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  1. #1

    Splitting the Dark Shamans

    So we had a hell of a time on Dark Shamans this week. One I don't think will go away over next week. Is it possible to split the Shamans up, though obviously not to the extent people did it on the PTR, but still far enough away that their mechanics will rarely overlap? I saw a 10 man raid do it on Hardmode so I don't see why this would be an issue for us on 25 man normal. Still, I was curious if others had luck with a similar strategy.

    -Sadly I can't link the video in question since I'm a new poster-

    Since we only raid two days a week I'm willing to cheese a strategy for a while so we can get more serious attempts in at the later bosses.

  2. #2
    We 3 tank it on 10 man, with one tank on wavebinder and two on earthbreaker. It's hardly necessary but it does clean things up a bit. I stay on wavebinder with the tank and regularly clear out the oozes.
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  4. #4
    We use 2 tanks on 25. At 65% when the nature totem drops each tank pulls their shaman across the room. When they need to swap for the debuff they run across and switch on the run, so the shamans go back to their own side and the tanks switch positions.

  5. #5
    Grunt Shortys's Avatar
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    Splitting the two definitely reduces damage taken on the tank tanking Haromm, and makes the mechanics not as chaotic, but I'm sure it will take a bit to get the hang of. I'm not at this fight in normal yet, but we will probably be attempting it this way.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, I wanted to add, I imagine that this way it would be beneficial if you are melee heavy. For groups with mostly RDPS it might not make that great of a difference as far as DPS is concerned.

  6. #6
    Scarab Lord Viridiancity's Avatar
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    Any thought as to whether or not this strat will be broken? I recall something similar happened with Spellstealing the mobs before Gara'jal (unintended strat gave groups an edge), but the strat was broken and the fight nerfed.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by ViridianCC View Post
    Any thought as to whether or not this strat will be broken? I recall something similar happened with Spellstealing the mobs before Gara'jal (unintended strat gave groups an edge), but the strat was broken and the fight nerfed.
    It was possible to split the two up on the PTR and go to extreme distances apart. To counter that they sealed the door leading out of Org and put one up by the Cleft of Shadows and then added a tank debuff that requires the tanks to switch on Haromm. The strategy doesn't have any abuses in my mind, it's just adding an extra tank. Without further closing the room down there is really no way to break the strat except adding an enrage if they get too far apart. I don't see it being broken but I suppose we'll see.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by ipitydafool64 View Post
    It was possible to split the two up on the PTR and go to extreme distances apart. To counter that they sealed the door leading out of Org and put one up by the Cleft of Shadows and then added a tank debuff that requires the tanks to switch on Haromm. The strategy doesn't have any abuses in my mind, it's just adding an extra tank. Without further closing the room down there is really no way to break the strat except adding an enrage if they get too far apart. I don't see it being broken but I suppose we'll see.
    I tank Earthbreaker up the ramp, next to the closed door leading to the next boss. My co-tank tanks his mob where ever he wants, as long as it's away from this ramp. We're usually reaching the bottom of the ramp by the time the bosses die and neither group has to deal with the other boss' abilities.

    We have 2 tanks up the ramp, btw.

  9. #9
    we just group them up. its not too bad honestly, just have to move them around as a group a bit.

    the free cleave damage more than makes up for having to move around a bit.
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  10. #10
    I've been wondering about this. I read many ppl said split and 3 tank for 10N mode. But I didn't see if there is any specific reason for this? We 2 tank and drag them together for cleave, and as far as I can imagine it's easier for raid movement also this way. As for heroic I don't know.

  11. #11
    The Lightbringer Tehterokkar's Avatar
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    I hope it won't get nerfed. On 25m we have 1 Monk tank, 3 good AoE DPS(usually Hunter(me), Warlock and Ele Shaman) and a healer(Disc usually). We drag the female boss up the hill leading to Nazgrim and rest of raid + Male boss stays at the "intended" area with 2 Prot Palas taunting off each other.

    It's a good tactic and it would be nice if it wasn't nerfed. Otherwise the boss would become a total clusterfuck and melee would cry enough to cause a tidal flood. Literally every damn guild uses it. They should have fixed this in the PTR, but they didn't.

