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  1. #61
    MM (if brought to SV / BM level) has few aces up in the sleeve. I guess self-healing could be quite potent on Malrokok (or however is called that oversized orc) while Conc Barage could be very helpful where you need a lot of adds control (Tears of Vale, Galakras, Dark Shaman, Nazgrim, Spoils, Paragons). In fact, MM on Dark Shaman could be a game changer.
    Only question is - how is MM doing on the field (compared to sims)? Also, MM has "hard" madatory glyph (of Aimed Shot) and AoC reduces CD on SS which is... Well, beyond idiotic.
    Also, is Harkom's Talisman proccing off Wild Quiver or not?

    And at what stage is MM taking over? I'm guessing high crit chance (and high uptime on Piercing Armor) are also the reason we see MM so close / on pair / taking over.

  2. #62
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    full ptr cycle passed , players made alot of suggestions -nothing happened , 2 weeks after patch goes live - random numbers nerfs/buffs
    ladies and gentlemans - blizzard at its finest ^^

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesftw View Post
    full ptr cycle passed , players made alot of suggestions -nothing happened , 2 weeks after patch goes live - random numbers nerfs/buffs
    ladies and gentlemans - blizzard at its finest ^^
    Well in their defensive, hunters are very strong at this stage. With nerfs to UVLS and demo/affi and some rogues nerf, I can even see us on the top of food chain (ofc, scalling might tip the favor towards other classes).
    Also, considering mechanics on fight, I would say we are to some degree very compelling options to have us in the raid. Not to mention with Binding Shot -> lol sucker sucker tried to charge.

  4. #64
    Well, from their (and other classes) point of view, they're not "buffing hunters" really as BM was top spec except on a few fights. It has more to do with making all 3 specs roughly equal.

    Interestingly this might also "solve" our scaling problem.

    As many had already surmised, it was looking likely that SV would have been our top spec once we got 4pc bonus even before this buff. With that in mind, this buff might keep us competitive for longer (i.e. until 6.0), making up for our poor secondary stat scaling.

    Of course if this was early in an expansion, further scaling would bring us crashing back down the charts but towards the end and with a sort-of-revamp inbound, it might be enough to see us safely into port as a competitive dps class once more.

    I do think this buff is somewhat rushed though, probably because it is looking likely that some guilds will be finishing the tier in the next reset and Blizz didn't want to be guilty once again of buffing a class after progress is over, not that it was ever likely for 99% of us to be the case

  5. #65
    buffs are welcome but i'm more happy about warlock and rogue nerfs, this should reduce the gap between top dps and us

  6. #66
    Quote Originally Posted by Tehterokkar View Post
    Uhh... wat... Survival is the smoothest spec out of the 3 by far.

    Also can we end the discussion about T60 Talents for BM, DB is by far the best choice. ToTH has no chance as BM since BM has a 50% reduction for 2pc value compared to SV. AND DB scales with Mastery.
    But it isn't. Refreshing Blk Arrow makes the spec very awkward to me. BM, your only "save focus for this" ability is Kill Command, otherwise you're dumping/filling with Arcane and Cobra. That would be akin to losing Blk Arrow and just having Explosive. So, that's why it's clunky. BM doesn't have 2 major focus dumps, and when both that AND Blk Arrow are off CD, I'm the guy who doesn't have enough focus to pop both. In MY opinion, it's clunky. In YOUR opinion, it isn't. *thumbs up*

  7. #67
    I gotta agree Surv is silky smooth compared to BM and if you don't have enough focus for your main shots then you need to plan a head better

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by Bluesftw View Post
    full ptr cycle passed , players made alot of suggestions -nothing happened , 2 weeks after patch goes live - random numbers nerfs/buffs
    ladies and gentlemans - blizzard at its finest ^^
    Typical WoW player at its finest. ^

    You have no idea how much discussion went on about hunters between Blizzard employees, nor ALL of their reasons for implementing (or not implementing) the changes that they did.

    It's pretty arrogant and short-sighted to accuse their changes of being random from the limited vantage point you're at. Try giving them the benefit of the doubt once in a while.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by zenyatta View Post
    But it isn't. Refreshing Blk Arrow makes the spec very awkward to me. BM, your only "save focus for this" ability is Kill Command, otherwise you're dumping/filling with Arcane and Cobra. That would be akin to losing Blk Arrow and just having Explosive. So, that's why it's clunky. BM doesn't have 2 major focus dumps, and when both that AND Blk Arrow are off CD, I'm the guy who doesn't have enough focus to pop both. In MY opinion, it's clunky. In YOUR opinion, it isn't. *thumbs up*
    Having to refresh a dot doesn't make a spec clunky. If you are having issues with maintaining enough focus to cast expl shot and hit black arrow on cooldown, don't blame the spec. It's your fault for not thinking slightly ahead and pooling a little bit of focus before black arrow comes off cooldown. BM has a smooth playstyle, but the pet pathing bugs make the spec clunky due to how heavily BM relies on the pet.

