Thread: Combat vs Assa

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  1. #1
    Blademaster
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    Combat vs Assa

    Quick simple question.

    Combat with heroic soo weapons, no Aoc, or assassination with normal weapons?

  2. #2
    Just messing around but going combat without any set pieces just higher iLv normal stuff a flex mace over a normal ToT dagger and no AoC combat seems to be on par with assassination and then better in cleave situations. I can only imagine combat being a lot better with an AoC with much more time in CDs.

  3. #3
    The Lightbringer Nalira's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warstar View Post
    Just messing around but going combat without any set pieces just higher iLv normal stuff a flex mace over a normal ToT dagger and no AoC combat seems to be on par with assassination and then better in cleave situations. I can only imagine combat being a lot better with an AoC with much more time in CDs.
    Exactly this. I had the same experience. The Assa nerf was just about enough to put the other 2 speccs without AoC at par with it . Right now I'm just so happy to play Subtlety again.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheWindWalker View Post
    Knowing Celestalon, he both A) doesn't know and B) will nerf the spec until he figures it out while denying it ever happened.
    "Mastery Haste will fix it."

  4. #4
    People often seems to forget the significant DPS increase Assa get during executes and how important those are.

  5. #5
    Assassination. It's also a stupid easy spec to play and really forgiving of mistakes.

    I'd be happy if they buffed Evis by 5% and added a function that allowed it to refresh SnD.. *drool*

  6. #6
    I'd sim both of them. Your exact character has a decent amount to add to the situation. *likely* the result will either be assassination for single target/execute and combat for cleave, or "just go combat". Missing AoC is huge, but so are heroic weapons.

  7. #7
    The Lightbringer Nalira's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dryaan View Post
    People often seems to forget the significant DPS increase Assa get during executes and how important those are.
    Assa stays boring. Since my rogue is only my alt.. I'll roll with an evenly competitve specc that is at least fun to play

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Dextar View Post
    Assassination. It's also a stupid easy spec to play and really forgiving of mistakes.

    I'd be happy if they buffed Evis by 5% and added a function that allowed it to refresh SnD.. *drool*
    Very OP. And an awesome QOL change. But not gonna happen. And it would make Sub alot easier and therefore more boring
    Last edited by Nalira; 2013-09-30 at 02:24 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by TheWindWalker View Post
    Knowing Celestalon, he both A) doesn't know and B) will nerf the spec until he figures it out while denying it ever happened.
    "Mastery Haste will fix it."

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Talyria View Post
    Assa stays boring. Since my rogue is only my alt.. I'll roll with an evenly competitve specc that is at least fun to play

    - - - Updated - - -



    Very OP. And an awesome QOL change. But not gonna happen. And it would make Sub alot easier and therefore more boring
    Can you imagine just the refreshing of SnD like Envenom? Yeah, I'd love that.

  9. #9
    I've been saying it since the sin nerf, combat will be the best spec this tier, but it's going to require you to get AoC.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Talyria View Post
    Assa stays boring. Since my rogue is only my alt.. I'll roll with an evenly competitve specc that is at least fun to play

    - - - Updated - - -


    I'm realy realy new to rogue spec. I was a healer for 6+ years and now i decided to go dps and gone rogue for some mobility and survival awesomeness. I've tried a few dps/hybrid classes but they were all boring.

    I realize that rogues are on top 5 of dps for most fights (on part with other classes ofc, but mostly on top 5-10) and i realize that combat is better in cleave fights, assassination in single target (even tough combat is closing the gap fast), but my main issue is that while i'm leveling (nearly level 60 now), assassination is 100000% more fun than combat. I just love everything about assasination, combat seems like a 3 button spec with 3/4 of it being SS spam.


    I'm realy disheartened to see so many people saying that Assassination is realy boring. I find it extremely well built with the poison energy regen, with proc-based finishers >35%, etc. Compared to combat i find it realy fun, but i read a lot of people saying combat is more "complex" and fun and assassination is boring and easy, breaks my heart.


    I think i'll try to raid @ 90 with Assassination to check it out first ofc. I'm just worried about fights with 2-3 mobs. Most guides state that you should roll rupture 3CP on ALL mobs, others state that just on one mob and fan of knives, it gets a little confusing but whatever i'll figure it out later i guess....