  12. #12
    Splitting the dark shamans is a fully viable, and probably the best, tactic. Both on normal and heroic. You can split them so much apart that neither group will be affected by the abilities from the shaman that is being tanked away. Thus melee can deal with iron tombs, foul stream, walls and the damage-debuff, and ranged can deal with tornados, adds, meteors and oneshot-debuffs.

  13. #13
    We drag the earthbreaker just inside a hut, and when the tanks switch we just move the earthbreaker to another hut. it keeps the raid on the move and away from tornadoes, it also keeps most of the ashen walls in or close to the huts, thus reducing the chance of a raid members getting 1 shot with the dot debuff + wall spawning on them.

    Downside is melee have to be on their toes for ooze spawning.

    also a good idea to keep the raiding behind the tanks, as in standing where the tank was before he moved, this keeps most of the abilities from spawning where the tank needs to go, and keeps them from getting boxed in, after all dps can run 50 yards around to avoid encounter mechanics where tanks can't

  14. #14
    The only problem my group had (10) is that these bastards keep resetting. Any ideas what might be causing this? (so we save ~1h we wasted on stupid resets this week)

  15. #15
    On normal Splitting is not necessary and might even complicate the fight.

    On heroic a debuff is added that deals 100 % hp. So splitting and avoiding double debuffs removes rng.
    They do not have a challenging enrage so we 3 tank 3 healed it. But the solo healer will have a very hard time and will be carrying your raid!

    We had a paladin doing it and we had to use every cds the three of us had.

    Dark shamans so far might be the hardest of the first 9.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Tkain View Post
    On normal Splitting is not necessary and might even complicate the fight.

    On heroic a debuff is added that deals 100 % hp. So splitting and avoiding double debuffs removes rng.
    They do not have a challenging enrage so we 3 tank 3 healed it. But the solo healer will have a very hard time and will be carrying your raid!

    We had a paladin doing it and we had to use every cds the three of us had.

    Dark shamans so far might be the hardest of the first 9.
    yea double debuff as in poison dot+iron prison (thats what he meant not 2 iron prison :P)

    the shaman your raid takes does iron prison mechanic (100% physical damage after 1min) and no its not rng it will always put the debuff on 2 of your dps/healers

    and solo healing side is actually really easy until sub 25% since poison storm is avoidable and ash metor you can rotate cd with and iron prison is easy to shield through as disc

    so splitting the boss actually makes the boss easier but healer who is healing two tanks might have some spiky damage coming out later on the fight with high poison dot ticking
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  17. #17
    Dreadlord
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    I can only speak for 10 man, but we always kept them together. Melees loved us for that and in return the boss drops quicker. the only two abilities which ma cause slight problems are the walls and the oozes. Whirwind and that comet are easily danced around by dragging the bosses a bit further. You have AGES to get out of the cometzone and the tornados are rather slow. For the oozes, we just made the tank run into a side ally and bind them on him. Range DDs would stun and bomb them in no time. They do net even look at our melees. Warriors are great for that thanks to shockwave. And the Ashen Wall is a joke if the tank of Haromm reacts quickly and gets his ass to the next wall. Ashenwall will spawn somewhere, where it doesn´t bother anyone.

    just make your tanks deactivate all dbm messenges, which are irrelevant to them and make them being vocal when to kite further and how far. Use raidmarks if needed. If the blubbs eat the melees or the wall seperates the raid from each other, the tanks fucked up.
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  18. #18
    Field Marshal Nitefyr's Avatar
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    If you watch Method's mage, vykina, they kept one in the throne room an the other outside.
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  19. #19
    Field Marshal Muk's Avatar
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    It is still possible to split them up so far that you're able to essentially divide the encounter in half. Treat the encounter like Heroic Morchok and you shouldn't have any problems. This applies to both normal and heroic difficulties.

  20. #20
    Whats the enrage timer on heroic ? 3 tanks and 3 heal seen like a lot of wasted DPS for a 10 man. I hate it that 25s can simply switch 1 DPS for a tank and everything is fine for then and 10s have to sacrifice 17% of theyre total DPS to add a new tank and another 17% for a healer...
    Last edited by DakonBlackblade; 2013-09-22 at 05:24 AM.

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