  10. #70
    High Overlord Solarflair's Avatar
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    Simming lower results with ToTH and the T16 2pc. One would believe more ArS would increase our DPS but it doesn't seem like ToTH is worth it single target MM over Dire Beast. Is anyone else seeing this?

    #TeamHunter

  11. #71
    Quote Originally Posted by Solarflair View Post
    Simming lower results with ToTH and the T16 2pc. One would believe more ArS would increase our DPS but it doesn't seem like ToTH is worth it single target MM over Dire Beast. Is anyone else seeing this?
    Marksman sims the highest when you remove arcane shot from the rotation and set aimed shot to always be the focus dump anyway.

  12. #72
    High Overlord Solarflair's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jubb View Post
    Marksman sims the highest when you remove arcane shot from the rotation and set aimed shot to always be the focus dump anyway.
    Is this reflective of live output as well? Haven't seriously played MM since T11/T12.

    #TeamHunter

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    You have no idea how much discussion went on about hunters between Blizzard employees, nor ALL of their reasons for implementing (or not implementing) the changes that they did.
    I'm sure you won't mind posting pictures of your Blizzard/Activision keyfobs and ID card with identifying info blacked out.

    Since you seem to know enough of went on to tell other that they do not and all that...

  14. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by Solarflair View Post
    Is this reflective of live output as well? Haven't seriously played MM since T11/T12.
    It's been like that since the latest aimed shot buffs.

  15. #75
    Quote Originally Posted by bewsh View Post
    I'm sure you won't mind posting pictures of your Blizzard/Activision keyfobs and ID card with identifying info blacked out.

    Since you seem to know enough of went on to tell other that they do not and all that...
    No one has to BE a Blizzard employee to know that the average player knows less about game changes than the average employee. You can't possibly lack that much common sense...

  16. #76
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    No one has to BE a Blizzard employee to know that the average player knows less about game changes than the average employee. You can't possibly lack that much common sense...
    Incorrect.

    While we players may not know as much as the developers we often know far more than the support staff which make up the "average employee." Same is true for any large tech company.

    They intentionally keep employees in the dark regarding a lot of things to prevent leaks of info, especially with regard to services that may never be implemented outside of an internal alpha.

  17. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly View Post
    Incorrect.
    While we players may not know as much as the developers we often know far more than the support staff which make up the "average employee." Same is true for any large tech company.
    And average hunter's move-of-the-day is when he turns off growl in instanced environment. Your point?
    "Average employee" doesn't do class balance.

  18. #78
    Quote Originally Posted by Shelly View Post
    Incorrect.

    While we players may not know as much as the developers we often know far more than the support staff which make up the "average employee." Same is true for any large tech company.

    They intentionally keep employees in the dark regarding a lot of things to prevent leaks of info, especially with regard to services that may never be implemented outside of an internal alpha.
    I would assume that it's understood that I was referring to developers when I spoke of Blizzard employees that make game changes. Obviously the support staff doesn't.

  19. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Tsoni View Post
    And average hunter's move-of-the-day is when he turns off growl in instanced environment. Your point?
    "Average employee" doesn't do class balance.
    And the "average player" is not actively discussing class balance on forums. The "average" person (player/employee) isn't relevant to this discussion on either side of the fence.

  20. #80
    Quote Originally Posted by Solarflair View Post
    Is this reflective of live output as well? Haven't seriously played MM since T11/T12.
    It probably will be at this point very much a 'your mileage may vary' situation. With my gear, that includes the Harrom (sp) trinket, Aimed only or an Aimed/Arcane mix sim out about even (w/ in less than 1% of each other). If I set my gear level out higher, particularly my weapon, the Aimed-only wins out, as our weapon damage is looking like it will scale incredibly well this tier. It's also why Powershot and even Barrage sim out ahead of Glaive Toss with a heroic weapon, given they scale off weapon damage as well.

    Between the Multistrike procs on the Aimed hits and how hard Aimed is hitting in general, it probably wins out even though Arcane might reduce the Rapid Fire cooldown a little faster. I'm actually surprised they didn't increase the cooldown reduction of Aimed on the 2-pc, given it's cast time vs. Arcane.

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