admit there are tons more mechanics in MOP than previous expansions.
Easy to begin with, but gets harder
A comfortable difficulty all the way through.
Overtuned, too difficult. Needs nerfing.
I have to admit there are tons more mechanics in MOP than previous expansions.
It's the same level of difficulty Throne of Thunder was to be honest. Except it's probably more balanced in terms of progression. We might be a little more geared than usual at the beginning of a tier due to the cheap price of gear upgrades and thunderforged items.
Plus I'm pretty sure the bosses are not balanced for full raids of people with legendary cloaks, which are kind of very strong.
Hmm lets see, during last tiers world first race there were 5 bosses that took Method more than 2 hours to kill: Council of the Elders, Magaera, Durumu, Dark Animus and Lei Shen (not counting ra-den). This tier there are 6: Malkorok, Spoils of Pandaria, Thok and most likely Siegecrafter, Paragons of Klaxxi and Garrosh. So I think the latter half of the tier is tuned correctly. The only boss that I have a problem with in the first half of the raid is Norushen; you really shouldn't be able to zerg him without doing any of the challenges.
SoO is tuned around 530-540(entry level to level required to kill last boss)
I think the difficulty curve is better than ToT but there are still problems (12345678910 <<<<Brick wall<<<<<<11 12 13 14)
Immerseus: Kill boss, move a little, kill adds
Protectors: Kill boss, move a little, kill adds
Norushen: Gara'jal the Spiritbinder 2.0
Sha of Pride: I'll give the developers this one. I liked this fight.
Galakras: A combination of Razorscale and Horridon.
Iron Juggernaut: Kill boss, move a little
Kor'Kron Shaman: Kill boss, move a LOT
Malkorok: See above paragraph
Spoils: An original idea ill admit. Boring, though.
I can't comment on further bosses as im yet to see them for myself. But do you see my point? Siege is not only easy, but it's BORING. The learning curve my raid teams experiences at each new boss is significantly lower than that of other tiers. Why? Because we've seen it all before.
NightZero; Boss mechanics interest me a lot, hence the thread. If you honestly want me to come back to you with some original ideas I gladly will, I've got a whole notebook filled with unique and inventive boss mechanics I've made up myself. It's really not hard to come up with a new idea. If I can easily fill a notepad with original mechanics then a trained team of developers shouldn't be lazy.
Last edited by Obsolus; 2013-09-22 at 11:08 PM.
difficulty is fine, the end normals are suppose to be hard the early normals are suppose to be easy.
I find this raid really fun, so far best of the expact.
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My guild is a normal raiding guild. We're working on the 5th boss and even then, we only raid 5-6 hours a week. For us, anyways, it's getting tougher as we progress.
My guild raids 8 hours a week, and most of our raid was 545+ (want to say 4 of us were 550+), going into SoO. Based on that, I think normal is very well done. The fights were "easy" as we vastly out geared every encounter on heroic, but we did wipe if we tried to ignore mechanics (like normal bosses should do). The first bosses were noticeably easier than the later bosses, as they should be.
Compare it to ToT, where there were some block bosses much earlier in the instance (Horridon was apparently hell for lower level guilds) and you see why some people are clearing farther into SoO than they did ToT by this time. They just have a different difficulty curve this time.
I personally think they hit a near perfect difficulty curve for SoO (at least on normal, we didn't clear garrosh until this week do to losing two hours of raid time the first week so I haven't seen heroics yet sadly).
For comparison though, our group had 15 wipes on Malkorok, 12 on Spoils and 14 on Thok. We did have a very good setup though, so we could endure the first phase for quite a while, even in our 10man group. (At ~540 average ilvl if that matters)
Last edited by Megamisama; 2013-09-23 at 12:18 AM.
EU first PG wave 30, come at me bros.
I like the difficulty curve in Siege:
(rough personal approximation based on tuning/mechanics interaction, feel free to suggest different values):
Compare that to the tuning of normal ToT (until Horridon was nerfed into oblivion):
(once again, rough personal approximation)
There's a huge difference in the number of walls that a normal guild will face, Siege's progression feels more gradual while ToT's feels completely all over the place.
my guild killed 12/12 normals and 5/13 heroics last tier, and I'm sure it would have been more if we had not stuck in heroic Primordius (for people who haven't got the chance to try it, is a hardcore tank-check that requires perfect team playing). if we had focused on easier fights like Qon or Twins, now we could have higher item level to outgear SoO normals, but this isn't the case.
we finished the first four bosses in two days, then some people left our guild and server (traitors everywhere), but we killed galakras anyway. i'm finding the first half very affordable for casual guilds, but obviously you have to do the mechanics if you want to progress.
the fact that all bosses on Normal have certain difficulty for some people is the price we are paying to have LFR and now Flex. I remember before the "easy" raids were the 10-man. now 10 man's difficulty it's more or less similar to 25-man, and now its place has been replaced by LFR/flex. I think we shouldn't complain that the normal mode is too difficult, unless you want to convert the 10-man raids to the world boss style: bloodlust, cooldowns up, burst, gold, coin, f*ck more gold.
the reason why I'm playing this game is to kill bosses moving my ass from one side to another, giving the 200% with my shitty items and doing it better than people with higher item lvl than me. when a boss it's at 5% I hit the keyboard harder to kill it faster, and when he dies we shout a little bit in TeamSpeak. I think this is more funny than zerging boring bosses that doesn't do anything.
"When i am done with you, you won't trust your own mind."
The guild I raid with are 7/14 (with a 6% wipe on Nazgrim). We had a wall at the Dark Shaman. It took us about 25-30 attempts to do it. I like it, it's challenging, but not too hard where you have a feeling you will never kill anything.
I. Like. To. Kill. Things.
I'd say the start is a hell of a lot easier than ToT, but I'm also quite happy with that. Currently having some teething issues with DShaman tonight cos three melee - need to bench one I... guess /sigh @ melee hate.
It's certainly a great moral improvement over being stuck at Horridon for weeks in ToT, as we started raiding very late in T14 and couldn't brute force him, certainly not with 3 melee.
Got a bit of a rude shock with Noru zerk timer but was easily fixed in a few attempts with a bit of orb tweaking. Had some irritating wipes on Gala for an entire night as we mistakenly tried to 2 heal without heroic gear - switched to three heal it and one shot on the first pull... and now hit a wall at shaman with the adds + melee issues; every other boss has been extremely easy though. I much prefer the slow ramp up in difficulty for normal, over the brick wall of Horridon in ToT.
I do still wish it was more melee friendly but eh, that's never going to happen.
Last edited by Kaiarra; 2013-09-23 at 01:21 AM.
It is extremely easy to begin with. Around Nazgrim/Malkorok is starts to pick up a little bit in terms of coordination/difficulty.
But if youre a guild that cleared ToT without to much drama on normal SoO overall isnt going to offer you are huge brick wall.
I think the gradual difficulty curve this tier is MUCH better done.
I was a little scared at first, I remember clearing Dragon Soul first week with absolutely no drama at all and when we steam rolled the first half of SoO in the same fashion but it does pick up.