    Anynways my question is : how bad is assassination 2-3 mobs fights compared to combat rogue? i mean 10% less ? 20% 50% to the point my guild will mock me for my dps in trash fights or 2-3 mobs fights? I realy like Assassination so far :\
    Last edited by knightpt; 2013-09-30 at 01:08 PM.

  11. #11
    Simple answer:

    If you have (i) a slow main hand that does the same or more damage than your best dagger and (ii) (unless the difference between your best weapon is about 20 ilvls) Assurance of Consequence, play Combat, otherwise Assassination.

    Some other factors may come into it such as which spec you prefer to play or whether you want Sub as an off spec, although the above is the usual answer.

  12. #12
    Moderator Kerdoz's Avatar
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    I find Assa to be the most boring specc I have played on any character so therefore I will always go combat even if it is the worst specc in the game.

  13. #13
    So, does Sub work with a slow offhand at all? I never really played sub, but if you could get your hands on a slow weapon and dagger I know that Combat works fine with a dagger OH, how about the opposite for sub? Would make it easier to switch specs, as they gem almost identically.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Kulestu View Post
    So, does Sub work with a slow offhand at all? I never really played sub, but if you could get your hands on a slow weapon and dagger I know that Combat works fine with a dagger OH, how about the opposite for sub? Would make it easier to switch specs, as they gem almost identically.
    I suppose what you lose is poison applications, so I guess it depends on how large a portion of your DPS DP is (minus the DOT component).
    Checking Shadowcraft, autoattack is about 40k and DP instant poison is 15k.. so it´ll depend on how much less DP instant will be, and how much more auto attacks will be.
    Just trying out replacing my OH dagger with a slow OH, I need to step it up significantly in iLvl before it stops being a loss.
    But, replacing it with a equal iLvl slow weapon, for me, is only about a 2k loss or so, on 174k.. so you can probably get away with it.

  15. #15
    My understanding is that poison application is normalized, so it'll proc more often with slower weapons.

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Kulestu View Post
    My understanding is that poison application is normalized, so it'll proc more often with slower weapons.
    Maybe, but Deadly Instant Poison drops from 15k to 13k pretty consistently between daggers and slow OHs, cant say exactly why though, I just assumed it was the speed.

  17. #17
    The Lightbringer Nalira's Avatar
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    Do you actually still play Combat with Rupture? Or am I outdated? (Having not played Combat since early T14 NHC)
    Quote Originally Posted by TheWindWalker View Post
    Knowing Celestalon, he both A) doesn't know and B) will nerf the spec until he figures it out while denying it ever happened.
    "Mastery Haste will fix it."

  18. #18
    i cant stand playing combat, so hoping assa will beat combat even with the stupid trinket, every expansion you kinda feel forced to go combat, i'd like the other specs to atcually be better for once, cause if combat does the highst single target dps the others are inferior due to combat having cleave, it should come at a price, combat should be slightly below other specs in single target

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Talyria View Post
    Do you actually still play Combat with Rupture? Or am I outdated? (Having not played Combat since early T14 NHC)
    Depends. If you use it right, it's a very small DPS gain, so anyone min/maxing will use it, but if you mess it up even a little it's a DPS hit. Don't ever refresh it while it's still active (sin refreshes at 2 seconds remaining). When I play Combat, I use it when I'm about to lose uptime on the boss, so it can tick away, or I have increased agility from trinkets/synapse springs.

    That was before 5.4, though, and I think evis got nerfed, right? So when I get my trinket and go back to Combat, I'll probably worry about keeping it up more often. However, if you're finding that it's complicated, it's still almost entirely negligible on the damage meters.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by Kulestu View Post
    Depends. If you use it right, it's a very small DPS gain, so anyone min/maxing will use it, but if you mess it up even a little it's a DPS hit. Don't ever refresh it while it's still active (sin refreshes at 2 seconds remaining). When I play Combat, I use it when I'm about to lose uptime on the boss, so it can tick away, or I have increased agility from trinkets/synapse springs.

    That was before 5.4, though, and I think evis got nerfed, right? So when I get my trinket and go back to Combat, I'll probably worry about keeping it up more often. However, if you're finding that it's complicated, it's still almost entirely negligible on the damage meters.
    I'm pretty sure that assassination is refreshing rupture < 2 sec because it just rolls the last tick, and therefore combat has that possibility too. And having a rupture ticking away or doing an eviscerate and then not having any damage on the boss, if they were the same damage, wouldn't really change anything. Same for trinket procs.
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