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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    *DISCLAIMER* These numbers are based on MY GEAR and MY OWN PROFILES. If I see one comment along the lines of "I don't get these same numbers", I'll sick my pet on you.
    best post ever ! made my day xD
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by Naftc View Post
    Hunters are the cheapest class in game and when played right are more deadly than a train plowing through a field of bunnies covered in napalm.
    Scrimjaw - Hunter - Blackmoore (EU)

  2. #102
    Stood in the Fire Conjor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    Take these with a gain of salt...



    *DISCLAIMER* These numbers are based on MY GEAR and MY OWN PROFILES. If I see one comment along the lines of "I don't get these same numbers", I'll sick my pet on you.
    In before EVERYONE switches to MM. For those who don't feel like looking at my gear setup, just keep in mind that in order to get my MM ranks that high I had to stack as much crit and haste I could, and I also have a heroic 2/2 wep (which MM scales RIDICULOUSLY well with wep damage).

    The only thing ANYONE should take from my numbers is that all of our specs are VERY, VERY, VERY close. THe only thing that will differentiate the specs at this point is your gear setup and reforging. Other than that, just play whatever you want.

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    The only thing ANYONE should take from my numbers is that all of our specs are VERY, VERY, VERY close. THe only thing that will differentiate the specs at this point is your gear setup and reforging. Other than that, just play whatever you want.
    "Ability to play the spec" - Some people are naturally better at a spec because of the play style involved. I see a lot of, "SimC says one thing, I tried it and was worse at it."



    *Edit* - At work and can't really access armory/SimC. How much haste are you running with in the MM setup?
    Last edited by Drairon; 2013-09-25 at 03:19 PM.

  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    The only thing ANYONE should take from my numbers is that all of our specs are VERY, VERY, VERY close. THe only thing that will differentiate the specs at this point is your gear setup and reforging. Other than that, just play whatever you want.
    Blizzard deserves big props for this.
    Honestly, I'm not sure why it's proven so hard for them to get DPS specs balanced but I'm glad it's finally happening.
    Next step: balance the classes this well.

  5. #105
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    And you just did exactly what he did - wrongful assumption and accusation. I've been playing since Vanilla, and I've seen all the "band-aid" fixes and "shit at the end of a patch" situations you seem to be so upset about.

    ALL I was saying was that accusing Blizzard of making "random", uneducated changes is presumptuous and ignorant due simply to the fact that 1) He is not a developer himself, 2) He therefore has no knowledge of what went into their considerations as far as numbers go. A lack of understanding on your own part doesn't mean that someone else didn't have a good reason for what they did. It's common sense.

    I seem to be speaking another language in proposing that we treat Blizzard developers with respect and give them the same benefit of the doubt as we would give to someone who maintains a guide or simulation tool on these very forums.
    Lol so you are saying to give blizzard a chance? Like any respectful business or person in fact they should learn from history. You know past events that had bad out comes? 10 years this has been going on without any fix (the are just now getting close) to our scalding and not listening to experienced hunters on PTR. All they need to do is fix our scaling which I hope they do for the next expansion.

    I highly doubt you have played the hunter class since vanilla. If you have the you must be a casual player. Again you should get your facts about history on hunter buffs and nerfs before talking. Or you might just be arguing to argue. Who knows.

    A good example of your beloved blizzard on how they operate is when GC wrote a blue post about haste affecting cobra shot and steady shot and that it should be a nice dps boost. The fact was that this change was already in the game for like a month. It was quickly addressed and they buffed something else like hawk instead. It's crap like that that has always happened to Hunters.
    Last edited by Slot; 2013-09-25 at 03:39 PM.

  6. #106
    Stood in the Fire Conjor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Drairon View Post
    "Ability to play the spec" - Some people are naturally better at a spec because of the play style involved. I see a lot of, "SimC says one thing, I tried it and was worse at it."



    *Edit* - At work and can't really access armory/SimC. How much haste are you running with in the MM setup?
    13k crit, 13.9k haste, 6.2k mastery (worst stat). But it really is the WDPS that carries it.
    Last edited by Conjor; 2013-09-26 at 02:06 AM.

  7. #107
    Quote Originally Posted by Slot View Post
    Lol so you are saying to give blizzard a chance?

    I highly doubt you have played the hunter class since vanilla. If you have the you must be a casual player. Again you should get your facts about history on hunter buffs and nerfs before talking. Or you might just be arguing to argue. Who knows.
    Well, here's my achievement list showing that I killed Onyxia at level 60, obtained Aquial Quintessence, and fished up the boss in classic ZG, if this really matters that much to you:

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...achievement#81

    Not that it really proves anything in the conversation, but... what facts am I claiming that aren't straight? What history on buffs or nerfs did I misstate that I so desperately need correction for? You're pretty clearly not even reading what I'm saying. My initial comment wasn't even directed at you or anything you said, and you've stepped in to bat and be the irrelevant hero. This conversation isn't really helping the thread in any way, so if there's something actually related to what I'm saying that you'd like to discuss, feel free. Otherwise, let's just agree to disagree before someone ends up infracted over nothing.

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    Well, here's my achievement list showing that I killed Onyxia at level 60, obtained Aquial Quintessence, and fished up the boss in classic ZG, if this really matters that much to you:

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...achievement#81

    Not that it really proves anything in the conversation

    Just to clear up some facts about Achievements. They weren't introduced untill WoLk.

