WoW players have FEELINGS!!!

[Ronduwil]

Your example is nothing like what the OP stated. Its not equivalent, and not comparable.

It was exactly like the OP stated. In my example the hypothetical "helper" was calling someone fat and comparing them to a really fat person. In the OP's example he was calling someone bad and comparing their DPS to the tank's. How are you expecting for the person being "helped" to feel? "Gee, thanks for all the disrespect! What's next? Maybe you can follow up with some other insults... won't that be fun?!?"

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

It was exactly like the OP stated. In my example the hypothetical "helper" was calling someone fat and comparing them to a really fat person. In the OP's example he was calling someone bad and comparing their DPS to the tank's. How are you expecting for the person being "helped" to feel? "Gee, thanks for all the disrespect! What's next? Maybe you can follow up with some other insults... won't that be fun?!?"

No, this is wrong. There would be literally no reason to give a fat person tips to lose weight unless asked. It wouldn't benefit the OP at all. I also doubt losing weight is something the OP is really good at doing.

IN LFR on the other hand, if you are a warlock, and you see a fellow warlock seemingly struggling.. especially after a wipe... there is nothing wrong at all with trying to help out. Your examples aren't comparable. Helping out a player in LFR would benefit the whole group, and its also considered nice to help others in video games.

He actually didn't call the other lock bad. He simply stated his dps was lower than the tanks. Unless he wrote "you are bad" (Which he didn't) or something equivalent, you are both putting words in the OPs mouth and spreading slander against him.

JUst because an overly sensitive person would make that connection, doesn't mean the OP was calling him bad. A mature and warranted reply would be "Hey, that'd be great" or "No thanks, I'm trying my own plan, and have been getting better" or "Hey man, that isn't nice, I swear I'm trying!"

[Deleted]

No, this is wrong. There would be literally no reason to give a fat person tips to lose weight unless asked. It wouldn't benefit the OP at all. I also doubt losing weight is something the OP is really good at doing.

IN LFR on the other hand, if you are a warlock, and you see a fellow warlock seemingly struggling.. especially after a wipe... there is nothing wrong at all with trying to help out. Your examples aren't comparable. Helping out a player in LFR would benefit the whole group, and its also considered nice to help others in video games.

He actually didn't call the other lock bad. He simply stated his dps was lower than the tanks. Unless he wrote "you are bad" (Which he didn't) or something equivalent, you are both putting words in the OPs mouth and spreading slander against him.

JUst because an overly sensitive person would make that connection, doesn't mean the OP was calling him bad. A mature and warranted reply would be "Hey, that'd be great" or "No thanks, I'm trying my own plan, and have been getting better" or "Hey man, that isn't nice, I swear I'm trying!"

"Hey, I can see you're driving a volvo, if you want I can give you some tips on how to get a BMW"?

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

"Hey, I can see you're driving a volvo, if you want I can give you some tips on how to get a BMW"?

More like "Hey, I saw your tires blow out, you can get really cheap replacements at XYZ, they are having a sale!"

Or

"Hey we are in the same weight watchers class, here is a great recipe for some low fat, sugar free cheesecake!"

[Louis CK]

I also doubt losing weight is something the OP is really good at doing.

I literally laughed out loud at work...

[Deleted]

It's not a thing common to WoW. Another popular example of this happening would be a woman out with her child and she disciplines it in one way and a fellow mother recommends doing something else and the first exclaims "Don't you tell me how to raise my children!".

Some people don't like being told that what they're doing is wrong, others can take criticism easily which makes it very hard to help some of the worse players improve and become better players.

[alexanderh1014]

It's simple ... .there are people who thinks about themselves and then if you are lucky he is not a high power level ... there are people who wants to help others.. mostly in raids... I fear there are a lot of "people only thinking about themselves" and then just kick you because you did something wrong by that person... or maybe more persons....

[Deleted]

Yeah his reply was uncalled for, a simple "No thank you" would have sufficed. That said, you could have started the conversation better, if at all.

If someone would have started talking to me like I'd probably have thought he was being snarky and blatantly insulted me. Not many people would appreciate a stranger insulting them. It's one of the downsides of chat, you miss like 75% of the intention of the person talking to you. Also, taking criticism is very hard. Even more so when it comes from a complete strangers.

