1. #1

    Switch to combat after getting AoC?

    Was wondering what people thought about switching to combat after getting AoC? Most fights seem to have a fair amount of cleave damage possibilities so far. Now my guild is only 6/14. We got Dark Shaman down to 19% last night and I got AoC earlier in the evening as well as Stonetoe's Tormented Treads (the boots aren't showing on my armory yet). My main hand weapon would have to be the normal mode fist weapon from twins last tier. Shadowcraft is showing this as higher dps than assassination I've read you're not supposed to compare combat to assassination with shadowcraft as its designed to compare within the same spec and just show you gearing differences.

    I tried combat last tier but it was just too spammy with my latency, 83ms, that i didn't pull very good numbers with it. Is it better this teir?

    So are you going with Combat once you get AoC or are you staying assassination?

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...moris/advanced

  2. #2
    As far as I know, AOC brings Combat up to the damage levels of Assassin, but it does not put it make it better. I think that, with AOC, they are more or less the same (perhaps Combat is very very very slightly better).

    PS sad that Combat needs a trinket with ridiculous EP value to do the same damage.

  3. #3
    Even after you get AoC, Combat still has its problems. Downtime hurts Combat significantly more than Assassination, for example.

  4. #4
    Once I get AoC, I'm still going to primarily be Assassination, BUT I will play Combat off-spec for Spoils, Sha, and Galakras. Those fights are very good for Combat (lots of cleave uptime) if you and your raid can play the fight correctly.

    Like other folks in the thread have already said, Combat gets punished significantly more than Assassination and Subtlety for lower downtime. While the basic Shadowcraft DPS sims show my DPS going up significantly, my instincts tell me that it won't really show on any fight where you can't sit on the boss 24/7.

    The only fights I can see Assassination losing out to Combat are Heroic Protectors (where adds won't die as fast), Sha of Pride, Galakras, Nazgrim (you might be able to get 2 sets of AR during Berserker), Thok, and Garrosh (if your guild has problems with Phase 1 adds).
    Carp - Illidan-US
    I wish I wish I was a fish.
    Rogue - Warlock

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Carp The Fish View Post
    Once I get AoC, I'm still going to primarily be Assassination, BUT I will play Combat off-spec for Spoils, Sha, and Galakras. Those fights are very good for Combat (lots of cleave uptime) if you and your raid can play the fight correctly.
    I don't think this will work out well. Combat requires vastly different gemming and reforging to be effective (NO red gems; orange in red slots, yellow in yellow all with haste). If you go into those fights with all the mastery that assassination stacks you're going to have a bad time with the new cost on SS. Bladeflurry isn't THAT crazy... multi-dotting with rupture is a very valid dps strategy for "cleave" if the adds don't die incredibly fast (like in heroic modes).

  6. #6
    With AoC it comes down to a lot of personal preference. Numbers should be close enough on most bosses with some beating others it'll boil down to what you enjoy the most. Combat isn't as spammy as it has been so it's a lot easier to play now.

  7. #7
    I would say combat is pretty poor without the trinket. With the trinket or without, it is much better to play.

  8. #8
    It's pretty slow and boring now. Those who like that playstyle already had one spec as an option. Now both are pretty much screwed.

    Ruthlessness interaction with Anticipation is pretty clunky at best, and the cooldowns barely feel like cooldowns. Energy regen during cleave is pretty painful and unenjoyable. They went from one end of the spectrum to the other. Remember how it felt beginning T14 with horrible gear and slow play? Yeah, welcome back to that.

    The damage output with AOC is fine though, fun notwithstanding.
    Last edited by Chult; 2013-09-19 at 01:47 AM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by zurm View Post
    I don't think this will work out well. Combat requires vastly different gemming and reforging to be effective (NO red gems; orange in red slots, yellow in yellow all with haste). If you go into those fights with all the mastery that assassination stacks you're going to have a bad time with the new cost on SS. Bladeflurry isn't THAT crazy... multi-dotting with rupture is a very valid dps strategy for "cleave" if the adds don't die incredibly fast (like in heroic modes).
    Going into fights like Galakras with Combat reforging, but Assassination gemming, isn't that big of a deal. You can still hit 300k on Galakras doing it this way. Could you hit 320k+ gemming correctly? Yeah, definitely. But it's not like you're going to be in the 180ks if you don't switch your gemming around.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Chult View Post
    It's pretty slow and boring now. Those who like that playstyle already had one spec as an option. Now both are pretty much screwed.

    Ruthlessness interaction with Anticipation is pretty clunky at best, and the cooldowns barely feel like cooldowns. Energy regen during cleave is pretty painful and unenjoyable. They went from one end of the spectrum to the other. Remember how it felt beginning T14 with horrible gear and slow play? Yeah, welcome back to that.

    The damage output with AOC is fine though, fun notwithstanding.
    Not sure how you are playing your rogue, but I have found that combat is the complete opposite of slow and boring. With AoC, my CDs are only on CD for maybe 20-30 seconds and even less for KS. I have found it extremely enjoyable so far and quite competitive with 300-320k on single target fights.

    Current setup:
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...osapien/simple

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Bromosapien View Post
    Not sure how you are playing your rogue, but I have found that combat is the complete opposite of slow and boring. With AoC, my CDs are only on CD for maybe 20-30 seconds and even less for KS. I have found it extremely enjoyable so far and quite competitive with 300-320k on single target fights.

    Current setup:
    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...osapien/simple
    I simply think the 50e SS is a little too heavy handed. 45e probably would have been the sweet spot as far as flow of play, if that's the route they were dead set on. Probably the 4pc nerf paired with the slightly slower play makes it seem overly so, having them happen all at once.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Chult View Post
    I simply think the 50e SS is a little too heavy handed. 45e probably would have been the sweet spot as far as flow of play, if that's the route they were dead set on. Probably the 4pc nerf paired with the slightly slower play makes it seem overly so, having them happen all at once.
    What Blizzard intended was to have most Rogues feel less punished for not being able to use every GCD during AR/SB. Personally, I didn't like play Combat in 5.3 and 5.2 because I felt like I wasn't doing as much damage as I possibly could.
    In 5.4, with about 14k Haste, I feel like I'm back to the Dragon Soul Combat rogue a bit more, where I felt fast during CDs, but not TOO fast.

    Combat does feel a little slow outside of CDs, I'll give you that. However, the trade-off is that you feel significantly more in-control.
    Carp - Illidan-US
    I wish I wish I was a fish.
    Rogue - Warlock

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