    The Onyxia achievement states - "Killed the Level 60 Version of Onyxia". You could of been level 80 in Wrath, killed it and got the achievement.(Before they changed her to level 80.)<-- What I did..

  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Drairon View Post
    Just to clear up some facts about Achievements. They weren't introduced untill WoLk.

    The Onyxia achievement states - "Killed the Level 60 Version of Onyxia". You could of been level 80 in Wrath, killed it and got the achievement.(Before they changed her to level 80.)<-- What I did..
    Hah, good point. Ah well... I was just feeding a troll anyway.

  10. #110
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    Hah, good point. Ah well... I was just feeding a troll anyway.
    Feeding a troll? No I'm clearing up that your hard head can't wrap around the fact that history proves itself and does not lie. Linking achieves lawls that is more "troll" like then giving a good argument which you have yet to do.

  11. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    In before EVERYONE switches to MM. For those who don't feel like looking at my gear setup, just keep in mind that in order to get my MM ranks that high I had to stack as much crit and haste I could, and I also have a heroic 2/2 wep (which MM scales RIDICULOUSLY well with wep damage).

    The only thing ANYONE should take from my numbers is that all of our specs are VERY, VERY, VERY close. THe only thing that will differentiate the specs at this point is your gear setup and reforging. Other than that, just play whatever you want.
    Good job Conjor, now everyone is going to go MM =/

  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    Take these with a gain of salt...

    *DISCLAIMER* These numbers are based on MY GEAR and MY OWN PROFILES. If I see one comment along the lines of "I don't get these same numbers", I'll sick my pet on you.
    Would you be so kind to put Barrage / Powershot in mix? I just want to see how are they comparing to each other (no need to iterate on lower talents tiers).

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by Sre View Post
    Good job Conjor, now everyone is going to go MM =/
    That's not a bad thing! The more people that are playing and figuring the spec out, the more likely it is that we'll find the best combinations of stats and talents for each encounter.

  14. #114
    Stood in the Fire Conjor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tsoni View Post
    Would you be so kind to put Barrage / Powershot in mix? I just want to see how are they comparing to each other (no need to iterate on lower talents tiers).
    Barrage and Power Shot are situational abilities at best. They shouldn't really be used in a single-target patchwerk fight. I can only realistically see Power Shot being used for one fight this tier. And even that is a stretch. And Barrage always has its uses on AoE style fights.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    Well, here's my achievement list showing that I killed Onyxia at level 60, obtained Aquial Quintessence, and fished up the boss in classic ZG, if this really matters that much to you:

    http://us.battle.net/wow/en/characte...achievement#81
    Proves absolutely nothing, considering achievements weren't around until Wrath. My Ony achievement is up the day they came out, yours is like two months after, and I only started early BC.

  16. #116
    Quote Originally Posted by Hayro1 View Post
    Proves absolutely nothing, considering achievements weren't around until Wrath. My Ony achievement is up the day they came out, yours is like two months after, and I only started early BC.
    Did you read what I said immediately after that?

    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue
    Not that it really proves anything...

  17. #117
    Quote Originally Posted by Conjor View Post
    Barrage and Power Shot are situational abilities at best. They shouldn't really be used in a single-target patchwerk fight. I can only realistically see Power Shot being used for one fight this tier. And even that is a stretch. And Barrage always has its uses on AoE style fights.
    But both scale with weapon damage, unlike glaive toss... wouldn't that make them better the better weapon we have, due to scaling?

  18. #118
    I tried a mix of MM and SV last night up to Blackfuse. Comparing how I did this week to how I did last week (with only 1 piece of gear [making 2pc] separating them), I found that MM is quite viable on single-target, though I don't think I'd play it on any AoE fight if I could avoid it (MAYBE Garrosh, and only because he resets to 100%). I think that, for most people, your skill with each spec will decide which spec is best for you for single-target. For AoE, I don't think MM can compete with BM/SV.

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by Skygoneblue View Post
    He therefore has no knowledge of what went into their considerations as far as numbers go.
    Not knowing how the developers failed at class balance/design does not preclude one from criticizing them for that failure and telling them to shape up. Especially when they're getting paid and we're reaping the in-game consequences of their continued failures.

    If you give me $5 and ask for change, and I give you only $4 in singles back, you don't know exactly how or why I reasoned that $4 was the appropriate amount (in my mind) to return to you, but you know you were shorted. But please, if that situation becomes reality, please give me "the benefit of the doubt" and let me keep that dollar!

  20. #120
    Stood in the Fire Conjor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarBringerPT View Post
    But both scale with weapon damage, unlike glaive toss... wouldn't that make them better the better weapon we have, due to scaling?
    Only if you consider it within a closed system. Increasing your WDPS will affect Power Shot and Barrage, and do nothing for Glaive Toss. But if you can find an example where when getting a new Wep you don't also increase your AP (which Glaive Toss scales with), then then you may see the growth you suggest.

    This is also why I think MM won't really stay that strong once you get up into the higher gear levels. MM relies heavily on WDPS, and is the primary reason why my sims show it so high. Once I get more agility gear, and the other stats start rolling, the other specs should catch up very quickly.

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