When I LFR I always try to give it my best, but I also have my off-nights. That's what I miss in this discussion, empathy.
God knows what the dude had on his mind. Maybe he just got dumped and tried to get his mind of things by doing a raid, I imagine my dps would be down the drain if was preoccupied like that. Let alone I would want to deal with some wiseguy telling me what to do. I'm not saying it's an excuse to fuck about, I'm saying you should never assume his dps sucks because he's a bad player. Never assume you know what's going on at the other end of the conversation.

My adage in LFR is; as long as we kill stuff and don't wipe I don't care. Life is to short to worry about afkers, trolls, tourists and people who are simply still learning. LFR is easy enough so 20% of the people can fuck about for all I care.
Although lately I've started asking if anyone needs a hand with tactics before a boss fight (especially SoO) lots of people don't know what to do, but are afraid to ask in fear of having there heads chewed off (which would probably happen). By asking in general I give them an opportunity to get help (in /w for all I care) without drawing too much attention to themselves. Works pretty well tbh.

Parting words, I applaud you for trying to help out though. If you're intentions were sincere you deserve a fucking medal imo!

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

I literally laughed out loud at work...

Lol for the record I wasn't calling him fat, just saying its unlikely he is a personal trainer or something.

[Louis CK]

Lol for the record I wasn't calling him fat, just saying its unlikely he is a personal trainer or something.

Haha, I know, and I think that's what made it so funny.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

It's not a thing common to WoW. Another popular example of this happening would be a woman out with her child and she disciplines it in one way and a fellow mother recommends doing something else and the first exclaims "Don't you tell me how to raise my children!".

Some people don't like being told that what they're doing is wrong, others can take criticism easily which makes it very hard to help some of the worse players improve and become better players.

Advice/help/criticism used to be a big part of the game. It was for me at least. Somewhere in there, the community, or parts of it degraded into thinking their shit don't stink, they are too good, and too entitled to being subject to such things as help, or criticism. I guess because they can easily get buy without working very hard, and barely even getting close to their toons potential.

When I started it was very common to ask/give help in this game.

[Deleted]

Advice/help/criticism used to be a big part of the game. It was for me at least. Somewhere in there, the community, or parts of it degraded into thinking their shit don't stink, they are too good, and too entitled to being subject to such things as help, or criticism. I guess because they can easily get buy without working very hard, and barely even getting close to their toons potential.

When I started it was very common to ask/give help in this game.

It was when I started. I knew very little, a quick question in general chat always yielded answers. Now when I ask something I either get "Let me google that for you" or a sarcastic answer.

[Louis CK]

Advice/help/criticism used to be a big part of the game. It was for me at least. Somewhere in there, the community, or parts of it degraded into thinking their shit don't stink, they are too good, and too entitled to being subject to such things as help, or criticism. I guess because they can easily get buy without working very hard, and barely even getting close to their toons potential.

When I started it was very common to ask/give help in this game.

Personally speaking, I love learning. I love improving and finding new ways to do what I do better.

With that said, I play at a level that is above the majority of those I meet (BECAUSE of all I've learned, the people I've talked to, the studying I've done, and the fire I've put myself in, no pun intended, in raiding environments), and if you have some advice for me, you better damn well know your shit or I'm going to tear you apart for your bullshit playstyle. However, if I come across someone who is doing it better than I am (which is very rare, since most are in very good guilds and don't play in the average world of raiding), I will pick their brain and find out every little detail of what I can improve upon.

I take great pride in what I do, and with great pride takes the ability to be teachable and know when you've encountered someone better than you and learn from them.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

Personally speaking, I love learning. I love improving and finding new ways to do what I do better.

With that said, I play at a level that is above the majority of those I meet (BECAUSE of all I've learned, the people I've talked to, the studying I've done, and the fire I've put myself in, no pun intended, in raiding environments), and if you have some advice for me, you better damn well know your shit or I'm going to tear you apart for your bullshit playstyle. However, if I come across someone who is doing it better than I am (which is very rare, since most are in very good guilds and don't play in the average world of raiding), I will pick their brain and find out every little detail of what I can improve upon.

I take great pride in what I do, and with great pride takes the ability to be teachable and know when you've encountered someone better than you and learn from them.

Lmao thats the way I am. I like to think I used to be good. But I've fallen in to that trap. You can see/do/get everything now with minimal effort. I'm probably very rusty at WoW nowadays.

[saucywench]

Why because it is a fact? If the guy does less damage than the tank and someone offers advice they can take or leave it, but to answer in such a manner shows that such people are not worth the hassle at all. I use this approach quite often at work and it usually turns out rather well,for example I told several people they were doing things far too complicated and showed them how they could finish their work a lot faster, they were rather grateful, but a few times people reacted in a similar fashion like the guy the op described, but most of the time they were unable to remain for long because they wouldn't heed advice from anyone and continued to make mistakes or were too slow, sometimes someone came asking a month or two later and then I wouldn't help, as such they get usually booted and I am never sad to see someone like that go. People who can't take help that is offered in a rather neutral way, don't deserve help at all.

You can still help or offer help to someone without coming across as rude and arrogant, its called having social skills.

[Loxops]

It's different because your voice does not go into what you're typing.

Don't do anything, it's not a good feel when you're taking the blow from their reaction.

[Combatbutler]

You can still help or offer help to someone without coming across as rude and arrogant, its called having social skills.

What the op wrote, can make someone feel insulted, though it is not clear whether it is one or not, answering with something like fuck off, simply shows his lack of willingness to even give the other person the benefit of the doubt. So it is best to ignore such players in general. I for one don't help people anymore, unless they ask really nice, as Lemonpartyfan said in the past it was common to do things like this, but at some point people became incredibly sensitive and considered almost anything an insult.

[Self Inflicted Wounds]

You can still help or offer help to someone without coming across as rude and arrogant, its called having social skills.

Rudeness and arrogance are subjective. If the other warlock wasn't a defensive whiner, he could have gotten some free, easy insight and help from a better warlock.

[saucywench]

Personally speaking, I love learning. I love improving and finding new ways to do what I do better.

With that said, I play at a level that is above the majority of those I meet (BECAUSE of all I've learned, the people I've talked to, the studying I've done, and the fire I've put myself in, no pun intended, in raiding environments), and if you have some advice for me, you better damn well know your shit or I'm going to tear you apart for your bullshit playstyle. However, if I come across someone who is doing it better than I am (which is very rare, since most are in very good guilds and don't play in the average world of raiding), I will pick their brain and find out every little detail of what I can improve upon.

I take great pride in what I do, and with great pride takes the ability to be teachable and know when you've encountered someone better than you and learn from them.

The issue was how the OP "offered" said help. Theres a difference between "hey you suck but I deem you worthy of receiving my knowledge" AND "hey do you have any questions maybe we can compare our rotations". People are more willing to learn if you use a little tact and respect.

[Louis CK]

Lmao thats the way I am. I like to think I used to be good. But I've fallen in to that trap. You can see/do/get everything now with minimal effort. I'm probably very rusty at WoW nowadays.

This entire past year has been pretty rough on me schedule-wise and finding enough time to raid as I used to (long story). It sucks, because after finishing clearing H DS a few times I got accepted into a really good guild, and had to stop playing before I could even join. Since then my life's been kind of a blur and I've only been able to do LFR/Normals here and there with an occasional HM kill due to the whirlwind this year has been. I'm getting settled again now, and as soon as I get another solid computer, I plan to join a guild again and get back into HM's.

The entire point of what I said above is this: Regardless of the fact that I haven't been in a solid raiding guild in almost a year and regardless of the fact that I haven't gotten to do much of any HM content in MoP, it doesn't change the way I play.

I still flask, pre-pot, pot, food buff etc. no matter if it's a 5 man, an LFR or a real raid. I just enjoy pushing myself and squeezing every ounce out of what I do. Some see it as unnecessary, and it is, but if you got it, why not use it...

As of right now, I've been out completely for the last 3 months, but having been able to sub back this week, I'm working on making up for lost time gear-wise, I'm going to work on my cloak, and I figure by the time I get a computer good enough to really raid again, I'll be in a position to join a solid guild again and do what I love doing.

I guess the point is, a solid guild will get me farther in my desired goals as far as progression, but not having a solid guild doesn't change the fact that I'm fucking good at what I do. And I know there are others out there who are great players, but for one reason or another just can't be a part of a solid guild right now, and it doesn't make them bad players or "casuals" (as if it's a 4 letter word), it just means that they won't be progressing as far as they could on a team, but they're still just as skilled.


Now I'm just getting way off topic. Sorry mods.

- - - Updated - - -

The issue was how the OP "offered" said help. Theres a difference between "hey you suck but I deem you worthy of receiving my knowledge" AND "hey do you have any questions maybe we can compare our rotations". People are more willing to learn if you use a little tact and respect.

I was responding personally to Lemonparty, not necessarily referencing the OP, and my apologies for going off topic. Been in this thread for a few days now, lol.

OT: You'll notice, if you page through some of this long ass thread, that I agree with you 100% and have made many posts in support of this view.